Posts for Slowking


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MoronicTAS wrote:
omg thanks, it actually works! but everytime I do a foreward backflip, Link moves slightly to the left every time. Can I change that? I actually changed the angle 14 14 to -14 -14, 14 -14 or -14 14, but it's not working. Is it possible to change that? well, I think I have to figure that out at my own :D
There should be a way. Grunz flips to the right here: http://youtu.be/L1RrLvJ4qsA?t=33m8s Probably has something to do with the camera angle.
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MoronicTAS wrote:
what does 14 14 mean? (rest is understandable)
Analog stick values. Actually these might be a little different in OoT. Those work in MM. Basically it's ESS-position. Actually this might not work in OoT at all. ^^" Never tried, since it has no use in OoT. But I think it should. Just experiment a little with it.
and another question, I can only do gainers with the adult link, if I want to them with child link they never work. Do I have to do it different?
They should work with both. No idea what the problem is.
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MrGrunz wrote:
Ok, this definitely starts to get insane xD
I'm pretty sure it's just oblivionwalker arguing with himself with another account. He's mainly a troll. We should just ignore it. While I have you here. I have a few questions ;p - Based on my crappy TAS, do you think it's possible to make it to the deku palace on 1st cycle night 3 before midnight, while still getting magic and visiting milk road? I don't think so, but would like an expert opinion. - How exactly do you instant backwalk? I can't quite get it to work. - Is there a faster way to stop a backwalk than letting go of Z and pressing the opposite direction for 3 input frames? - Angle changes during sidehop (by letting go of Z a certain number of frames)... Can you control the angle by what you press on the analog stick, or is it always the same, depending on how long you let go of Z? - Could you throw the Memory Adresses you know for MM my way? I probably can't use MHS adresses in bizhawk directly, but knowing which type a value is and where it roughly is in RAM should help. Thanks, big strong man. ;)
hegyak wrote:
Is the new TAS going to be a Any%? I am still waiting calmly for a 100% TAS. I saw this NWBN Skip. I think it used pause buffering. The song was played for the woman while Link was near the cave entrance to Zora Hall. After the song was played, pause was pushed a lot and Link was moved back into Zora Hall and when he came back out, the Great Turtle was there and the cut scene was skipped. I figured I should share this.
You should probably just assume that we know about tricks that are used in the current any% RTA WR. ;)
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Don't listen to oblvionwalker, he has no idea what he's talking about. Basically GlitchesAndStuff is up against the edge of the grave with ISG activated, which makes the game act like he is up against a wall. A wall or something compareable is necessary for a gainer. If you don't have a wall you can use a foreward backflip: frame1: 14 14, frame2: Z + down, frame 3: Z + up + A But remember, you can't grab ledges in OoT out of flips and sidehops.
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shredwot wrote:
I'm assuming the 100 rupee in the inn is not viable due to too many transition scenes/chest opening cs?
That and chest opening. Also going for that chest would make it hard to get to NCT through termina field time-wise and you want to go through the field to skip the NCT intro CS.
I have also been having some issue with milk road exit desynching when testing the magic last route. I dunno how to fix it, i assume just z targeting the backwalk slower fixes it?
Usually adding one frame with neutral input, during the scene transition, to the bkm is enough. Ofcourse at that point you have to play back from the beginning or at least a state faaaaaaaaaaar in the past, to be sure it actually syncs.
oblvionwalker wrote:
mupen never seems to desync on me it might be because i am lucky
That's because your TASes have 4 rerecords total.
niamek wrote:
I don't understand the second one, do you mind explaining? :)
Quicktexts are texts that you can make scroll by extremely fast by pressing B once the first character appears. The banker has quite a few quicktexts, but some are only about 6 characters long. So while it does save a few frames to make use of the quicktext, you likely wouldn't even notice in normal gameplay.
