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Twisted_Eye
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hahaha what a fun hack, and excellent run for it.
Twisted_Eye
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That was pretty fun to watch! I've never heard of this game but it looks great, and your TAS work on it so far looks quality. I wondered in a couple of places if there were ways through the patches of enemies without using arrows, but that's just on sight and at first glance, I'm sure you looked into them. How long is this game? With a ridiculous King like that one I'm sure he can come up with a lot of stupid events to trudge through. "Well I clearly can't marry two girls together forcefully, I'll just have to marry one myself forcefully!" "Oh! I bought caviar from a mysterious masked man and it was poisoned! Was that wrong? Should I not have done that?"
Twisted_Eye
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Interesting that, against Le-Vars, you use Saner on the group but never Shift on Chaz. If all you're doing is manipulating him to do a direct attack to Rune for low damage then the Saner doesn't seem to be useful. It'd be better for Le-Vars to be faster than the group for the last turn of battle when it's time to kill Chaz. Oh and Wren I see, good idea for helping Rune gain his Techs. The PD fight looks good, but seems improvable. Chaz is on defense a lot, which wastes some turns. Maybe Shift + Attack would save some time. Doing Ataraxia on the same turn as Tsu afterwards means the Tsu will still happen if it's a macro. And there were many times where Rika did an attack instead of a 2xSlash, maybe manual programming two rounds to do the skill would save time. OH and earlier in the fight, you have Wren take a hit from the second form and then have Raja do Miracle, and then again the next turn, and then the next turn, Rika survives a hit. If you have Wren and Rika each survive a hit and then do a Miracle to heal both of them, the alternate turn he can do the Mahlaydagger. I'll see if I can come up with other ideas later.
Twisted_Eye
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Is the new run the same strategy as the old? In an earlier version of the DF3 fight, you Shift Chaz but not Rika. Her Doubleslash can gain 50 damage from the Shift if manipulated well, so in a long battle she'll do more damage. This probably applies to earlier fights, too, but I'm sure you already looked into it at some point. There's an off-chance that Deban and some manipulation could allow Wren to survive two sword attacks without a Recover, but that's untested. Can't really think of anything, otherwise.
Twisted_Eye
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You can also change stage at the title screen, so, uh, this might go against some intention of the TAS, but what if you did most of the boards with normal friction, reset, did the next chunk of boards with no friction, reset, did the last few with higher friction, or some such thing? The change in game mechanic might make for a refreshed-feel to watching the movie. "Ah this is different, hmm!"
Twisted_Eye
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Oh wow, has it really been that long since I've worked on it? JEEZ. I'm trying to free up some time for TASes these days, so I think I'll start with this game. I'll upload the WIP from where it was, I've lost track at the moment how far it got and how much faster it was than the previous runs. I remember being pleased with it, but I may choose to start over and try to beat my own time. http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/1860723642/Wonder%20Boy%202%20-%20WIP%204.mmv Watching it. I could probably save frames at the first Knight boss by grabbing the coins from right to left instead, since he's closer to the left wall. The farthest coin will bounce back instead of me having to chase it. Wow, I only made it to the end of round 4? Quite a ways to go it seems.
Twisted_Eye
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EDIT: wrong, nvm. Thought this was one of the RPGs where if you set a character to ressurect someone when they're not dead, then in that turn the latter dies but is ressurected before it would have been their turn to fight that they would follow their original instructions like they had never flatlined, but sadly my tests couldn't make it happen--Chaz just wouldn't stand up and Tsu. Could've saved a turn of rever for Rune to maybe make that Lashiec fight one little round faster. edit2: Thinking back on it, I was able to get it so that Rune's turn in the move order came after Lashiec's Thunderhalberd attack, meaning that if you use Rever on a turn when you would have used Fire Storm and it connects after Lash's attack, Chaz could have two turns of unabated Tsu using. If you save the revering for later in the fight when Chaz would use the Psychowand, he might even survive four rounds in a row (thanks to Possessions), knocking the number of uses of Rever down to 1 total, freeing Rune for more Gifoi. Fight just enough rounds to make it so that 3 Tsus are enough to make the Psychowand necessary next turn and let Chaz die after that... and if Kyra's move is after Lashiec's, you can just have her Medice that turn so that she can Fire Storm with Rune next turn. Untested, it all sounds hopeful, I think Anyway, during the first Zio battle where Alys is hit with the wave, you don't need to set everyone to defend. Just try to run away. After the failure message, Zio will continue his sequence of moves like normal, and you can run and fail again, over and over, until Alys gets it. It seems much faster.
Twisted_Eye
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I really enjoyed this clever run. Suiciding to get past boss fights is...unusual, I like it. I loved Indy's jumping graphics, though--it made the whole run seem like he was in "OW MY DAMN LEG HURTS" mode
Twisted_Eye
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Are the blocks just not very manipulable? There were blocks dropped and matches made in areas of the screen that didn't matter. A puzzle game just isn't as interesting to watch if it isn't manipulable.
