Yeah, finally done! My first try of 100% of this hack! It's quite optimized but it's entertain so please enjoy ;)
Emulator used: Snes9x v1.43 +v13
Goal of the run:
Trying to bring something entertainment :P
Try to complete the game as fast as possible (it's in-game timer! Since there are plenty of items and door transitions, aim for real-time doesn't sound nice :P) (actually I'm bad at real-time ==") And in-game completed time is: 44:33.25
Take damage to save time
Manipulated luck
About the hack: Oh, Cpadolf wrote quite details about this in his run, plus my English is not good, so... :P
Main content: items of this hack
Besides Samus' equipment (14), there are 28 Energy Tanks, 46 Missile packs, 25 Super Missile packs, 25 Power Bomb packs and 4 Reserve Tanks, in total of 144 items! Each item takes 400 frames to play the collecting music, that means 144 items will take 57600 frames (=960s =16m) (Exactly 16 minutes just to hear the collecting music XD)
Each Energy Tank values 50, Missle pack values 5, Super Missile pack value 2, Power Bomb pack value 2, Reserve Tank value 100
3 Unknown items: they are Plasma Beam (in Tourian), Space Jump (in Kraid's lair) and Screw Attack (in Ridley's lair), they're only functional after getting Gravity Suit, and you must get them all to be able to reach to Gravity Suit
Note 1: These 2 Missile packs and 2 Energy Tanks can only be acquired on the escaping way after killing Mother Brain, but you can come back later!
Note 2: The Power Bomb A will disappear after Mother Brain's death, meanwhile the Power Bomb B can only be acquired after that!
Note 3: This Missile pack is very difficult to get! First, to be able to get to its room, you must destroy the shuttles infront of it, and they can only be destroyed with combo Plasma + Wave + Ice Beam, therefore you have to get all 3 Unknown Items and Gravity Suit. Second, you have to do X-Ray climb up, Crystal Flash and carefully space jump (or bomb jump) above 1-way brige!
Note 4: These items are only available after Mother Brain is death, therefore, a de-tour to Tourian is a must!
The Power Bomb C in Tourian and the Power Bomb D in Chozoria are related to each other, if you get 1 of them, both will disappear
X-Ray Scope is place neither in Tourian or Pirate Ship, and of course you can only get 1. The one in Tourian will disappear after Mother Brain's death, and the one in Pirate Ship requires to unlock 4 locks (they're not Security Locks) to get, therefore, get it in Tourian is faster!
Note 5: With or without TAS, you do need Wave Beam to be able to get it
Note 6: This Missile pack is very difficult to get in real-time, but it's not hard with TAS! All you have to do is keeping your speed echoes and avoid the laser beams (if you touch them, the shutter infront of that Missile pack will shutdown immediatly and it cannot be destroyed by anything! If that happens, you have to get out of the room and come back ;)
Note 7: This Missile packs can only be acquired after killing Draygon and have saved the animals, therefore it will be the last item to be obtained!
Note 8: This Missile pack is not as easy to get as it's be seen! You must avoid the Alarm in the Ship, and unlocked Security Lock 2 and 4!
Oh, Missile in this hack is very useful, since its dealy is 5, it's better than Super Missile at boss fighting!
Special thanks:
SB: for creating this awesome hack :D:D:D
Kriole: for showing me speed-trick, thank to him, this run is really speed up :D:D:D
Cpadolf: for giving me a lot of ideas by watching his run :D:D:D
lxx4xNx6xxl, Eye Of The Beholder, Tub: for supporting my run :)
JXQ: for giving me an up-to-date SMILE so I can see the map easily!
spweasel: for correcting me :P
Further improvements:
If this run's fall into Cpadolf's or Kriole's hand, I'm sure it will be better ;) Since they have obvious eyes to judge if there's any frame faster!
