Posts for Tseralith


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I tried out the demo version of the game ... and I could play it in the Hourglass Resurrection interim build just fine. More or less. Didn't have to do any magic or voodoo rituals to make it run on my old XP laptop. Frame advance and save states worked without any problem, unless you count having each save state keeping track of quite a lot of memory. According to the task manager, Hourglass climbed up to ~500 MB of memory usage, and that only using one save state, which also happens to be 50% of the total memory of my (quite old) laptop. Apart from that, I still managed to play (without really trying) until the end of the demo with using save states 77 times. When I tried to play back my run, however, the RNG was different and the run couldn't continue since the battles ended differently. I only tried to play it back twice with different RNG both times, which means I haven't really experimented yet to see whether there's a reliable way to get the RNG to sync as well. As I said, I've only tried the demo version of the game so I don't know whether the full game works or not.
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The interim build of Hourglass can actually detect your mouse, although not always. In fact, I've gotten some games to work which requires mouse support. The most prominent ones being Spelunky HD, Patrician 3, Dink Smallwood, and I think Heroes 3 worked as well (although there were other issues which makes it unplayable). Patrician 3 even goes so far as to allow frame perfect mouse movement across the screen, which actually did sync the 15-20 seconds of testing I did. As far as I see it, you just have to try the game out and see whether the Hourglass Resurrection interim build actually can detect the mouse or not and hope for the best.
"An artist who can’t take constructive critique on their work is only hurting themselves and their potential. Conversely, and artist that can’t communicate a critique in a constructive way isn’t helping anybody."
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How easy/hard is it to manipulate RNG? I feel (only from hearing the damage potential) you'd benefit more from the Whimsical ring, though I have no knowledge of how difficult it is to do so. Alternatively is it possible to corrupt your ring box much earlier in the game in order to get the Whimsical ring withouth having to spend any extra unnecessary time to get it the normal way? Or might doing so break the game in the long run due to the corrupted nature of the ring box? Granted the Double-Edged ring would make everything a lot more predictable with the fixed damage, yet also a lot more dangerous. Alternatively it could also work if you got the Power Ring L-2 (plus two sword damage, getting hurt makes you loose an additional 1/2 heart) instead (or together with any other rings, though getting the level 2 Ring box so you can bring two rings with you would probably be more time consuming than it's worth).
"An artist who can’t take constructive critique on their work is only hurting themselves and their potential. Conversely, and artist that can’t communicate a critique in a constructive way isn’t helping anybody."
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scorpianman42 wrote:
The ring box corruption causes you to have an extremely large ring box containing mostly useless rings, unfortunately the Double-Edged ring is not in the list. I could have tried using the whimsical ring, but I would have had to found an RNG seed that made it get a critical hit (1/256 chance of dealing 12 damage) twice in a row to kill veran, saving only some of the spin attack animation and one sword swing. Funny enough, the poe clock is included in the ring box, although it seems to have no effect when equipping it
Aha, ok. Then what if you got either the Double-Edged or the Whimsical ring from the Yoll Graveyard directly after the first dungeon? Or are there not enough enemies to kill for the seed to appear until then? Alternatively if you buy one of the rings at the Advance Shop for 100 rupees and make sure it's the Whimsical one? Then you'd have a way to instantly kill most bosses from the start of the game. Or am I missing something something important with this idea? Apart from the obvious RNG struggle to get all those critical hits that is.
"An artist who can’t take constructive critique on their work is only hurting themselves and their potential. Conversely, and artist that can’t communicate a critique in a constructive way isn’t helping anybody."
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How does the ring box corruption work? Does it just give you a ring "at random" and equips it? Or does it convert an already existing ring into another? Or just appraise/equip an unidentified ring for you? I'm wondering since wouldn't it be better to get the Double-Edged Ring (sword does an extra eight damage, but you take one heart in damage with every hit) instead of the Red Ring (double the damage of the current sword)?