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So collecting rupees, going to milk road and still making it to clock tower before midnight is possible. Obviously I didn't bother to manipulate all the rupees a real TAS would, but I did two spins per grass patch, which should be enough. Also, now that we don't need close to 200 rupees anymore (157 should be enough) only two patches on the second trip seems realistic. Manipulation will take a little longer than two normal spins, but this isn't very optimised. So with more optimisation it should still be very much possible to make it to the clock tower before midnight. Video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B4fxrYIdZiY BKM (desyncs at second banker): https://mega.co.nz/#!iYoEkBCK!NWIO_Rh0UUaDQmfD4PCRQApYqeEiEHD60-2mhaT8pyc Interesting things to note: - While selecting how many rupees to deposit into the bank alternating between direction and neutral is one frame faster than just pressing the direction. - The banker has some quicktexts that are only about 6 characters long. In normal play you would hardly even notice it, but it does save a few frames. - Somthing about entering milk road and exiting it is desyncy. This is now the second TAS that desynced there and had to be fixed. - Savesates don't seem to be perfect in bizhawk, as desyncing movies do sync from states. Still, only two desyncs means it's a hell of a lot better than mupen.
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Hey Tompa, nice to know that you are reading here. :) To expand on what Tompa said: You can only advance time to 6pm on the final day. So you'd usually get magic and then wait out the remaining time. However, luckily we can glitch out of Clock Town. So you want to do as much as you can before 12pm. But there are a few problems. First, during cutscenes and scene transitions time doesn't run. So going through too many cutscenes that you might be able to avoid later or with another route, might not be a good idea. In this case swamp intro, deku palace intro and north clock town intro. If you go to the palace there are also 4 additional transition scenes, which may not be that big a deal, but add up to double digit seconds. Second, if you are not able to get everything done by 12pm, you haven't made it to the clock tower as soon as possible, so everything afterwards counts as normal time. Not necessarily the worst thing in the wolrd, since you have to do these things at some point anyway, but at some point another route, that does things later as human Link, who can do a lot more fun speedy stuff, will be faster. So considering all this, weighing what is faster in the end isn't easy. Edit: Also I forgot, you can't be in termina field when the clock hits 12. If you are you have to take a longer cutscene.
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shredwot wrote:
Milk Road > Palace > SoS > Fairy Magic. Nah. You can only exit clock town through the east gate. The fairy is right there. It would be stupid not to get it on the way.
This was proposed only if it was absolutely necessary like if you needed 4-5 extra seconds to make it to Palace then skipping it could be viable
Well it's really not necessary and would cost a ton of time, since you'd have to do that after midnight.
You are welcome to do some. ;D
I was actually thinking of learning to TAS MM but the camera is pretty tricky, I suppose I could look at your BKM to see what frames are necessary for angle changes/sidehopping etc.
Getting an angle isn't hard. You press the direction you want for 3 frames (1 input frame), then you press Z. That being said, you probably shouldn't use my bkm for reference. There are a few things that are possible that I just don't know how to do. For example you can instantly backwalk. As you can see my backwalks take a while to get into full swing. MrGrunz and Swordless know how to do it, but I haven't seen either of them in forever. I would have liked to use Grunz's m64 as a reference but mupen is crap about displaying what is actually going on. So I'm kinda stuck there. Also I'm pretty sure that, while I end my backwalks a lot faster than the game would normally let you (by letting go of Z and pressing the opsite direction for 3 input frames), there is an even quicker way. Angle changes during sidehops, I think I figured out, but I'm not sure if there is more to it, where you can manipulate it more. What I do now is just letting go of Z for 1-2 input frames.
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shredwot wrote:
Fairy > Milk Road > Palace > SoS then magic Also Fairy > Palace > SoS > Magic Fairy > Milk Road > Magic + rupees
Yes, those are the options. Good summary. :)
Milk Road > Palace > SoS > Fairy Magic.
Nah. You can only exit clock town through the east gate. The fairy is right there. It would be stupid not to get it on the way.
Testing it all sounds fun...
You are welcome to do some. ;D
Meshidaru wrote:
Thank you for the answer :) I'm no TASer, just a nooby spectator of all the great work done here.