Yeah, I didn't take full advantage of "14 frames countdown" Speed Booster trick (What is it?! When you're shinesparking into spoiler, you have 14 frames to shinespark again without having to sitdown to charge (actually only 12 frames in action) I just realized later! But to be correct, I only miss 2 at Kraid's lair (which I can't come back duel to my time), but overall, I use it as much as I can!
The route is quite optimized, but taking Missile #3 before Mother Brain seems better (then you won't have to avoid refilling Reserve Tanks)
Yeah, if someone wants to improve this run (or even the any% run), we can continue discussion here
Anyway: Please enjoy the run! :3:3:3
Screenshot: (not suggested :P)
Nach: This run may not be perfect (which is quite hard to notice), but it was entertaining, and had great audience response. Accepting.
Joined: 6/23/2009
Posts: 2227
Location: Georgia, USA
Wow, nice! I'll be watching this shortly.
I know that at some point, somebody wrote a LUA script which fastforwards door transitions and item-collection music. Could somebody find that script? Thanks! (In fact, if someone had a script that only skipped item-collection music, that would be even better.)
Used to be a frequent submissions commenter. My new computer has had some issues running emulators, so I've been here more sporadically.
Still haven't gotten around to actually TASing yet... I was going to improve Kid Dracula for GB. It seems I was beaten to it, though, with a recent awesome run by Hetfield90 and StarvinStruthers. (http://tasvideos.org/2928M.html.)
Thanks to goofydylan8 for running Gargoyle's Quest 2 because I mentioned the game! (http://tasvideos.org/2001M.html)
Thanks to feos and MESHUGGAH for taking up runs of Duck Tales 2 because of my old signature!
Thanks also to Samsara for finishing a Treasure Master run. From the submission comments:
Shoutouts and thanks to mklip2001 for arguably being the nicest and most supportive person on the forums.
I'll vote after watching, but a couple things about your notes:
Note 1 is wrong as far as I can tell. I've gotten both Missile Packs and the less-obvious Energy Tank on a return trip through the area.
Note 3 isn't quite right either. While it was ridiculously hard, my brother and I just finished a 100% completion at 100% speed run earlier today. We used save states occasionally, but nothing is impossible at normal speed (the super-sort charge in Eastern Kraid's lair is probably the hardest for a non-TAS).
Power Bomb pack D is in Chozodia, not the Pirate Ship.
Also, you might want to credit danidub directly for the map, since he's the one who made it (with it being mirrored on Metroid Database).
Thanks, this is going to be interesting.
Edit: I think this is good enough as a first submission for a new category. Yes vote.
Joined: 10/28/2007
Posts: 1360
Location: The dark horror in the back of your mind
I don't quite know what to make of this. It probably speaks volumes to note that the two most interesting things I saw in this run not already covered by other material currently or about-to-be published were the speedboost-in-water oddity and the fact that the Etecoons now introduce themselves with a rendition of the item collection theme...
Without outside reference, I'm not really in a position to comment on the technical aspects of this run, but some of your comments allude to your own thoughts on the matter:
Run comments wrote:
If this run's fall into Cpadolf's or Kriole's hand, I'm sure it will be better ;)
This is basically a big red flag saying "I think this run can be improved". Why would you not have run this by one or the other of them before submitting it?
(Incidentally, looking into the thread for the hack turns up "[post 281277]it's not optimized at all[/post]". I don't think there's any real excuse to submit a run you don't think is optimised.)
Run comments wrote:
Yeah, I didn't take full advantage of "14 frames countdown" Speed Booster trick
According to the input file, you started creation of this run on 6 July; this was after at least [post 277291]one oddity in speed booster behaviour[/post] was drawn to your attention, and after cpadolf had started work on his own run (which apparently incorporates the trick).
I ask: when was this drawn to your attention, and how far in making this run were you when it was? If it wasn't too long after you started, I don't see why you would not have began to incorporate it into your own run once you were made aware of it (possibly even before you reached the point of having the speed booster in the first place).
Given that the author of the run is probably in one of the best positions to comment on level of technical skill, I think it's safe to say that this run can be done better than this shows.