"An artist who can’t take constructive critique on their work is only hurting themselves and their potential. Conversely, and artist that can’t communicate a critique in a constructive way isn’t helping anybody."
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I've actually had a go at this game a while back, on normal difficulty that is. Sadly though I couldn't get farther than maybe half a minute up to a minute or so before the game/Hourglass would freeze and become unplayable at that point. Not really sure if it's due to me frequenlty save/loading, always frame advancing, or just something else I don't even know of yet. Nevertheless it would be fun to see if anyone else could run this game farther than what I did.
"An artist who can’t take constructive critique on their work is only hurting themselves and their potential. Conversely, and artist that can’t communicate a critique in a constructive way isn’t helping anybody."
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In Shinock Reign in the room in the picture above, it's possible to make the spider hit a wall as it falls down, making it change direction even earlier. Although you'd have to time it quite well to do so, but at least it's doable.
"An artist who can’t take constructive critique on their work is only hurting themselves and their potential. Conversely, and artist that can’t communicate a critique in a constructive way isn’t helping anybody."
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Hmm, there might be something about that. Normally when you kill an enemy, the RNG advances. However it only does that if they can drop. That means the RNG is guaranteed to advance once when you kill an enemy which you know can drop something. Although this might also be a precaution to make sure you won't get drops from several enemies in a row. I can't exclude your theory though, so I'll look into it some more.
"An artist who can’t take constructive critique on their work is only hurting themselves and their potential. Conversely, and artist that can’t communicate a critique in a constructive way isn’t helping anybody."
Post subject: RNG investigation + two other things
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I've figured out how the RNG advances now. Showing the adress as 4 bytes instead of float values gives a whole number which is much easier to read. Through testing I can say it cycles between the value 0 and 32768 (256*128). The formula that advances RNG is ("previous value" * 109) + 1021 So with this you can easily predict how it advances, although I'm still having problem figuring exactly how the drops behave. What I do know is that there's roughly two values every ten values which decides if an enemy should drop something. Interestingly it seems all enemies have a fixed item they drop, however if you don't have the sub-weapon they're supposed to drop, it won't drop anything at all. Another thing I've noticed is that RNG necessarily doesn't advance just once. Sometimes it advances up to five times at once, for example during certain screen transitions (which I haven't looked into why yet). Here's some RNG values which results in drops in case someone else might be able to find some sense from it. What else have I investigated? I've been trying to find a way to get the flares without solving the block puzzle, however with no success yet. I tried to corner glitch into the compartment where it is, but I'm a bit too far away to reach it. I'll continue to look into it in case I can find a solution at a later date. I've also looked into the possibility to reach the bombs by glitching into the sloped ceiling at the entrance to the Tower of Ruin. Sadly there's been no success here as well yet. Not sure if it's due to ice physics decreasing your speed or if there's something else which prevents you from glitching into the sloped ceiling, however if you can find a way to glitch up through the roof, you'll be able to get the bombs without any more problem.
"An artist who can’t take constructive critique on their work is only hurting themselves and their potential. Conversely, and artist that can’t communicate a critique in a constructive way isn’t helping anybody."
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I'm thinking of looking into this game again, however I'll be analyzing the game for now, trying to figure out things like how the RNG works, possible skips, glitch hunting, finding new routes and such. I have no estimate on when I'll begin a new run for real, but it'll be when I feel I'm ready. However if anyone wish to help, you could suggest things you think might be useful. Be it either potential wall clips, possible routes, potential glitches and whatnot. I'd appreciate any input.
"An artist who can’t take constructive critique on their work is only hurting themselves and their potential. Conversely, and artist that can’t communicate a critique in a constructive way isn’t helping anybody."
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Super fast "normal" gameplay mayhap? Like a tool-assisted playthrough that is. For example making a family of 4+ and always use max speed when playing. It could either be a playaround where you can show off interesting and silly stuff (if it'd be possible to see it that is) and build a house/family worthy of a TAS. Alternatively just try to reach max career with everyone in the family, all using different jobs.