No worries. I'm no TASer either, I mean you saw what crap I tased together up there. :D I just thought I was clear. Guess not. To get SoS you just walk up to the stone slab and press A and the deku pipes will come out, wether you have the ocarina or not. Anyway, nice to see that people are interested. Keep on posting. :)
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aaaaaand we are back to people not reading my posts it seems.
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Okay since somebody actually reads my posts. :) For this route ideally you'd want to do a few things in last night of the first cycle before 12pm: - Get magic - Go to Milk Road to activate Lon Lon Ranch on the map for wrong soaring - Go to Deku Palace to activate that - Get Song of Soaring After that you'd death warp back to Clock Town, which is why I damage myself down to 3/4. There is still mandatory damage coming up, 1/4 from big Octo and 1/4 from dragon fly from a boost that skips a lot of deku flying. So that leaves 1/4 and that leads to a quick death. The death warp is possible because the clock tower opening cutscene sets your last entrance back to central clock town. So when you die you end up there. But that is also the problem. For that to work, you can't load a new map after the CS has played. Which means you'd have to make it to deku apalace and back out again before midnight. That does not seem to be possible. Even though my TAS was bad, and I know it was. I probably didn't waste enough time for a better TASer to be able actually get to the palace. (btw time runs faster in first cycle, just in case people don't know) So to make it, you'd have to drop either magic or milk road and do them later. Magic you can get after you death warp back to CT. Milk Road, you can soar to later at any time, as Clock Town gives you the milk road soar. Don't really know what would be faster. If we did this, in cycle 2 we would soar to great bay, get zora mask, activate zora hall, soar to mountain village, activate goron city, soar to Stone Tower, jump down, make our way to the witches, get the bottle, then go to deku palace again. The zora mask would make the swamp faster, but there is still a lot of redundant stuff. So as much as it pains me, I'm not sure if that route is actually faster anymore. We do add quite a few transition scenes and two intro cutscenes and don't even get everything done we'd like to. Also you can't be directly at the clock tower at midnight and you probably won't even make it to SoS before midnight, so that is all time lost. It might be a good idea to do the beginning of cycle 2 like the RTA route (current WR). That way is kinda painfull, since it blows a boatload of explosives for a wrong warp, but it is really convenient that that wrong warp puts you directly in the deku palace. If we did this we'd probably get ~179r in cycle one instead of going to the swamp. I think we should have enough time to make it to milk road and get magic, though. We'd do one trip around the south, and bop into milk road, then do the usual trip around the north and deliver the fairy. At least from my guesstimations that should be doable. Well at least you'd make it back to CT in time and even if you need to spend some time after 12 to get to the tower, it's probably still faster than soaring to milk road later.
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sack_bot wrote:
On the run you made, it seems suboptimal. I could feel some angles could have been better
Okay it's official. Nobody actually reads my posts. Why do I even bother. /done
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So I did not make it to the Deku Palace. Sadly I made it so close that I can't say with certainty, that a better TASer couldn't make it. Although I doubt it. I know put together I dropped a fuckton of frames, but probably not enough to make it relevant. Would be nice if a better TASer could look at the TAS and tell me what he thinks *cough* MrGrunz *cough* GlitchesAndStuff *cough* Youtube Video BKM So if it's not doable to get magic and go to milk road and make it to Deku Palace before midnight, we'd need to drop either getting magic or visiting milk road. For magic you'd get it after being telefported back to CT. For milk road you'd soar there (clock town gives you milk road), probably right before soaring to snowhead. What of the two would be faster, I can't say. Both alone should give you sufficiant time to make it to the deku palace, though. Rough guesstimation puts both at about an hour of game time. Give or take a little. That is enough to make it and hopefully not so much that you would have to wait for the midnight CS, if you are a better TASer than me. I hope this meets your approval, TASeditor. ;) PS: During this whole thing I only had one desync and I could actually fix that by adding an extra frame of no input to the bkm with a text editor. I'd say that is a huge improvement compared to mupen. Edit: But thinking about it, the RTA route might actually be faster... aaaaaaaaand now I'm sad. Great.