Thus, to my eye, the run fails on technical and entertainment merits and I must vote No.
Joined: 7/17/2004
Posts: 985
Location: The FLOATING CASTLE
If this run's fall into Cpadolf's or Kriole's hand, I'm sure it will be better ;)
Perhaps this is true but I think the author is being a bit modest here. It looks pretty well optimized to me.
I don't know, every room looks fast but it's overall quite long and tedious. I had trouble staying awake. Like other hacks I've seen, the map layout is neat but there aren't many enemies in your way and so it's really just an orgy of running and jumping really fast. Meh vote.
If this run's fall into Cpadolf's or Kriole's hand, I'm sure it will be better ;)
This is basically a big red flag saying "I think this run can be improved". Why would you not have run this by one or the other of them before submitting it?
I came to TAS since I watched their Super Metroid TAS, in other word, they're my idols, they have talent that I have not, but I was trying my best, with this TAS! They can figure out what is faster and what is not, so I said, this can be better with their hands! And, obviously, nothing is perfect at the first try! Although I know this is not as optimized as it should be, but it will be a good document for further TASes of this hack!
sgrunt wrote:
(Incidentally, looking into the thread for the hack turns up "[post 281277]it's not optimized at all[/post]". I don't think there's any real excuse to submit a run you don't think is optimised.)
I said it because I am not so confident, since I watched what Cpadolf did, he's really amazing!
sgrunt wrote:
Run comments wrote:
Yeah, I didn't take full advantage of "14 frames countdown" Speed Booster trick
According to the input file, you started creation of this run on 6 July; this was after at least [post 277291]one oddity in speed booster behaviour[/post] was drawn to your attention, and after cpadolf had started work on his own run (which apparently incorporates the trick).
I ask: when was this drawn to your attention, and how far in making this run were you when it was? If it wasn't too long after you started, I don't see why you would not have began to incorporate it into your own run once you were made aware of it (possibly even before you reached the point of having the speed booster in the first place).
Yes, when review the TAS, I realized that I miss 2 of it at Kraid's Lair, just when I'm about to submit it! What can I do?!
sgrunt wrote:
Thus, to my eye, the run fails on technical and entertainment merits and I must vote No.
The run seems good to me, despite some minor improvements implemented by Kriole and Cpadolf in the beginning that you didn't incorporate to your run (probably because you were already far ahead), most of the run is different. The shinespark is really a crazy trick to cross the rooms. I think the Hacker did a good job in this game and i really enjoyed the rooms he created. I really liked the Crateria rooms from Super Metroid in ZM graphics, and Torian too. Though i think the Hacker put too much itens in the game, maybe it was better to left the same amount of the original SM. Anyway i really liked the run and found myself laughing with some crazy tricks you did, Very well done, Hoandjzj.
Regarding your talent vs Cpadolf/Kriole: I don't think you are less talented than any of them. The thing here is just a matter of experience, imo. They've been playing/TASing Super Metroid for longer than you, as far as i'm concerned, so they can see somethings that you don't. But even you can see things they don't. Cpadolf started optimizing your any% run, but left some minor optimizations behind and kriole found it, but it doesn't make Kriole more talented than Cpadolf. Cpadolf finished the game but didn't see that Draygon trick you found later, and that doesn't make you more talented than Cpadolf. I think that the main reason that TASers post wips in the forum is exactly to see if someone find something they didn't see, cause we all see things in a different way.
Edit: Yes vote!
I think to say this "isn't optimized at all" is completely incorrect. There were some clever ways of getting some of these items (Super Missile in Tourian using X-Ray to keep speed echoes and fall through the intended exit, for example). I think the technical quality of this run is quite good. Not as technically good as cpadolf's recently submitted any% run, but better than either of hoandjzj's first submitted any% runs for this game, and I don't recall any noticeable mistakes.
I also think that voting for non-publication based on the author believing another TASer could do this better is a bad reason. The technical quality should be based on the perception from watching the run, not on text comments by the author (of which English is not their first language).
