Topic by redrum331

Posted: 2/8/2014 5:38 PM

Post subject: Rerecord count definition

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redrum331

Joined: 5/11/2013
Posts: 1

I just read the definition from the glossary but want to make sure I got this right. So this is how many times the user loaded a save state and continued to play from that point? I saw one with almost 200,000 and thought how much time it must have taken. Thanks.

Posted: 2/8/2014 5:39 PM

Post subject: Re: Rerecord count definition

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Noxxa

They/Them

Moderator, Expert player (4138)

Joined: 8/14/2009
Posts: 4083
Location: The Netherlands

redrum331 wrote:

So this is how many times the user loaded a save state and continued to play from that point?

Yes.

http://www.youtube.com/Noxxa <dwangoAC> This is a TAS (...). Not suitable for all audiences. May cause undesirable side-effects. May contain emulator abuse. Emulator may be abusive. This product contains glitches known to the state of California to cause egg defects. <Masterjun> I'm just a guy arranging bits in a sequence which could potentially amuse other people looking at these bits <adelikat> In Oregon Trail, I sacrificed my own family to save time. In Star trek, I killed helpless comrades in escape pods to save time. Here, I kill my allies to save time. I think I need help.

Posted: 2/8/2014 5:43 PM

Post subject: Re: Rerecord count definition

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Ilari

Emulator Coder, Skilled player (1141)

Joined: 5/1/2010
Posts: 1217

redrum331 wrote:

I just read the definition from the glossary but want to make sure I got this right. So this is how many times the user loaded a save state and continued to play from that point? I saw one with almost 200,000 and thought how much time it must have taken. Thanks.

Well, although savestate loads made by Lua and other scripts shouldn't be counted, there are buggy runs that do count those, leading to greatly inflated rerecord count.

Posted: 2/8/2014 5:43 PM

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solarplex

Active player (469)

Joined: 2/1/2014
Posts: 928

Piggybacking question. are TASes usually done all in one file? or somehow stitched together with cumulative rerecords added?

Posted: 2/8/2014 8:07 PM

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WST

She/Her

Active player (442)

Joined: 10/6/2011
Posts: 1690
Location: RU · ID · AM

solarplex wrote:

Piggybacking question. are TASes usually done all in one file? or somehow stitched together with cumulative rerecords added?

Yep you can copy-paste certain parts of the input when you know what you are doing, but it’s completely up to the player to keep the consistent number of rerecords in such case. And most players do not really care about it, because everyone realizes that it’s not an indicator of the quality of the run. For instance, a TAS consuming 1000 rerecords, done by a very skilled player, can still be much better than a run consuming 10000 rerecords done by a newbie.

S3&A [Amy amy%] improvement (with Evil_3D & kaan55) — currently in SPZ2 my TAS channel · If I ever come into your dream, I’ll be riding an eggship :)

Posted: 2/8/2014 8:09 PM

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Ilari

Emulator Coder, Skilled player (1141)

Joined: 5/1/2010
Posts: 1217

solarplex wrote:

Piggybacking question. are TASes usually done all in one file? or somehow stitched together with cumulative rerecords added?

Usually done all in one file, given how nasty it is to stitch segments (for a lot of games it isn't even possible).

Posted: 2/8/2014 8:38 PM

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WST

She/Her

Active player (442)

Joined: 10/6/2011
Posts: 1690
Location: RU · ID · AM

I’d also like to add that many TASers use version control. Originally it’s meant to be a tool for programmers, but TASing in many ways is really similar to programming: the player is trying to find the algorithm of beating the game as quickly as possible, and writing the input file just like programmers write source code. From attempt to attempt the player is changing his input. This can often result in mistakes, data loss and other issues. VCS greatly helps to solve all of them, as well as it solves the cooperation problem. When you make your TAS together with another player, usually you have to send him your WIPs many times, and receive tons of WIPs back from him. VCS helps to avoid this mess by directing your cooperation in the straight-forward way.

S3&A [Amy amy%] improvement (with Evil_3D & kaan55) — currently in SPZ2 my TAS channel · If I ever come into your dream, I’ll be riding an eggship :)

Posted: 2/9/2014 10:40 AM

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Spikestuff

They/Them

Editor, Publisher, Expert player (2292)

Joined: 10/12/2011
Posts: 6337
Location: The land down under.

Piggyback question too: What classifies unknown rerecord count?

WebNations/Sabih wrote:

+fsvgm777 never censoring anything.

Disables Comments and Ratings for the YouTube account. Something better for yourself and also others.

Posted: 2/9/2014 7:45 PM

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Duderson

Joined: 1/4/2014
Posts: 15
Location: California

I saw a Mario 64 run and it had 1 million rerecords.

-Duderson

Posted: 2/9/2014 7:48 PM

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Ilari

Emulator Coder, Skilled player (1141)

Joined: 5/1/2010
Posts: 1217

Spikestuff wrote:

Piggyback question too: What classifies unknown rerecord count?

The site shows rerecord count of 0 as unknown. Sometimes rerecord count is zeroed when it is obviously way off and the author doesn't have any idea to even approximate...

Posted: 2/10/2014 12:24 AM

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Derakon

Joined: 7/2/2007
Posts: 3960

A thought: might it be worth tracking how many frames are "played" in the process of creating a TAS? Like, if the player plays 100 frames from the start of the movie, then reloads from 5 frames ago and rerecords those 5 frames, then the movie length would be 100 frames but the "total frames played" would be 105. Even more interesting would be tracking how many times each individual frame is played (i.e. the player recorded over frame 2040 a total of 50 times, etc.), so we could readily see which parts of a run caused the author the most trouble.

Pyrel - an open-source rewrite of the Angband roguelike game in Python.

Posted: 2/10/2014 3:25 AM

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jlun2

Skilled player (1706)

Joined: 9/17/2009
Posts: 4952
Location: ̶C̶a̶n̶a̶d̶a̶ "Kanatah"

Derakon wrote:

Even more interesting would be tracking how many times each individual frame is played (i.e. the player recorded over frame 2040 a total of 50 times, etc.), so we could readily see which parts of a run caused the author the most trouble.

That can be a problem if some trick/glitch was found that drastically cuts the movie's length though.

LLCoolDave wrote:

This seems to be competing for the "Worst looking TAS of 2011" Award.

Posted: 2/10/2014 4:47 AM

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Derakon

Joined: 7/2/2007
Posts: 3960

Well, sure, it wouldn't be useful in many cases, but it still could be interesting to look at for some movies. Maybe not worth the effort of implementing though.

Pyrel - an open-source rewrite of the Angband roguelike game in Python.

Posted: 2/10/2014 12:03 PM

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Warp

Banned User, Former player

Joined: 3/10/2004
Posts: 7698
Location: Finland

Derakon wrote:

A thought: might it be worth tracking how many frames are "played" in the process of creating a TAS? Like, if the player plays 100 frames from the start of the movie, then reloads from 5 frames ago and rerecords those 5 frames, then the movie length would be 100 frames but the "total frames played" would be 105. Even more interesting would be tracking how many times each individual frame is played (i.e. the player recorded over frame 2040 a total of 50 times, etc.), so we could readily see which parts of a run caused the author the most trouble.

A graph of that would be interesting... :)

Posted: 2/10/2014 12:10 PM

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