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Samsara wrote:
Execution looks good throughout most of the run, but after cross-referencing the RTA WRs for both old and current patches, I noticed both of them have faster Mario fights. I presume the old patch fight is significantly faster due to it being on the old patch with the jankier collision, but the comparable WR's fight is faster because it does end up getting a 2 cycle second phase. Given it's at the very end of the run, I'd suggest looking into that fight a little more. There's a possibility that Ruffle makes a 2 cycle impossible for the TAS as well, it'd be nice to have further confirmation if that's the case.
Also, can Mario's pattern be manipulated mid-fight? Even if a 2 cycle is impossible, some heavy manipulation would save an immense amount of time on it, assuming it's possible.
From what I have tested and have understood, RNG is determined at the startup of the game (more specifically the configured system time in libTAS. this TAS starts at the unix epoch as its the default setting). I have tested this by editing the TAS to wait several seconds outside the door to the Mario fight and the pattern seems to be the same. Starting up the TAS with a different system time in libTAS causes the peach fight to desync, suggesting that the peach fight does indeed have RNG with the flowers, which you can see if you compared the RTA WR with the TAS (the RNG is also randomized for the Mario fight). As for the second phase of the Mario boss fight... This is where it gets weird. I'm unsure how the boss hits count in the game but the TAS seems like it makes more hits on the fight but yet it doesn't defeat the boss as quickly. For example, if we were to say that every jump sound that the koopa makes on the mario's belly counts as a hit, then the stats look like this:
RTA: 4 hits, 4 hits.
TAS: 5 hits, 6 hits, 1 hit.
But of course that assumes that's how the game counts a hit so this could be the incorrect way that the game counts boss hits. This *could* be a difference with ruffle vs. flash maybe...? or maybe I hit the boss too fast...? or maybe the boss's health is randomized...? I don't know. But for whatever reason, I couldn't get a two-cycle despite seemingly getting more hits. I'm sorry but I can't answer that question with certainty. Also, the unix epoch seed that I got for the first phase of the Mario boss fight seemed to be bad compared to the RTA WR, which is just unfortunate. I did not test RNG before I worked on the TAS, since I did not understand how it worked for this game yet.
Also for mid-fight manipulation, it seems there is no manipulation that can be done. When I was reTASing this fight while working on it initially (re-recording certain parts of the fight), all the moves appeared to be the exact same, despite differences in input, amount of hits on boss, etc..
One last note with RNG seeds from my testing. In other flash game I have tested with different system times (Bomber Blastic), the RNG does appear to be determined by system time startup and nothing else.
Hopefully this is some somewhat useful info to determine your judgement for this TAS Samsara. Thank you for commenting.
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MrTASer wrote:
At around 0:23 in the encode, isn't it possible to save time if jumping downwards in the pit instead of free falling?
YES Vote
i assume you are referring to the entrance door in the pit. if so, no. and thats because gravity in this game is linear so jumping into a fall does not make it faster than just running off of it. in this particular instance with the door and pit, jumping downwards in that spot would require you to stop for some frames to make a jump before moving again to fall downwards toward the door. its faster to just drop there. thanks for the question and thanks for your yes vote. im glad you enjoyed it!
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WarHippy wrote:
You end up throwing away a lot of darts. Is there any level that would actually benefit from Unlimited Dart Mode?
All the ones with extra darts left over would be a little faster since tossing them takes a little bit of time (around 9 to ~30 frames per dart depending on where the monkey is located in the level and the situation). The level automatically completes when meeting the target in UDM. I mainly chose the No UDM category because it's more difficult in RTA runs since, of course, you can fail the level when you run of out darts without meeting the target. This TAS in particular is faster than the RTA record by about two and a half minutes. The current RTA record for any% No UDM according to speedrun.com is 6m 52s. The UDM record is 6m 08s. I would guess that playing any% UDM saves about 15 seconds for the TAS compared to No UDM.
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Spikestuff wrote:
Author input overextends and should end at frame 316.
Created my own movie file which improves over that by 5 frames.
Not doing anything with this file as mentioned prior this is a bug on Ruffle as this is the unintended behavior compared to normal "gameplay".
Also on observation, you have your RTA timing listed wrong on your title.
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Patashu wrote:
I think this is worth discussing - is it possible to do this RTA? Is it a valid kind of 'input'? I know that with consoles we allow things like U+D, 30Hz mashing, the unused 15th and 16th button on the SNES controller, etc. because the console will physically accept these and it's possible to craft or use a peripheral that will send these signals. But in the context of a video game running on a computer, the context is less clear - is it a valid input if the computer can send it to the game, or does there need to be a way for hardware to send the input to the computer that the computer would pass on first?
That's some good questions. With the RTA question, It is technically possible to do this RTA with flash player by adjusting the game window itself and if you had a monitor that was 9999999 pixels in length or had some sort of third-party software that would let you drag your mouse and window outside the visible screen of your OS's desktop, letting you replicate the TAS (with the launch speed). Though clearly not intentional, it can still be done. But on a website like ArmorGames, which hosted this Flash game, it is not possible to do that since the game is displayed in its original resolution that cannot be changed (unless you maybe inspect element the website) since it's embedded on the website. In ruffle, dragging the launcher band off the game window isn't restricted like in Flash Player.
Here's a video of what I'm talking about:
Link to video
(If you can't see the video posted, this is the YouTube video id 2FdUzYGX2XE. I've never posted to the forums here before so I don't know if it will work.)
In the video, notice the mouse and border behaviors shown and the differences between Flash Player and Ruffle. Flash player without the resolution altered will not let you pull the launcher band outside the game's border. The only way to get around this is to alter the window of Flash Player itself to launch the band further but will still not let you pull it off the window entirely. In ruffle, there is no restriction. You can pull it as far as your monitor's length. I'm not sure if this would be considered a "valid" input since how far you can pull it really depends on your monitor's length or if you can move it outside the length of your monitor at all.