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Everything before the scarecrow is unoptimised, since this is only for timing what can be done in the night of the first cycle. Even after, the optimisation isn't great, partly because I suck, partly since it doesn't have to be perfect for testing, hopefully. But I do TAS with the Virtual Pad from then on. I would have started from a state, but afaik Bizhawk still doesn't support that for N64. Edit: That also means those rerecords are only for the last 14700 frames, of which half is just walking in a straight line through termina field. So I did put a little effort into that, even if it maybe wasn't a lot. :D
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Made it past the enemies. On one hand it isn't great, on the other I doubt that it can be done much better. https://mega.co.nz/#!eVoixbCL!byQtsmxvejgBaZ1WlKcTvWhpM7ZVZ8dcekYegMb21a0 10:25 now
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So I TASed a little and got to the path to the swamp, at ~9:50. That is including getting magic and milk road. Don't know if it's enough time to make it to SoS. Milk Road is really out of the way. So if there isn't enough time, maybe we would skip that? That would be about a 25s loss, but not the end of the world. Well guess we'll see. But I don't know if I'm going to TAS any further. I'm bad at it and coming up is enemy manipulation. I guess for damage you would have to take 1/4 big octo, 1/4 dragon flie boost up. That leaves 2 1/4 hearts to get rid of. From what I've seen 1/2 from 2 Kees should be relatively easy, then 1 1/2 from 3 Wolfos and 1/4 from the mini deku baba you get the nut from. Anywho, if anybody is interested in watching, or even continuing, here is the bkm.
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So, I have a movie of Majora's Mask that syncs from a savestate, but doesn't sync from earlier states or the beginning. Is that just a fluke or could that point to a small bug in savestate handeling?
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Don't know why it would require that. From the looks of it resurfacing at the right position, with the right angle and speed should be enough. Unless there is a little anti gravity at work, because of the sidehop into the sloped wall, but that seems unlikely.
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I'd like to see that. Can you upload the m64?
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This is slower when done like I did it, but I think a chu recoil flip + limited super swim might make it faster. So it might be a good TAS strat. mmFruit suggested a death warp, instead of soaring, since it's 5s faster, which is a great idea, but I'm not sure if we can get the reuired damage beforehand. Also I hate beeping. :D
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*post to fix page count*
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got4n wrote:
I said BizHawk couldn't reset but was I wrong?
Yes, you were. But obvlivionwalker is wrong too, don't worry. He won't be able to sync the rest of his run.
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Btw. there is a big error in the route I posted. Not fixing it yet. Still wating for some timings. Whoever finds it gets a virtual cookie.
oblvionwalker wrote:
i can handle a tas of mm i just hate it when it desyncs and i mean how should i do this the mrgrunz route or my route that i have been planning for about 2 and a half years now
Uuuuuuuum seriously?
CoolKirby wrote:
Majora's Mask desyncs a lot in Mupen no matter what you do. MrGrunz had to contend with a lot of them when he made his published TAS.
Can't TAS the new route on mupen anyway. Mupen doesn't support resets in MM. They randomly desync.
oblvionwalker wrote:
by the way in the jp version are the fairies both white?
If you use a crappy graphics plugin, they are white in every version! Great job!
oblvionwalker wrote:
just about to do the fate skip 7 mins worth of tas in mm i think with the latest skips it should come around to about 1:24:35 mark but idk grunz takes a trip around termana feild but with my route i am skiping the adult wallet and a few other things too
Did you skip the deku text? Well coming up is your first reset, so the TAS will be dead in no time anyway.
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Thx for your input. :) I actually just remembered that magic gets saved. So we can run it out during the Gyorg fight and do exactly what Grunz did. Shoot a fire arrow, which makes magic run out, which makes them normal arrows.
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There are 2 potential routes for all dungeons and I'm going to leave them here, because otherwise we will forget about them again and have to start from the beginnign yet another time. route1 child sword bottle shield stick ganondoor 20 chus S+Q ZD through LW Jabu adault dc bombs -> out hookshot Shadow BK skip dc -> gtg Spirit route2 child sword bottle well -> stick, shield, chus dc -> bombs gtg odd chest mush requium S+Q ZD through LW Jabu adault minuet forest temple play minuet odd mush WW to bongo