Topic by Johannes

Posted: 6/14/2008 12:15 AM

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Johannes

Former player

Joined: 12/1/2007
Posts: 425

that would be a normal glitch, so yes. not possible though

SM64.org

Posted: 6/14/2008 12:19 AM

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Raiscan

Joined: 11/11/2006
Posts: 1235
Location: United Kingdom

mr_roberts_z wrote:

I know this isn't really that relevant, but if, in theory, there were a way to get into Level Select without altering the ROM in any way (ie, no GameShark or anything like that; maybe just certain button presses or something....in theory), and use it to go directly to BitS, would that count as a valid way of beating the game on this site?

That sounds an awful lot like a level select code method, which of course isn't allowed. Even some sort of way into the level select through non-conventional means seems a bit dicey. I think executing parts of level select code would be fine though.

<adelikat> I am annoyed at my irc statements ending up in forums & sigs

Posted: 6/14/2008 2:00 AM

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blahmoomoo

Joined: 2/1/2008
Posts: 347

If you could get to the level select without codes, you could just go straight to the final Bowser level and beat the game without keys at all! What fun would that be? (unless the final Bowser level is not found in the level select...) Either way, going through the level select, even without a code, would look like cheating, ruining any reaction one might have if you find out how to glitch through the key doors instead (if possible).

<ccfreak2k> There is no 'ctrl' button on DeHackEd's computer. DeHackEd is always in control.

Posted: 6/14/2008 2:54 AM

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Bag_of_Magic_Food

He/Him

Active player (277)

Joined: 5/29/2004
Posts: 5712

Hb2 wrote:

I was able to open the 2nd floor door using the key I got, but the basement door gave me the same message that appears when you try to open the 2nd floor door with the first key: "This key doesn't fit! Maybe it's for the basement..."

Did you try opening the basement before or after you opened the second floor?

put yourself in my rocketpack if that poochie is one outrageous dude

Posted: 6/14/2008 3:48 AM

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Hb2

Joined: 2/27/2006
Posts: 19
Location: Santiago, Chile

Bag of Magic Food wrote:

Hb2 wrote:
I was able to open the 2nd floor door using the key I got, but the basement door gave me the same message that appears when you try to open the 2nd floor door with the first key: "This key doesn't fit! Maybe it's for the basement..."
Did you try opening the basement before or after you opened the second floor?

I made a savestate after getting to the lobby. Then, I tried the 2nd floor door and, after noticing that it worked, I loaded the savestate and tried with the basement door.

Posted: 6/14/2008 2:51 PM

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mapler90210

Joined: 3/22/2008
Posts: 84

well, this wouldn't prove it possible for a normal tas, but could someone with Toad's Tool try propping an elevator against the castle wall over the door, and bljing on that so you get into that glitchy "push against wall in mid-air" state? from there, jumping (i think) sends you down at extremely high speeds, and i'm pretty sure the game checks for collision with the ground before it checks for collisions with water. during the animation of mario hitting the ground and flattening, it may be possible to open the door. btw, i'm using one of myles's vids as a reference. i'll post the link when i find it. EDIT:uhh.....i was reading the previous page when i wrote this, so the topic of the post is opening the basement door.

Posted: 6/14/2008 7:59 PM

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duksandfish

Joined: 3/14/2008
Posts: 152
Location: United Kingdom

If someone with toads tool (i cant get the rom extender to work) could try deleting the water in the moat (is that possible?) and see if opening the door to the basement works. If so, getting a fast enough blj outside the castle would possibly open the door. If someone can point me in the right direction as to where to get and extended rom, i would be greatfule and try it myself. On the topic of the key doors, have you tried it, getting the second key, opening the door to the upstars, then going to the basement key door and see if it opens then duksandfish

Polarium

Posted: 6/14/2008 8:23 PM

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Johannes

Former player

Joined: 12/1/2007
Posts: 425

Duksandfish wrote:

On the topic of the key doors, have you tried it, getting the second key, opening the door to the upstars, then going to the basement key door and see if it opens then

that doesn't matter.

SM64.org

Posted: 6/14/2008 8:34 PM

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Hb2

Joined: 2/27/2006
Posts: 19
Location: Santiago, Chile

Duksandfish wrote:

On the topic of the key doors, have you tried it, getting the second key, opening the door to the upstars, then going to the basement key door and see if it opens then

I tried it. After opening the 2nd floor door I went back and tried with the basement door. As I didn't have the key anymore, the basement door gave me the normal "You need a key to open this door" message.

Posted: 6/14/2008 8:45 PM

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asteron

Joined: 2/16/2005
Posts: 462

Glad to see that opening the moat door would be beneficial :) It was pretty clear that the stars are all stored in one large bitfield and its good to have confirmation the keys are too. Really I can't imagine that door opening unless you can either fool the game into thinking you are not in water or figure out how to open it from a distance. I agree with the earlier idea of hoping for a 1 frame window in which to open the door when entering water. You would need to build enough speed to get to the door and open it in 1 frame before the game realizes you are underwater... I would think though that would require fast vertical movement since the water is a large plane... I don't think there is a known way to do that. Hmmm.. actually I think the water might be sectioned off into a couple planes since I remember a break in the texture animation between the pond area and the moat. Maybe there is a seam there you can sneak through? Actually has anyone found a way to walk around beneath the castle (under ground)? That sounds vaguely familiar... though I might be thinking of an SM64 Quake 3 level I played a few times.

This signature is much better than its previous version.

Posted: 6/14/2008 8:58 PM

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bkDJ

Joined: 7/26/2006
Posts: 1215

asteron wrote:

Hmmm.. actually I think the water might be sectioned off into a couple planes since I remember a break in the texture animation between the pond area and the moat.