Also, we have this submission now, but we should wait until an undetermined point when a better one will be submitted? It seems like in times past, that has been called out as a problem by all but the hardcore runners of those games. Ocarina of Time is the example that comes to mind, but there are others that using as examples will make me look even more biased than that example did.
I also find it much more fun to watch a 100% run of this game because the hack is so impressive. The any% run shows very little.
<Swordless> Go hug a tree, you vegetarian (I bet you really are one)
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JXQ wrote:
I think to say this "isn't optimized at all" is completely incorrect. There were some clever ways of getting some of these items (Super Missile in Tourian using X-Ray to keep speed echoes and fall through the intended exit, for example). I think the technical quality of this run is quite good. Not as technically good as cpadolf's recently submitted any% run, but better than either of hoandjzj's first submitted any% runs for this game, and I don't recall any noticeable mistakes.
I also think that voting for non-publication based on the author believing another TASer could do this better is a bad reason.
Indeed. Aside from the obvious elitism issues of going down that road, I also don't like an environment where one feels the need to hide improvement possibilities for fear of rejection.
The technical quality should be based on the perception from watching the run, not on text comments by the author (of which English is not their first language).
Indeed.
Also, we have this submission now, but we should wait until an undetermined point when a better one will be submitted? It seems like in times past, that has been called out as a problem by all but the hardcore runners of those games. Ocarina of Time is the example that comes to mind
It is also a problem from a site management standpoint. In a case like this game, this is a very long TAS of a very complicated game. If we are demanding a perfect movie right from the start then we close the door on a lot of potentially awesome content for the site. A perfect movie of a game like this might be years from now, and in the meantime we would nothing. Also given the huge amount of work that is, we can't guarantee someone will devote the necessary time in the first place.
Also, a lot could be said & debated on that particular subject, but that is beyond the scope of this submission thread. The summary is that I welcome solid movies that impress, but are improvable.
There has been a precedent for rejecting a run because a better one is in production (see #668: atro_city's Genesis Streets of Rage 3 in 46:18.77) but it's a bad one, IMO, because what if the authors of the "better" run lose motivation and quit, as apparently happened with the example I linked?
Additionally, known improvements are no longer a reason for rejection; see the Judge Guidelines stemming from Nach re-decision on #2521: GlitchMan's NES Mega Man 4 in 34:00.02.
Personally, I was hugely entertained by this one. I love Super Metroid and all of its' incarnations, and this delivered almost non-stop action, and lots of clever sequence breaking. Strong YES vote.
Absolute yes vote. This run was sensational. I don’t understand how people can vote yes on snorefest GBC and NES TASes while voting no on a gem like this. With this new speedbooster exploit, this game is starting to look more like Sonic than Super Metroid. It was truly a pleasure seeing room after room zipped through at a furious pace. I just wish this game weren’t so faithful to Zero Mission as to take out bosses like Phantoon, Spore Spawn, 2nd half of the Mother Brain battle, etc.
Wow, nice! I'll be watching this shortly.
I know that at some point, somebody wrote a LUA script which fastforwards door transitions and item-collection music. Could somebody find that script? Thanks! (In fact, if someone had a script that only skipped item-collection music, that would be even better.)
while true do
istop = memory.readbyte(0x7E0009)
dstop = memory.readbyte(0x7E05F5)
estop = memory.readbyte(0x7E0E18)
-- Items, Doors, Elevators
if istop+dstop+estop > 0 then
snes9x.speedmode("maximum")
else
if istop+dstop+estop < 1 then
snes9x.speedmode("normal")
end
end
snes9x.frameadvance()
end
Where it first says snes9x.speedmode, you can change the settings to “turbo” or “nothrottle” if “maximum” is too fast for you.
I tried to make an encode running this script, but the act of encoding seems to disable the effect of the script :( Any ideas why this might be?
