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feos wrote:
Suddenly
....old neat geek shit
lol, pretty neat. Basically what I will do except not so huge and with non-volatile storage and review. But it is 25 years later...
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Re: Pi replay, I have a PIC32-based pseudocontroller working with two players having dual serial out (to support multitap). I tried using an ATMEGA328P but a combination of architecture and really shit compiler made it infeasable, I could have did some asm hackery at it but why? With the PIC32 it works really well - 2.6us of latency for data0, 3.2us for data1, without even optimizing it yet. It already should be plenty fast enough even for SNES and can get faster. And this chip comes in DIP so it's easy to breadboard and experiement with. (That said, it's running at >40MHz, so results may vary running it on a breadboard)
Going to work on frame counter and lag frame detector (direct replay of TAS files without an intermediate emulator step may be possible) and the UART interface. It shouldn't be long before this works.
edit: lag frame detector done, geeky LED added and reset detect implemented - so if reset is held down for 5 seconds, the MCU can signal to the computer to restart playback.
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Re: the NES or SNES replay controller, haven't even started, will start when the above project is done.
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TASeditor wrote:
We actually don't need your help. We have an opportunity, here, to download all TASes from tasvideos.
Cool.
TASeditor wrote:
Only problem is, it's outdated. The last update was 2008.
Ah, right. Not cool. So it sounds like his help is needed.
TASeditor wrote:
And the users from this site have no need for collecting/downloading TASes. tasvideos has encodes from every TAS.
I guess you don't understand what it's like to be a digital packrat.
Besides, why hate on an offline backup? What if TASVideos servers and backups are nuked? What will we do for TAS in post-nuclear society?
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jlun2 wrote:
'm going to set the Pi aside for a day or two and see if I can get the loaned Arduino up and running using micro500's original design, as I believe I have everything I need to at least test the original NESBot with my copy of Tetris. I might even try Dragon Warrior and see if I can Console Verify a new game. :)
Will you ever expand on the original design and support multiple controllers?
The original NESbot (and my prior unfinished PIC-based bot) feed the 4021, which is the chip the original controllers use. It's barely possible to get a an Arduino working with two controllers I think using only two 4021, maybe not with the default Arduino peripherals (maybe so? don't know) and certainly so with another chip or two, but with a raw ATMEGA328P this can be done.
But that said, I am working to get straight serial output working to the console, eliminating the need for the 4021. The project will not only support multiple controllers, but should be able to supoort multitap and Genesis as well. This will reduce chip count and price should others want to implement it. As I understand it multitap SNES is ultimately dwangoAC's intention. Ultimately the Pi won't work without buffering, and with the chip counts required for SNES multitap with even a parallel out from the Pi it makes going back to a microcontroller pretty appealing.
That doesn't mean software or even the GPIO on the Pi can't be used, it just doesn't need to be used. But maybe a nice LCD front-end with a browser could be donw using Pi GPIO... I'll think about that...
Right now I'm working with a 328P trying to get instruction count down and will probably need to write some careful asm during latch and clock to get the response times I need. If clocks are still too slow I can move on to PIC32MX or something faster and still attainable in DIP for easy soldering. (I don't care about the chips; if people want to solder TQFP or things like that I'll go with anything. I just happen to have 50MHz PIC32MX in DIP in my parts box.) Faster MCUs typically run at 3v3 and will need level shifting but I've already made up a board for that for the Pi, and some (like aforementioned PIC) have 5v tolerant pins already =)
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The code I sent you will press whatever button you want, most of the time; it will also jitter around and press other stuff too or nothing at all as well from I believe lack of detecting the 1us pulses. I don't think it's a code problem, but a pi problem for it doing this as I've described.
Also my code doesn't send garbage; it looks at latch to set up the output and clock to clock out the output. You define output - can be from input file, the code I sent you currently just tries to hold whatever buttons you define. Should work with the parts you have even.
I am ordering buffer parts because I think that will be the route to go. But no longer will it be just connect-to-Pi-and-go (with level shifting)...isn't a quick hack-it-together thing anymore. Still, if this works I will design PCB and circuit and provide infos.
EDIT: Using attiny13 pulse stretcher, the Pi was still unable to reliably detect pulses. Really, an MCU is probably the best way to go with this, especially considering the multitap SNES support that the end device needs.
Possibly, but that is yet another dependency, and is still pretty high considering what the NES is expecting. I am getting similar response by directly polling I think. I won't know the limits until I stretch the pulses out a bit.
dwangoAC wrote:
In the meantime, a different co-worker loaned me an Arduino Duemilanove which I can keep through January so I can build the original NESBot based on micro500's design as well, although I'm still dedicated to getting the Pi working.
