It does work on real iQue hardware. It could work on real N64 hardware in principle, but I don't think there is a heap manip for it yet.
Btw. in case some people haven't seen it yet. Here are some things you can do with ACE in this game: https://www.twitch.tv/videos/533026710?t=05h49m59s
Does this finally remove the last excuse not to make an updated tasvideos-legal TAS of this game?
The currently published run is pretty close to perfect with what was possible before ACE was found. As evidenced by the fact that it was even faster than RTA runs that used GIM on VC. So not sure what excuses you are refering to.
This ACE credit warp can be used on N64, so it can be used in a TAS, if that's what you mean. But somebody has to actually want to make such a TAS.
Also there are still things getting worked out. Maybe it's possible to skip ocarina and slingshot. Maybe not. We'll see.
So from what I gather it currently looks like you can probably either skip slingshot or ocarina, but not both.
Ocarina skip needs slingshot seeds dropping from a rock.
Slingshot skip obviously still needs Ocarina to manipulate camera.
Both would need special heap manipulations though. Not sure what would be faster.
The currently published run is pretty close to perfect with what was possible before ACE was found. As evidenced by the fact that it was even faster than RTA runs that used GIM on VC. So not sure what excuses you are refering to.
For a really, really long time nobody has been willing to make a TAS for the Wii VC version of the game. In some cases I have seen the strangest of reasons stated for that, such as "it would be boring because it would just be the same as the normal speedrun, just a bit faster" (which is ludicrous because as seen from the unofficial invalid N64 TAS, the TAS would be quite different). It's the only game I know of that nobody is interested of making a TAS of, because of such a silly reason.
But now that the new strat is actually doable on a N64, maybe now somebody would be willing to finally bring the TAS to the current decade (if the major hurdle has always been the need to make it a Wii TAS instead of a N64 one).
But now that the new strat is actually doable on a N64, maybe now somebody would be willing to finally bring the TAS to the current decade (if the major hurdle has always been the need to make it a Wii TAS instead of a N64 one).
Maybe, but a lot of people won't be interested in starting a TAS of the game just yet since it's likely that new strategies/routes will be found to save time over current strategies.
The currently published run is pretty close to perfect with what was possible before ACE was found. As evidenced by the fact that it was even faster than RTA runs that used GIM on VC. So not sure what excuses you are refering to.
For a really, really long time nobody has been willing to make a TAS for the Wii VC version of the game. In some cases I have seen the strangest of reasons stated for that, such as "it would be boring because it would just be the same as the normal speedrun, just a bit faster" (which is ludicrous because as seen from the unofficial invalid N64 TAS, the TAS would be quite different). It's the only game I know of that nobody is interested of making a TAS of, because of such a silly reason.
But now that the new strat is actually doable on a N64, maybe now somebody would be willing to finally bring the TAS to the current decade (if the major hurdle has always been the need to make it a Wii TAS instead of a N64 one).
Correct me if I'm wrong, but the real reason that there is no updated TAS is not because of the stated reasons above but simply because there is barely anybody outside there at the moment who is willing to do a full game TAS of a 3D Zelda in general. There have been only like 2-3 unofficial full game TASes and that's it.
Two very long TASes of OoT have been published on this site in 2017, an MM one in 2018, as well as various others that never got submitted. I think OoT TASing is doing fine.
Current project: Gex 3 any%
Paused: Gex 64 any%
There are no N64 emulators. Just SM64 emulators with hacky support for all the other games.
Another issue that has probably stopped people from trying to make an updated TAS for OOT is that the standard for optimization is so high that, for a given route, a TASer would need to make a TAS that's at most 4 frames off from the fastest possible time for a particular route.
It's hard to know when you're TASing if something is really "perfect" or if there's a slightly better way to do something that you just haven't thought of, and nobody wants to spend a month TASing OOT only to find out that they could have rolled somewhere where they side hopped to save 2 frames somewhere in the TAS, and have to start over from that point.
The complexity of movement in the game, and the fact that this is a 3D game instead of a simple 2D game like super mario brothers further decreases the likelihood that someone would want to make an any% TAS the game.
In any event, I think it will be at least 4 months before any TASer starts working on an any% TAS, since it's likely that new faster strategies for ACE or new route changes will be discovered by then which would obsolete the current route.
