Posts for cetaka


Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Player (98)
Joined: 10/10/2010
Posts: 13
did you mess around at all with the invincibility glitch? i remember briefly trying to figure out how it worked but couldn't nice job on the tas by the way, looks pretty sweet. im glad someone finished it :)
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Player (98)
Joined: 10/10/2010
Posts: 13
It's the fastest place to lose lives before the deathwarp back to water town after the second dungeon. My friend found that you can kill yourself right after you beat the prologue boss and not lose any frames, so in the final run there'll be one less suicide in lab 1. There are other rooms in the first two labyrinths where killing yourself to go back to the entrance can save time, probably, but I wasn't really thinking about that at the time lol
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Player (98)
Joined: 10/10/2010
Posts: 13
It's been a while! Someone showed me an invincibility glitch (video here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=05AzvLxH15E) which should save a bunch of time in the desert overworld and the second dungeon (no need to avoid those stupid electricity). The comment on the video explains how to do it. I was messing around trying to get it off of other damage sources, but didn't get anywhere so far. I'm not sure how much time it would save. Also, a while ago I did a semi-optimised first labyrinth (video here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hO77DL55Xqo) and using that I ended up being 50 seconds late/90 seconds early to nightfall at the zombie caravan loading zone. (Time doesn't pass in the second labyrinth but it does in the first so I needed to do the first reasonably well to get an idea of how much time I'd have). Saving 50 seconds is impossible barring a new glitch. 90 extra seconds might be enough time to make getting the monkey claw worth it since it should save some transformations in the third labyrinth (you can do rooms where you knock the eyeball into the hole in monkey form), but I don't have a third labyrinth route pinned down yet so I'm not sure.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Player (98)
Joined: 10/10/2010
Posts: 13
Good luck finishing the run, it looks really nice so far!
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Player (98)
Joined: 10/10/2010
Posts: 13
Well okay I couldn't quite make the faster elevator, and at this point it doesn't seem possible to get there, so I played through the entire prologue: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0xRKnyjX-HM I think it's only about 4.2 seconds faster than the above WIP over 5 minutes but there wasn't much to optimize...
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Player (98)
Joined: 10/10/2010
Posts: 13
i'm 3-4 frames short of the making the platform before it retracts, which is really sucky and discouraging. any ideas? http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/898316662/shantae1.vbm i guess the most pressing thing that i don't understand about the game right now is how to predict (and therefore optimize) how shantae clips through from the bottom to the top of some platforms. i was looking for a subpixel memory address that would maybe address this but couldn't find one yet. it didn't seem to be anywhere near the x and y position addresses.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Player (98)
Joined: 10/10/2010
Posts: 13
okay, here's my attempt to integrate monkey claw into the route (in the run you would deathwarp back to water town instead of scuttle, and continue to labyrinth 3). only ~5760 frames (~96 seconds) contribute to the day/night timer, leaving about a minute's worth of input where it's not incrementing, including the extra time needed to buy the storm puffs. in regards to the route shown in the video itself, it seemed like switching to monkey at the beginning was justified because of how much faster you can move through the first map but i mostly did it out of laziness. i tried to harm myself outside as much as possible. assuming that there's enough extra time before the next nightfall to get all the gems in the overworld which is probably fair since the above movie is lazy as was my approximation of the extra time (you would need 110 instead of 85, so you couldn't rely mostly on the spiders; after those i guess the small worms in the waterfall map wouldn't be horribly slow), getting the monkey claw would still have to make up for that extra minute when time isn't passing. other than disabling the steam engine it might speed up boss fights if the claw does more than 1 damage or something, i'll have to test some stuff. i think if it turns out to be close it would be worth getting anyway just for entertainment's sake. also in the above video the weird teleport that occurs after killing the weather vane guy can be used to get out of bounds in that cave. i was hoping that all of those caves would be connected in one out of bounds area or something but it didn't seem like they were, the game was crashing before i even went farther horizontally than the cave itself...