You know you can just order some samples from Atmel and have your own for free...use the one you are borrowing as an ISP loader for the chips. You can even put on something like usbasploader so you can program it with avrdude. Just need some 3v6 zeners, a few resistors and a 5v psu :)
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Doesn't look like I have much to do this passively; passively extending 1us can be tough as it is.
I'll probably program an attiny13 as a temporary trigger / stretcher. But ultimately I don't think we can rely on the pi for suitable output, the timings are probably just too tough to match reliably. I mean, I can probably get them to match but then something might come along and hold the CPU for 1ms in the middle of the data output and now we're out of sync. :(
If pulse stretching works and I can reliably play back without interruptions then I'll design a circuit using monostable multivibrators to stretch the output. If not I'll design one as mostly 74xx and 4xxx logic. That is, IF we don't have >10ms delays holding us back...
Regardless, my goal is probably going above and beyond dwangoAC's initial requirements - my final circuit will probably use 4 GPIOs to run outputs for one of 2 NES, 2 Genesis or 2 SNES at a time, and probably have generic outputs for other consoles. Hopefully that will be enough for anybody.
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Derakon wrote:
Is the rPi a realtime device? I'm not familiar with it, but if it's meant to be a computer-on-a-chip running a "normal" OS then it's going to have much less reliability when it comes to timing than you'd like. Unfortunate.
not realtime, and there are problems even with realtime patched kernels. realtime just means guaranteed service time, it doesn't mean immediate, so we may still have the same problems...
If the thing needs buffered, why not just use an mcu and be done though? I guess it could be cheaper with a buffer but that's if you don't consider the pi price...
EDIT: I guess logic is cheap enough. I'll work on a pulse stretcher sometime soon with the parts I have and see if that fixes it. If it doesn't the only way it'll work reliably is serial out to the formats desired by the controllers. I'll get some various logic ICs on order.
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Tried interfacing with pi.
Latency is just too high, and jitter is pretty bad too. This will probably only work if input is buffered or parallel out is used (which eats up pins).
EDIT: Latency was my bug. Jitter is fairly high but not high enough to really affect things, about .5uS, except I think it spikes sometimes... The other problem I think is unreliable detection of the clock pulse and latch, each is about 1uS, which may be fixed by stretching the period but I'm not so sure.
Right now the Pi is holding down A and Right. This is what it should look like.
It screws up regularly.
Sometimes it doesn't even bother. I think it didn't see the latch so it didn't get set up correctly though.
Sometimes it misses a pulse, which is what I think the problem really is. Here it misses one somewhere in the middle.
And one right at the beginning, pressing both A and B...
Ultimately with how it is acting I do not think the Pi is a reasonable platform as a playback device. It can probably feed a buffer but it can't respond directly to the NES. I will have to try stretching the clock low and latch high (looks like about 1us right now) to see if it picks up better, but with it sometimes completely missing, I don't know if it could ever work right.
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Remote, yes, you said "I would like most functions from my normal remote control to be working through cec-client." I wanted to know what kind of remote you were using / how you were integrating it using cec-client. I don't care about the Samsung IR remote. I believe your TV has Bluetooth capability but I don't know what it would take to emulate a Samsung Bluetooth remote, haven't gone there at all.
"Integrated amplifier" is not the TV built in amp, no. It is always an external AVR or pre. But there is a way to act like an AVR sending a volume command back to a TV which sometimes works, just no guarantee. You can't be type 1 though bascally. Try being the type that an AVR is
"The power control through cec is already fixed" - what? you said it was working, did it break?
Re: connect from IP, that is an exercise for you. I haven't done it yet. You cannot power on over IP though so CEC power would still be helpful for that. Wireshark and look at protocol... I don't know if there are discrete input commands via IP control though. There probably is but would require investigation or google.
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Those ES series Samsung TVs look nice.
What kind of control are you using? What is the use case?
I hate CEC. I work with this stuff everyday. I always turn CEC off and use other methods.
There is no guarantee of non-HDMI input capability with CEC. Likely you cannot use CEC to change these inputs. Volume on TV is not supported by CEC spec and isn't implemented by TV vendors. You can do volume on a receiver though. You may be able to mimic an AVR and send volume commands somehow... was reading that could work but I never dealt with it.