"An artist who can’t take constructive critique on their work is only hurting themselves and their potential. Conversely, and artist that can’t communicate a critique in a constructive way isn’t helping anybody."
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Apparently Hourglass decides itself whether you can run the game on Windows or not then. Thanks for making a dump fsvgm777.
"An artist who can’t take constructive critique on their work is only hurting themselves and their potential. Conversely, and artist that can’t communicate a critique in a constructive way isn’t helping anybody."
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feos wrote:
It's XP. And no, I don't record it, just run.
Windows XP by using Virtual Machine or running it from an XP computer?
"An artist who can’t take constructive critique on their work is only hurting themselves and their potential. Conversely, and artist that can’t communicate a critique in a constructive way isn’t helping anybody."
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feos wrote:
When I run it, the gameplay starts, but the character doesn't move.
Are you using Windows 8.1? It doesn't work no matter how many times you try? Even if you start the game normally once? Oh, you're not accidentally running and recording a new movie instead of running and playing the existing movie?
"An artist who can’t take constructive critique on their work is only hurting themselves and their potential. Conversely, and artist that can’t communicate a critique in a constructive way isn’t helping anybody."
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solarplex wrote:
Edit: Didn't read anything in the description but the teleporter randomly chooses if you go left or right, and while you're falling you get ported to a position lower than you. So all it takes is to be facing the correct way to be teleported in the direction you like. Never played spelunky before.
Not really. I can decide which direction I wish to go, but the distance I'm teleported is random. I admit I was unsure whether it would be interpreted that way or not. The fact I reach a lower position each time I teleport is because I still maintain my falling momentum. Unfortunately you can't teleport down in Spelunky Classic, however in the Remake you can.
"An artist who can’t take constructive critique on their work is only hurting themselves and their potential. Conversely, and artist that can’t communicate a critique in a constructive way isn’t helping anybody."
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I can confirm it is possible to run the game with Hourglass whenever I use my Windows XP laptop, Hourglass set to default settings. I've never tried using a VM though so I have no idea whether it's possible to run the game through that.
"An artist who can’t take constructive critique on their work is only hurting themselves and their potential. Conversely, and artist that can’t communicate a critique in a constructive way isn’t helping anybody."
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... would it, like, be possible to clone the moat door and enter it that way?
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It feels more structured now with sound, imput (and probably graphics as well later on) at the same place. Much easier to find and navigate them. I also like the new Movie menu, though I have a feeling it would fit better between File and Options instead to the far right. That way the Open Executable from File and Open Movie from Movie will be next to each other. Including the Frame Advance and the Capture AVI options in the Tool menu is a good call, however I'm unsure whether Load/Save States should be in File or Tool menu. I feel like it's considered a tool, but it's cluttered with so much already. The File menu is already quite empty too, so I'm not completely sure what the best option is. I guess Debug is either a new name for Runtime or just a placeholder for it. All in all it's a nice improvement. I like it.
"An artist who can’t take constructive critique on their work is only hurting themselves and their potential. Conversely, and artist that can’t communicate a critique in a constructive way isn’t helping anybody."
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Here's a run by someone over at Nicovideo who's both using the Teleporter and skillfully blowing up the ground beneath the boss. There's room for improvements if you can get a great starting seed and probably get the Teleporter from a crate in the first level as well, but it's an excellent example how the run would look like in the end (apart from the bonus stuff afterwards). Link to video
"An artist who can’t take constructive critique on their work is only hurting themselves and their potential. Conversely, and artist that can’t communicate a critique in a constructive way isn’t helping anybody."
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Not as far as I've tested at least. I only seem to be allowed to teleport up, left and right, but I can throw bombs down at least.
"An artist who can’t take constructive critique on their work is only hurting themselves and their potential. Conversely, and artist that can’t communicate a critique in a constructive way isn’t helping anybody."