I don't know, every room looks fast but it's overall quite long and tedious. I had trouble staying awake. Like other hacks I've seen, the map layout is neat but there aren't many enemies in your way and so it's really just an orgy of running and jumping really fast. Meh vote.
This is why the turbo script should be attached to the submission notes :P To each their own, but this is one of the few runs I got through in one sitting without getting bored, which is saying a lot because many submission bore me in the first few minutes.
I'm not really in a position to comment on the technical aspects of this run, but some of your comments allude to your own thoughts on the matter:
Run comments wrote:
If this run's fall into Cpadolf's or Kriole's hand, I'm sure it will be better ;)
This is basically a big red flag saying "I think this run can be improved". Why would you not have run this by one or the other of them before submitting it?
(Incidentally, looking into the thread for the hack turns up "it's not optimized at all". I don't think there's any real excuse to submit a run you don't think is optimised.)
As a TASer, I know that authors are always their own worst critics, and Hoandizi is clearly a particularly humble guy based on his posting nature. He’s simply not giving his own work enough credit, and there’s absolutely no reason his run should be rejected because of his own modesty.
Yes, I don’t doubt that if we had some superteam of Taco/Kriole/Cpadolf/HeroOfTheDay/NameSpoofer/Saturn working on a 100% run it would be better. But here’s the problem:
-As someone who’s watched a lot of Super Metroid runs, I believe I am in a position to say this is sufficiently optimized for publication. You don’t need a complex run of a complex hack to be subpixel optimized on a first submission!
-Who’s to say anyone will ever develop the motivation to obsolete this? As technical quality increases, the amount of time that goes into a run increases exponentially, and often this has a paralysing effect on run progress. Far too many popular games suffer this affliction. Why spare viewers of amazing runs because a slightly better one could be made, but never will?
-If the author were arrogant and boasted about the optimization level of his run, or didn’t comment at all about the quality of his work, would you be prompted to vote differently?
-As other people have pointed out, rejecting a run for having known improvements doesn’t hold water anymore, nor do I think it should. Nobody should be expected to re-do an hour long run to save a tiny amount of frames at the beginning of the game, for instance. Such a rule should only apply if the improvement is sufficiently significant or easily editable, and I don’t think either applies to the 14 frame countdown trick.
-Who’s to say anyone will ever develop the motivation to obsolete this? As technical quality increases, the amount of time that goes into a run increases exponentially, and often this has a paralysing effect on run progress. Far too many popular games suffer this affliction. Why spare viewers of amazing runs because a slightly better one could be made, but never will?
Cpadolf wrote:
I've always been very drawn to TASing Super Metroid, but the original has at this point reached a level where it's essentially all work and no play
I'm still kinda bummed that all the bosses (save Draygon) get skipped, since they provide nice breaks in the action and a way for Samus to show off her combat prowess. I think maybe the hack creator went overboard in making stuff skippable. :)
The run looked good to me, though I do admit my attention wavered at points. Blame that on a combination of the run being long and my being tired and a bit sick. I think this is a strong run of a good hack.
Pyrel - an open-source rewrite of the Angband roguelike game in Python.
after watching this video, i am left stunned and awestruck, single word echoed through my brain as i watched this run: IMPOSSIBLE! sheer speed of of this run boggled my own mind, i was like, is this super metroid sonic?!? if i could vote, i would have voted resounding YES!
Hoandjzj, dont sell yourself short, i have watched your various SM hack runs, your technical quality might not be at par of Cpadolf's or Saturn's calibere but pure entertainment and speed it displayed is to be commended, especially this submission, its a work of an art, you just proved that SM TASing isnt boring chore, but a true masterpiece.
Of course this is improvable, even the non-hacked 100% is, after countless iterations of several excellent TASers.
But when watching the run, I couldn't find a single spot that looked slow or unoptimized.
In fact, the run managed to surprise me several times with clever application of known tricks or clever abuse of this hack's changed mechanics.
The route looks good. It employs a lot of non-obvious sequence breaks, including some breaks that weren't seen in previous submissions or youtube-runs.