The pond volume doesn't have a current.

Posted: 6/14/2008 10:50 PM

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Flip

Skilled player (1533)

Joined: 7/25/2007
Posts: 299
Location: UK

Is it possible to walk underwater anywhere else in the game? Presumably it'd work by using BLJ to penetrate the water's surface before the water mechanics can kick in. If this is proven to work elsewhere, it'd be helpful in creating tactics for the moat.

Posted: 6/15/2008 12:24 AM

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Johannes

Former player

Joined: 12/1/2007
Posts: 425

Did some GS testing. 1) Metal cap code, can't open door 2) Code that forces Mario to the bottom of the water at high speed, can't walk under water http://www.box.net/shared/5gnuglf6s0

SM64.org

Posted: 6/15/2008 1:00 AM

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blahmoomoo

Joined: 2/1/2008
Posts: 347

... Perhaps you should put the video on a website that is NOT reported for spyware? My firewall blocked box.net immediately as a spy site.

<ccfreak2k> There is no 'ctrl' button on DeHackEd's computer. DeHackEd is always in control.

Posted: 6/15/2008 1:04 AM

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Bag_of_Magic_Food

He/Him

Active player (277)

Joined: 5/29/2004
Posts: 5712

Spyware? I had an account on box.net once. Should I be worried?

put yourself in my rocketpack if that poochie is one outrageous dude

Posted: 6/15/2008 1:06 AM

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Johannes

Former player

Joined: 12/1/2007
Posts: 425

blahmoomoo wrote:

... Perhaps you should put the video on a website that is NOT reported for spyware? My firewall blocked box.net immediately as a spy site.

well, that's a problem with your firewall, not the site.

SM64.org

Posted: 6/15/2008 1:16 AM

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blahmoomoo

Joined: 2/1/2008
Posts: 347

According to this, box.net scans through the files you put up there for personal information and use it for conspiracies... Although, the official answer by Check Point is here, which just says that 50 people reported malware. Either way, it sounds like malicious information collection, not spyware. EDIT: I am able to bypass the block, but I'll just sit this video out anyway just to be safe. Back on topic now...

<ccfreak2k> There is no 'ctrl' button on DeHackEd's computer. DeHackEd is always in control.

Posted: 6/15/2008 9:16 AM

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KDR_11k

Joined: 1/23/2006
Posts: 352
Location: Germany

Does it actually load the same map for the outside of the castle with full and drained moat instead of two different maps, one with the starting stuff (lakitu, pipe), watery moat and the other with a dry moat and triggers for the doors and stuff?

Posted: 6/15/2008 11:34 AM

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ShinyDoofy

Former player

Joined: 12/5/2007
Posts: 716

According to Toad's Tool, it is just the same map.

Posted: 6/15/2008 8:02 PM

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bkDJ

Joined: 7/26/2006
Posts: 1215

z0MG wrote:

Did some GS testing. 1) Metal cap code, can't open door 2) Code that forces Mario to the bottom of the water at high speed, can't walk under water http://www.box.net/shared/5gnuglf6s0

That second test is the most disappointing. It kinda rules out being on the bottom for one frame to open the door.

Posted: 6/15/2008 9:42 PM

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Phallosvogel

Joined: 1/3/2006
Posts: 334

well you can stand on a slope which borders to water. so mario is covered half by the water. what defines the start of the swiming animation?

Posted: 6/15/2008 11:15 PM

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ShinyDoofy

Former player

Joined: 12/5/2007
Posts: 716

I once saw a page explaining how the walk on water gameshark code was "developed". Iirc the page also said that Mario's swimming state is determined on his height on the map. Unfortunately I can't seem to find the page anymore :(

Posted: 6/15/2008 11:19 PM

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Mitjitsu

He/Him

Banned User, Experienced player (532)

Joined: 4/24/2006
Posts: 2997

bkDJ wrote:

That second test is the most disappointing. It kinda rules out being on the bottom for one frame to open the door.

There is a reason for that. Thats because when Mario tries to open a door in a normal situation he must be on the ground for a couple of frames. Within that period the game will check to see if Mario has collided with things like water, lava and paintings etc.

Posted: 6/16/2008 5:57 AM

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SwordlessLink

Active player (490)

Joined: 1/12/2007
Posts: 682

Here's something I hope you'll all enjoy. I've been working on this in secret for the past 4 or so months. It's an optimised 16 star TAS, using the lobby glitch, and no step BLJing. I know it won't be published on this site, but I made it because there was demand for it. This run finishes the game in 14 minutes and 27 seconds. This is 41 seconds faster than the last 16 star run (15:08) and 2 minutes faster than the first 16 star run. I'd like to thank the following people. mr_roberts_z: Support from the start, actively helping out with several parts of the run, doing some hex editing for me when I was unable to. BrianRuleZ: Helping out a lot towards the end of the run. BitS was largely his input. AKA and Rikku: Support from the start, reviewing my WIPs for mistakes and giving me constructive criticism and advice. If you have any questions about anything, you can ask here, or send me a PM here or on YouTube, or catch me in IRC. I can't be bothered listing every single improvement, so yeah. One thing I will say though, is that CCM is skipped in favour of two additional LLL stars. This was like 20 seconds faster than going to CCM. http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=K3laTGxwZVk

Posted: 6/16/2008 6:12 AM

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Twelvepack

Joined: 5/2/2006
Posts: 1020
Location: Boulder, CO

Wouldn't it be a lot faster to take the red coin star in bowser 2 instead of boarding the sub?

Has never colored a dinosaur.