Twisted_Eye
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As far as we know, only Area 4 can be skipped in the US version. I say that when a run on that rom is done next, even that one not be skipped, for completion. Great job on this! I don't know if it was my memory or my testing that went wrong on the 16 frames-between-grenades thing, and great find with the new way into Area 3! Thanks for cleaning this up.
Twisted_Eye
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Why not just separate them using the old any% vs. 100% distinctions? This run skips so much of the game that it makes sense to me to make another category for a run that does the entire game sans zipping. I'd say the backwards door glitch could still be used to save a couple dozen frames here or there, since the only thing you can break with it in the U game is skipping Area 4, and we wouldn't want to do that. As far as improving this run is concerned, if you're meaning the first room, I think I realize what you're talking about and feel like a doofus for rushing through it. Heck, maybe improving that part will fix the randomness in the first room of Area 2, allowing me to save a couple bars of health so that I don't have to worry about the spikes at the end of Area 8, saving a couple more frames, for example. As far as the entertainment value of the boss fights, they're both so incredibly difficult to fight in realtime that seeing them made to look pitiful felt like a fun way to go. See how much of the time I get to just stand still? That's not normal, har har I'm strong. Makes sense that it seems less fun to watch, though, especially to someone who hasn't played through the game.
Twisted_Eye
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jlun2 wrote:
Blaster Master's published run, made expertly by Namflow, is one of the older ones on this site, dating back to mid-2005. This run, however, will not be obsoleting it.
There's one problem. If this run doesn't obsolete Namflow's run, what catagory will it be in? It cant be "glitched" run, as Namflow's run also used glitches, so what will it be catagorized when it gets published?
I figure this run is the any% compared to Namflow's 100%. It's up for debate obviously but I feel like this game deserves a full run alongside a 'warp' run. Given the new techniques and such, it could be probably be improved by more than a couple minutes easily--I have an old WIP that gets to the first boss a few seconds faster already, and that's before the boss-related glitches start to dismantle the graphics again, all in the name of dying at a better time to save frames later.
Twisted_Eye
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Oh did you make those? Nice, sorry about that, I thought they were just linked from somewhere else. Into the thanks section you go! I posted my own encode to youtube to share with friends; it's good for anyone here until an official one is made up by one of you sexy experts! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dGExkxq4CQQ
Twisted_Eye
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http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/502446766/Blaster%20Master%20%28E%29-2.fm2 Holy sheesus it worked, it really worked! The game can now be beat without touching any boss except for 8's pair. I think I'm going to spend the rest of the night cleaning, but tomorrow I'll start TASing a final product to put all of these together. I'm so pumped from that haha Succeeding after failing dozens and dozens of times in a row is exhilerating
Twisted_Eye
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http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/330184132/Blaster%20Master%20%28E%29-1.fm2 That iffy second path I talked about, completed successfully. I hope this isn't too incredibly painful on the eyes. (Note the music glitch in the beginning, and that the biggest thing slowing me down was health management. A real TAS will probably be able to complete this path in only a minute.) I learned another interesting feature of this glitch--As Jason is flying upwards through the walls, you'll occasionally see him freeze for a few frames before continuing zipping. At these times, he is actually at a door, and if right is held (or left, I assume, if in the other direction), Jason will walk through this door in our familiar glitchy way and appear across the room. This gives us more freedom of movement when zipping, because otherwise the options were go really far up, or stop going really far up a little sooner. This is good, though. If this can be used in 8 to help get to the boss, it's very welcome.
Twisted_Eye
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haha, that'd be awesome. The tank would never leave the starting room. So far, I'm having no luck with the Area 8 deal. Glitching into the open air area of that brain room is easy enough, but as you fall into nothing, the game actually doesn't place you into the room below--it places you at the top of the screen. This is okay if you're going to the right--though that also fails to do anything useful-- but if you're going to the left, there is eventually nothing to walk on anymore, and after falling four tiles or so, the game relocates you into the room below, being the huge square room in the top left, and death shortly follows. Now, using the pause menu to manipulate it so you never fall, you can make it all the way to the left and successfully appear just to the right of the boss door. Unfortunately, you are then stuck in a wall, and the game shoots you straight up, past another room, and into the bottom of another large, square room---right into a huge pit of spikes. Not useful. My next idea is to see if it's possible to glitch into the upper open area of that same intestine room, and if you can jump all the way to the left wall without having to use the pause glitch. If it works, then I'll see if it's possible to carry about three tiles of glitched movement to that same glitch point, and success will follow. Here's to good luck! As for the door to Area 3, untested it looks quite possible. Go to the second room, glitch into the wall you just came from and zip up into the corridor that leads to the Area 7 door. Go to that room, and use the same movement you used to get to the Area 2 door back in Area 1, and you'll very quickly appear in the Area 3 door room! I'll do a test. --shoot. The glitch in the second room of Area 2 won't work at the very first door. One tile off. Bah! We have two options now: Go through room 2 using the pause glitch to get up, around, and down to a door, glitch into a wall, go down a long tall room, and then continue to the Area 7 door like in any old run, or do the glitched path that leads to the boss door and see if glitching in a wall there can shortcut us up to the same corridors. Geeeez, that second path looks really iffy, but if it works, it's perfect as a fallback for if we can't glitch into Area 8's boss door, since we would need to beat the Area 2 boss anyway.