However, you may be able to use CEC to control power, and connect to this model via IP to change sources (cannot power on via IP). You could also potentially use EX-Link if you can't figure out the IP protocol. Neither is particularly well documented nor supported. Worst case, you can do an IR driver via GPIO.
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feos wrote:
Input display may be some additional panel. Building it right into controller sounds like an overload. As for the panel, if it has a point-based display of one color, it could be drawn at like we draw with lua (snes9x does it perfectly as well):
P1: ABsSLRUD
P2: ABsSLRUD
etc
I was going to do this with a 16x2 on the pi - show controller input, lag detect and frame count. But that comes after everything works. :)
Re: all this controller stuff, there's nothing to cry about, it's just a neat toy gimmick idea and doesn't really apply to TAS. It could be useful to realtime speedrunners, to perhaps see in slow motion where they could improve after the fact, or just to post the runs so others could emulate them. Or maybe it won't be, who knows, it just sounds like a cool idea.
Waiting to get some controllers...
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should be easy enough to implement. I'll consider it as another project... my 4mbit NOR flashes come in next week, which should offer lots of recording time.
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Warp wrote:
A nesbot built inside a regular NES gamepad would be awesome. (Naturally it would have to have an extra USB port of something similar for it to be programmed, but other than that it could look identical to a NES gamepad.) You would simply connect it to the NES normally and it would play the game by itself.
Extra bonus if it could be used as a regular gamepad as well (perhaps there could be a switch to select which mode it is in.)
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But would a movie that, with the same or slightly key input length that got to 600k first, obsolete this one?
A 500k and/or 600k timing with quickest input makes sense for this game...
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Set up the Stax SRΛ and had a listen. abx test results in percentage out of at least 10 trials. I don't claim to have a golden ear, but these headphones are very revealing.
chronointro
40 - obvious, 100%
48 - getting hard. some of the low sounds had artifacts where I could discern the differences, and some of the high background stuff is sustained in the opus version. 100%
56 - 25%, obviously I can't tell a difference anymore
chronolavosscream
40 - obvious, 100%
48 - harder, could tell near the end, 100%
56 - harder still, could still tell near the end, 100%
60 - still could tell, 100%
72 - still could tell, after hearing it like 50 times now it's super fast for me to pick the right one, there's this weird artifact between 5-6 seconds that's super obvious. 100%
80 - artifact still present, 100%
88 - artifact still present, skip
96 - artifact still present, skip
104 - artifact still present, starting to diminish though, 100%
112 - artifact still present, diminished more, have to try harder, 100%
120 - still present, almost gone, 100% in 20
128 - still BARELY present, 90% in 20
chronofinalbattle
48 - some low freq artifacts, 90%
56 - trained to that artifact, 100%
64 - 100%
72 - artifact mostly gone. will test later
chrono-bc12k-overworld2:
didn't test, but at low bitrates it mostly works
starting to get acoustically tired, I'll try more later
but what is the intent?
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LTRP wrote:
I get WST's side now. And to be completely honest, I'm for him. Posting a 'tool assisted speedrun' that isn't actually a speedrun has little to no reason to be posted on this website. I seriously think that their runs are entertaining, but they really aren't using the tools to speedrun. I guess the only reason why they post it here is to get attention. Pity. :/
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Pot wasn't smoking. Voting no.
Enemy list:
Flying midgets.
Boss list:
Random guy, Some chick, Fat guy, Fat guy in lucha mask, Fat guy gets a haircut and a boomerang, Fat guy gets a terrorist trench and bombs, Some chick with a really messed up leg, Fat guy summons lightning.
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TehSeven wrote:
2 seconds :)
No, the enemies don't damage you. If you touch them they freeze for a few seconds for some reason, but it's nice that it looks like close calls.
They can eat you. Stand still and watch. Always scared the crap out of me as a kid so I only played this game a few times.
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Bad ass. Didn't even know a Genesis version existed, and it is obviously inferior to the SNES version, but with 6 players this should be interesting...
It screws up regularly.
Sometimes it doesn't even bother. I think it didn't see the latch so it didn't get set up correctly though.
Sometimes it misses a pulse, which is what I think the problem really is. Here it misses one somewhere in the middle.
And one right at the beginning, pressing both A and B...
Ultimately with how it is acting I do not think the Pi is a reasonable platform as a playback device. It can probably feed a buffer but it can't respond directly to the NES. I will have to try stretching the clock low and latch high (looks like about 1us right now) to see if it picks up better, but with it sometimes completely missing, I don't know if it could ever work right.