Two very long TASes of OoT have been published on this site in 2017, an MM one in 2018, as well as various others that never got submitted. I think OoT TASing is doing fine.
This is true, but the longer categories don't have the same level of extreme optimization as an any% TAS would.
At this point, probably more than half of an any% TAS would just be cutscenes, and the initial portion of the TAS up to getting sword could be copied from an earlier TAS. That leaves about 5 and a half minutes of actual gameplay to optimize.
If a good OOT TASer was interested, they could probably make a full TAS for any% in 2 weeks, with quality good enough that if it were another 3D N64 game, it would be easily published and considered to have amazing technical quality.
However, OOT has a higher standard associated with it for any% TASes, so there is a good chance that this would be rejected.
For some any% categories, it's kind of inevitable that they become less interesting, as the gameplay portions get smaller while the unskippable cutscenes remain the same. Still, even the "worst" any% category deserves an optimal TAS.
Current project: Gex 3 any%
Paused: Gex 64 any%
There are no N64 emulators. Just SM64 emulators with hacky support for all the other games.
The currently published run is pretty close to perfect with what was possible before ACE was found. As evidenced by the fact that it was even faster than RTA runs that used GIM on VC. So not sure what excuses you are refering to.
For a really, really long time nobody has been willing to make a TAS for the Wii VC version of the game. In some cases I have seen the strangest of reasons stated for that, such as "it would be boring because it would just be the same as the normal speedrun, just a bit faster" (which is ludicrous because as seen from the unofficial invalid N64 TAS, the TAS would be quite different). It's the only game I know of that nobody is interested of making a TAS of, because of such a silly reason.
But now that the new strat is actually doable on a N64, maybe now somebody would be willing to finally bring the TAS to the current decade (if the major hurdle has always been the need to make it a Wii TAS instead of a N64 one).
What it comes down to is that nobody was motivated to do such a TAS and that Dolphin's TAS tools are kinda shitty certainly didn't help.
Why didn't you make a TAS if you really wanted to see one? Was somebody holding a gun to your head?
What it comes down to is that nobody was motivated to do such a TAS and that Dolphin's TAS tools are kinda shitty certainly didn't help.
That's the impression I got as well. In other words, the fact that the (previous) any% route only worked on the Wii, not on the N64 (where the game just crashes), discouraged people from even bothering, perhaps because the Wii emulators are much less polished and convenient for TASing than the N64 emulators.
I would still love to see the non-ACE any% route TASed on the Wii emulator, but especially after this discovery I doubt that's ever going to happen (unless, perhaps, significant major improvements are done to the available TAS tools).
Why didn't you make a TAS if you really wanted to see one? Was somebody holding a gun to your head?
Incidentally, I did start making a TAS of OoT on the Wii some time ago, just to see how easy it would be. I got all the way to the sword and back to the main kokiri forest area, before I got a desync. I got quite frustrated at how inconvenient the TASing was using Dolphin (at least back then; I don't know if it has been improved since). I also noticed at this point that I hadn't turned off the emulation of the other 3 controllers, making the recording file really large, as well as some other minor settings that could have hindered the TAS. Essentially it was a situation where it would have been better to just start over from scratch, so I got discouraged.
It didn't especially help that I'm not exactly an OoT speedrunning expert, and I have very little knowledge of the internal details of most of the tricks, routes and glitches (especially the ones that are not used in the unassisted speedrun because they are not feasible for humans to do consistently). All these tricks and techniques can be seen in the unofficial N64 TAS (ie. the one that uses the (previous) any% route that normally crashes the console, but doesn't crash the emulator for some reason), and require a level of technical knowledge way beyond of what I have, or have time or willingness to research. An expert OoT speedrunner knows all these techniques to the utmost technical detail, but I'm not such a person.
A little off topic, but I was wondering Is a WESS faster than a HESS?
It depends on which speed you enter the water with. The water has only the effect of preserving your speed and therefor giving you the ability to switch into an ESS with that speed once you leave the water again. So if you enter the water using a mega flip, your WESS is going to have the same speed as when you do a normal HESS using a bomb. A jumpslash recoil on the other hand is slightly slower than a normal bomb recoil, so a WESS using this method is slower than a normal HESS ;)