Twisted_Eye
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Any progress on this? Playing around with this glitch myself, I figured out how to make zipping through Area 2 a breeze: http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/1314901400/Blaster%20Master%20%28E%29-0.fm2 Zipping into the Level 8 Boss door looks impossible, thanks to the fact that it's right over a big room with no walls there to zip up with. edit: WAIT, I have an idea. That intestinal-tract-like room before the final room in 8 has empty sky outside the walls, as opposed to solid walls like everywhere else in the game. It just might be possible to bounce over to the left, carry over 3 tiles of glitchiness from the room just left of where you start Area 8 in, and pop right into the boss dungeon's little door there... I'll see what I can come up with when I get home from work today.
Twisted_Eye
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Flying around in machines, throwing attacks at you that are easily reversed to attack her...who does that boss lady think she is? Dr. Robotnik? Real nice TAS here! Good job.
Twisted_Eye
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Amazing finds! A glitched out run like you have planned would be awesome! I'd still like to see a full game run on the side, though, although I guess skipping Area 4 using the door glitch would be a bad idea then.
Twisted_Eye
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The action was good. You did an excellent job managing those bosses. The manipulation looked good, and most of the questions I had while watching were answered. Still...Wow. An hour of walking. That's a lot of fast forward. Not that that should necessarily deter publication--we wouldn't have Final Fantasy and similar otherwise. I say good run.
Twisted_Eye
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alden wrote:
For mem watch you need to install Python 2.4 (specifically that version) and also not use the new 1.16 build of dega...
hahaha, somehow I have 2.6 and 2.5.4 installed but not 2.4. Thanks much! I'll see if I can use it without desyncing. And sadly I AM using Vista. New computer came with it. boo.
Twisted_Eye
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Thankfully, it turns out that that's what I need to have anyway. The run has enough damage boosts throughout that I need to be prepared, and since bosses give a whole heart of health when killed, I have enough to keep the alarm from sounding and still bounce off of snakes as necessary. Almost done with Round 2. I'm doing a lot of thought for the rest of the run. I'll put off getting the Legendary Boots until after the pyramid--The 72 gold you get from the Sphinx makes sitting around waiting for coins to drop earlier a waste of time, and there's a shoe store right at the start of the next area anyway. I really need to figure out how to get the Python fietures working in Dega on my PC. Memory tools will make planning much easier. Is the gauntlet worth waiting for? Is every sword necessary to pick up? edit: Here's the WIP. Beats Round 3 it does. http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/811457804/Wonder%20Boy%202%20-%20WIP%203.mmv I won't post WIPs from now on like this probably. This here though is a good watch.
Twisted_Eye
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Holy crap. I always TAS with the sound turned off on the emulator, so when I rewatched my WIP just now I discovered an unfortunate fact about being as fast as possible: Having HP as low as possible turns on an incredibly irritating low-health-warning noise. Should the run go as quickly as possible by keeping the health as low as possible, or should the health stay just above one full heart to keep the wretched alarm from ruining the entertainment of watching?
Twisted_Eye
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Oh, I didn't see that last post there. I've been reworking my WIP--I noticed that I screwed up big at the end, since my health was still full. Every quarter-heart drained during the 'Completed!' screen is 7 frames lost, and every quarter-heart given back is another 4 frames lost, or about 3/4s a second for every full heart remaining, and I was full! Using an interesting part of the left-right jumping glitch, I dropped my health to 0 using the larger snake (the smaller ones only drop it half) and tweaking my movements better I've cut off another couple seconds. I'll post it when I'm done with the stage proper. If you want to see how my style and your style compare framewise, just open up the emulator twice and put the windows next to each other, one running one mmv and the other the other. In the Graphics menu, make sure the both emulators are showing the button states and the frame counter. Then just watch how I do and compare it to yours with the frame counter and frame-by-frame replay, and strategy will reveal itself to you. http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/290853587/Wonder%20Boy%202%20-%20WIP%202-1.mmv Here's the new WIP. Every part of the stage is improved over what I showed last time. Damage-boosting off the last snake like you did was a good idea; your run was just littered with good ideas everywhere, really! Rewatching your whole run, I wondered about that Wizard that gives 10 lightnings. Maybe it really is worth it, but I'd like to use Memory Watch to check how much damage everything is doing to see for sure. Heck, maybe even skipping one of the swords saves time in the long run. Poking through the ram would be the way to go there.
Twisted_Eye
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This game could instead be said to be a rip-off of Psycho Fox for the Master System, except for the fact that the two games (and another, Decapattack) were all made by the same guy. Psycho Fox already has a run here, but it uses warps. I guess this game doesn't have any. I'd watch and rate if I had my stuff near me, but it sounds like a good watch.
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