Yes vote.
this run looks solid and the hack make a refreshing point of view on the game
the shinspark frenzy is awesome and keep the entertainement almost for the whole run.
it clearly deserve a yes vote.
This is a really, really nice run.
Is it improvable? Yes. As are all of the currently published Super Metroid runs. And both the 100% run and the normal any% run where published with known improvements in existence (I don't think the newest glitched any% had any at the time, but it has been proven improvable since).
Is this run by any means technically sub par? Absolutely not. It has an overall good level of optimization, surely on par with many runs, especially first generation runs, that has been published on this site in recent memory. Few things really stuck out to me as looking sloppy. More than that though, the run constantly impressed me with all the cleverness in its strategies, whether they were 100% optimal or not, and it's fast and entertaining as hell.
Big yes.
I just wish this game weren’t so faithful to Zero Mission as to take out bosses like Phantoon, Spore Spawn, 2nd half of the Mother Brain battle, etc.
To be fair, almost all of those are in the game in some capacity, it's just that the only "bosses" needed for 100% completion are Mother Brain to trigger wrecked Tourian (only kind of a boss in this game anyways) and the boss formerly known as Draygon to trigger the escape sequence. Everything else is skippable, though this run seems to indicate that beating Botwoon 2.0 is faster than avoiding it.
I just wish this game weren’t so faithful to Zero Mission as to take out bosses like Phantoon, Spore Spawn, 2nd half of the Mother Brain battle, etc.
To be fair, almost all of those are in the game in some capacity, it's just that the only "bosses" needed for 100% completion are Mother Brain to trigger wrecked Tourian (only kind of a boss in this game anyways) and the boss formerly known as Draygon to trigger the escape sequence. Everything else is skippable, though this run seems to indicate that beating Botwoon 2.0 is faster than avoiding it.
Yeah, if I recall correctly:
* Spore Spawn is in Kraid's Hideout. Kraid himself is one room to the left of the speed booster.
* Crocomire is somewhere in Norfair, naturally.
* Ridley is guarding a teleporter to the Pirate Ship (Hoandjzj uses the teleporter from the other side, then immediately re-enters it, to reset the alert level at one point)
* Phantoon is reworked as Mother Brain's ghost; normally you'd fight it/her when re-entering Tourian but evidently that can be worked around.
* Both Torizos are visited but not fought.
Incidentally, the way Tourian works in this hack is genius. Normally the initial run through has lots of space pirates, and the metroids are all locked up; after it explodes, you fight Mother Brain's ghost, then work your way back through exploded Tourian, fighting off all the Metroids that were freed from their glass tubes. Makes much more sense than MZM's "whoops the metroids got out lol" approach, and feels nicely creepy.
Pyrel - an open-source rewrite of the Angband roguelike game in Python.
This is why the turbo script should be attached to the submission notes :P To each their own, but this is one of the few runs I got through in one sitting without getting bored, which is saying a lot because many submission bore me in the first few minutes.
Where it first says snes9x.speedmode, you can change the settings to “turbo” or “nothrottle” if “maximum” is too fast for you.
I tried to make an encode running this script, but the act of encoding seems to disable the effect of the script :( Any ideas why this might be?
That's a good idea, Vykan :D it will save a lot of time for the audiance!
The emulator itself will disable the effect of the script, so you should use another movie capture to record :)
After the defeat of Mother Brain and the apparent destruction of Zebes in Super Metroid, famous bounty hunter Samus Aran found herself caught in a time portal, where Planet Zebes tried to live its last memories before facing its ultimate destruction. Samus winds up in a world that is a culmination of all the events of Metroid Zero Mission, Super Metroid, and other memories lost in the very fabric of time. Or this is just a very good hack of Super Metroid. We'll let you decide the real truth.
For Super Metroid, 100% has always simply meant that you collect all items (so that the game shows 100% item collection in the end sequence). The normal Super Metroid 100% run skips bosses as well.