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Player (98)
Joined: 10/10/2010
Posts: 13
I did try detouring to pick up the monkey claw last week (the most opportune point seems to be after the deathwarp to water town after lab 2) but it didn't seem to save time based on a vague approximation of the different times involved. I wasn't very confident though so we'll have to do a more realistic test later. It definitely seems like it will eat up more time than there is extra daylight (and that's not including the time where daytime doesn't pass along the way) since in particular it would require another deathwarp to get back to water town starting from four lives. If that ends up not panning out then, at least, the extra time can be used to get all the necessary gems instead of getting some in the prologue, since time doesn't pass there. There could definitely still be a different route that ends up being faster overall though as you said. AKheon: I did notice that at some point but the little extra distance doesn't really seem to help clear any gap that I've seen. The monkey form lets you jump a lot farther and higher, though there is a lot of transforming overhead, so it could still be useful somewhere... Also I guess I forgot to post this video here, it shows the route in the fourth labyrinth using the out of bounds trick: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k8eWjzHMtbc (starting from getting the flight form) edit: rewatching that video reminded me of something else I haven't investigated yet: manipulating the block puzzles in the fourth labyrinth and the column puzzles in the first labyrinth to be finished easily. I think I noticed that they started out differently in two different playthroughs but now I'm not so sure; I'll try to find them in memory at some point.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Player (98)
Joined: 10/10/2010
Posts: 13
prologue walk to water town (85 gems) buy flash bolts and 3 exit candies, save, talk to bolo labyrinth 1 (get warp squids) walk to oasis town use warp squids, talk to sky labyrinth 2 deathwarp to water town walk to zombie caravan, talk to and race the zombie labyrinth 3 warp to oasis town walk to bandit town talk to risky labyrinth 4 warp to oasis town spy scope the biggest problem with this route right now is that in an extremely unoptimized test-run (played in real-time for the easy parts) i was a minute late getting to the caravan while it was still night. there really wasn't that much slack in the overworld parts of the testrun, so it leaves me with more than a minute of waiting around for nightfall outside the entrance to bandit caravan (day and night take 8192 frames each). this is....bad, since i can't find anything to do with the spare overworld time that doesn't waste time overall, other than doing all suicides for the deathwarp in the overworld. potentially i could just waste time in an entertaining way before then.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Player (98)
Joined: 10/10/2010
Posts: 13
I came up with a route for this game that's pretty similar to the above but saves at water town (and deathwarps there) instead of relying on the initial save location at scuttle town. It seems like this would end up saving a lot of time, mostly because you don't actually have to talk to mimic after completing the fourth labyrinth; you can just warp to oasis and use the spy scope immediately. I'm a little hesitant to start this, though, because it's probably going to be about an hour in length. Is there any interest in a completed run? also, I managed to get OoB in the fourth labyrinth (as seen in this video) and with the bird form it seems promising in that you can fly to the boss room in a lot less time than it would take to get the extra keys and go up there normally. The problem is that I can't see any way of getting back in bounds. Strange things also happened when I moved too far out of bounds: most of the time the game froze, but a few times I just died and respawned normally with Shantae flashing back and forth every few frames between her normal appearance and this: I don't know if it's an emulation glitch or not but it would probably be worth investigating. If anybody's interested I uploaded a savestate. edit: you can get back in-bounds the same way you get out and by some great coincidence there's a similar hole near the boss door that saves a big chunk of time in the dungeon itself as well as letting me do without an exit candy.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Player (98)
Joined: 10/10/2010
Posts: 13
MUGG wrote:
I tried to start an improvement just recently, but I was demotivated by the fact that ball movement carries over from room to room... There are so many possibilities and you could spend hundreds of thousands of rerecords on this game. :P http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/1491383994/mugg-mario-ball-tas.vbm I didn't get really far... My first room is 1 frame faster than yours.
Nice! I was so focused on getting in the cannon in one shot I don't think I even tried to optimize a two-shot strategy. Usually as soon as I got the particular strategy that I had in mind to work I usually just accepted it and moved on unless it looked really bad or something; there's little chance that any single room in this run is optimal. My desk was/still is littered with search trees I drew of different paths to take for some rooms so that I didn't waste any time, haha. The other problem is that even hexing that single frame of difference into my movie causes the game to lag slightly differently in the fish boss (Mario moves the same way so the same shots would work but they would have to be taken at different frames). If there's a way to automate the process of adjusting the movie with a lua script or something (I wouldn't know how) it would obviously make it a lot easier to improve this and future runs of the game.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Player (98)
Joined: 10/10/2010
Posts: 13
In Monkey Temple Ruins, there seem to be two ways of going down a ledge - jumping before it such that you just skirt the corner (or further out if it suits you) and glitchily walking off the edge. When is one better than the other?
If there weren't any obstacles then jumping to land on the floor below is faster. Reasons not to do that were situational because the glitchy air running lets you change direction at will and start somersaults in midair.
For instance, at 3:35 you jumpkick to a ledge then glitchily walk off of it - would waiting just a bit and falling with more momentum get you down faster?
You can get down faster but you get stuck for a relatively long time at the lowered ceiling when you try to somersault.
Similarly for other places like 4:31
Changing direction immediately saves time because if you jump later you still have to kick the monkey to get past him and you have no way of turning back around until you hit the ground.
and 5:23.
Early somersault again but I think that that one was the same number of frames as jumping past and turning around.
Pulling yourself up at 5:09 looks quite costly - it's not possible to delay the jump and skip it?
I couldn't find a way over that ledge without climbing over the edge. That happened a few times in level 8 too. When I tried to wall climb through it I just got stuck in midair but I wasn't really sure why.
Nothing else seems obviously improvable, so assuming you've attempted to optimize everything using every quirk of the engine you know I doubt someone with less experience of the game could improve it outside of random frames/discovering a trick through serendipity.
Thanks! Even though I already know you
Post subject: Kim Possible
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Player (98)
Joined: 10/10/2010
Posts: 13
I worked on a full game movie of this game for the past 6 weeks or so. This is the first TAS that I've ever attempted so I'm not feeling very confident about it, and I was hoping to get some opinions from more experienced players. (sort of low quality) encode: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dRK--JUK2qM input file: http://cetaka.deanyderkheiser.net/kimpossible.vbm