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I've actually played around with the original version on my XP laptop just recently and it runs flawlessly with Multithreading and Wait Sync set to disabled. As a matter of fact I've made a test run to see how effective the Teleporter is. I ran through the first level as fast as possible, but half messed around, half prepared for the rest of the game on the second level. Every other level after that is just a demonstration how fast they'll be when you can abuse the Teleporter to the fullest. The best time is achieved when you can continuously fall down all the way to the bottom without ever touching the ground (or using the Jetpack) before you reach the door. A couple of interesting things I've discovered is that if you run and jump on the first frame possible when you begin a new level (including the "menu level") you'll fly faster for that jump. Another thing is that it takes two frames for the game to register fall damage, so you can both enter doors and use the Teleporter on that first frame and ignore the fall damage completely. The "best" possible run would be if you get a first level where you can fall down straight to the exit and a second level with a shop with both a Teleporter and bombs. Alternatively if you could find easily accessible bombs on the lower levels as well. Of course optimizing the boss fight better than I did as well. Link to video
"An artist who can’t take constructive critique on their work is only hurting themselves and their potential. Conversely, and artist that can’t communicate a critique in a constructive way isn’t helping anybody."
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Interesting. Save/reloading opens up quite a number of possibilities when you don't have to search for coins and sub-weapons all the time. No progress since last time a I've been busy with whatnot, so we'll see when the next update will be. Maybe I'll look into those pointers in the meantime, thanks for explaining it. Thanks for linking that video as well.
"An artist who can’t take constructive critique on their work is only hurting themselves and their potential. Conversely, and artist that can’t communicate a critique in a constructive way isn’t helping anybody."
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I have no way of helping out with programming, but I can assist with beta testing new functions and such (if you wish) now that I've finally managed to get Visual Studio to work.
"An artist who can’t take constructive critique on their work is only hurting themselves and their potential. Conversely, and artist that can’t communicate a critique in a constructive way isn’t helping anybody."
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I'd say the experiment has succeeded no matter whether the run's finished or not. There's loads of stuff for researchers to analyze about how people behave with all these democracy and anarchy arguments, behavior and reactions to particular events and whatnot.
"An artist who can’t take constructive critique on their work is only hurting themselves and their potential. Conversely, and artist that can’t communicate a critique in a constructive way isn’t helping anybody."
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Hmm, I don't think most of these addresses will actually be of any use if I post them. Apparently it seems the game has a register of addresses which it chooses from whenever it's time to assign values to an object. So the address for Viy's HP could be the address for the destroyable wall in front of Guidance Gate on the Surface next time around. Even the X and Y addresses for objects act the same way, so unless I can find a way to make sense into this, I'd have to search for the address every time I need them. The only things which seems to be consistent though (that I've found so far) is the addresses of Lemeza himself as well as the RNG. Addresses like his position, his items and sub weapons, his vitality and invulnerability timer. Here's the addresses I've found so far. These can all be used with Cheat Engine 6.2 RNG - Float - 007A62D8 (can be viewed in other types as well by changing it manually) X Position - 4 Bytes - 007A95B8 Y Position - 4 Bytes - 007A95BC Vitality - 4 Bytes - 007A95C0 Invulnerability - 4 Bytes - 007A9634 (Freeze this value right after you've taken a hit) Shuriken - Array of byte - 004D9EEC (Sub weapon values count 01-09, then 0A-0F, then 10-19, then 1A-1F etc...) Throwing knives - Array of byte - 004D9EEE Flares - Array of byte - 004D9EF2 Spears - Array of byte - 004D9EF0 Just to see if it's possible, I checked a couple of other things as well: Ankh Jewels - Array of byte - 004D9EFA (Yes, you can give yourself more Ankh Jewels than there exist in the game. Might not actually be useful in the real run, but could help when I need to investigate stuff and don't want to waste time gathering them all again) Feather - Array of byte - 004D9E81 (Set to 01 00 to give the Feather to yourself. Won't be visible in the inventory though. You can still pick up the Feather later on if you wish to.)
"An artist who can’t take constructive critique on their work is only hurting themselves and their potential. Conversely, and artist that can’t communicate a critique in a constructive way isn’t helping anybody."
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