I've currently just obtained the Magic Wand. Here's the newest WIP:
http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/1444/swordless-wip010.fcm
As usual, any suggestions are appreciated. My next objective is to complete Level 6. Then, I'm going to do Up+A, then Level 8, followed by Level 2, then Level 5 (including purchasing the Bomb upgrade), then Whistle to 3, go to Level 7, complete it, Whistle to 1, and go to Death Mountain.
I think Bob's route was to walk around counterclockwise (across the river) to pick up the power bracelet then enter level 6. Did you measure how much time this takes? Even if it is one or two rooms slower than going through the lost woods, the time saved by warping with the bracelet will pay off after level 6.
I'm not convinced that the Power Bracelet is even necessary. There's a reasonably straightforward path from the starting point to Levels 8, 2, and 5, in that order. If I did have the Power Bracelet, I'd have to go through extra screens and then take warps at least twice (once to do Level 5, then a second time to do 2 and 8), and I'm not sure this would be any faster, especially with having to listen to "TAKE ANY ROAD YOU WANT" twice, plus an extra Up+A sequence. Also, I'd have to find another way to get the 100 Rupees to purchase the Bomb upgrade in Level 5.
By the way, does anyone know if it is faster to get back to Level 4 by walking from the start, or by Whistling to Level 1 and going from there?
It has been a lot since I watched Phil's run, but I don't remember I was enjoyed as much as with your WIP. Very solid work, indeed.
It's a shame Link is doomed at the end. Not all movies have a happy ending.
Thanks for the compliment, DrJones.
I've got a new WIP that finishes off Level 4:
http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/1592/swordless-wip012.fcm
This was much more difficult than I thought. The enemies were most uncooperative, and I had to redo the whole level from scratch one time to get them to behave in an acceptable fashion. I optimized the Gleeok fight as much as I could (generally, it takes 32 frames for Gleeok to become vulnerable again).
I've now completed Level 8. IMO, this is the third most difficult level in a swordless quest (9 is the toughest by far, followed by 6). Two mandatory rooms full of Blue Darknuts plus a four-headed Gleeok... fun :)
http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/1664/swordless-wip013.fcm
Joined: 4/25/2004
Posts: 615
Location: The Netherlands
It might not be a bad idea to let a bot try and optimize some room fights... Rooms are kind of small, and making the wrong decisions gets you killed fast (means the end of an attempt) so I think something could spring from this... Just a thought.
If someone will give me the rom addresses for dying, weapon A and B, position and possibly some worldview, I can probably whip something up in terms of a botfile. Zelda may be one of the most spoken subjects here so this data is bound to be checked out by several people :)
However, I still wanted to somehow see the game "beaten" swordless, so I went ahead and made this alternate ending for my own entertainment, using a savestate from Josh's first run: Zelda 1 swordless director's cut (2 MB)
I used a RAM patch code instead of a Game Genie-like patch. This was much easier to find although not as elegant because it requires the code (00AD:002) be turned on only at a certain point rather than throughout the whole run.
Wait, what does this do? I've never beaten Zelda 1, so I can't tell by watching the video.
I'm just a spectator. There was a time when I tried to participate, but I'm really lazy, so.
she/her/hers
Just posting a status update - I don't have a new WIP yet, but I haven't given up. Right now, I'm experiencing some difficulty in Level 5 because of bomb management. The first room full of Blue Darknuts is a problem, because the diamond-shaped rock structure in the center of the screen tends to prevent all of the Darknuts from clustering together. To make matters worse, I have to spend 2 Bombs just to get here - and I need at least one more to get to the room with the 12-Bomb upgrade. I may have to resort to the Magic Wand to bludgeon Darknuts at some point, though I'd rather avoid that if possible since it is a bit slower. I'm going to try a couple of tactics and see what I can come up with.
With the recent Zelda mania I figured it wouldn't hurt to bump this topic. I am hoping someone might be able to answer my question this time...
I wrote:
I posted this question over at Legends Alliance a while back and I never got a response:
me at Zelda Legends wrote:
I recall there was a Nintendo Power issue where Counselors' Corner featured some original Legend of Zelda coverage despite the game being quite dated by that time. One Q&A it featured went something like "How do I rig the money making game?". There was also a 'meet the counselors' section where one dude listed his greatest video game achievement as having beat the Legend of Zelda without a sword.
I'd like to locate this issue and see again how those punks have misphrased it as 'beat' when it really should say 'got all the way up to Ganon and died'. Would anybody be able to tell me which # issue this is?
Since you guys generally have more mastery of games from that era, perhaps one of you could help identify that NP issue? Back then I actually did work myself on the console all the way up to the finale without a sword, only to find that I couldn't finish off Ganon.
hey Hanzou, I remember the two items in question! Right now I'm digging through the internet trying to find the answer....unfortunately I pitched my entire Nintendo Power collection (first issue through the Metal Storm issue) a few years ago or else i'd be lookin through them right now. hopefully i'll come up with something...
sorry it took so long but i found the answer. Volume 26 (July 1991) on page 85 features the "How do I rig the money making game?" tip AND the game counselor profile of Bruce M. White who claims his greatest achievement was beating Zelda without a sword...
I've also shown videos of bugs still not reproduced to-date, such as walking on the "top menu" area of the screen, and insta-killing Ganon using a potion upon entering his room.
If that last glitch were reproducible, I think that would make this a legitimate category (as legitimate as Mario 1 without B anyway). Of course I'd still like to see a new regular run and second quest run before this one.
I've also shown videos of bugs still not reproduced to-date, such as walking on the "top menu" area of the screen, and insta-killing Ganon using a potion upon entering his room.
I recall reading the potion-death was in Zelda Classic, but not the original.
More investigation would be required.
I'd be interested in doing this if there is interest, if we can find quick consensus on a good route. I would not like to use the screen scrolling glitch recently discovered. Using Save/Quit counts as a game over, and I am not fond of using it. Lastly getting the rod very early also seems to defeat the purpose.
Game restart sequence doesn't count as a game over, in either the original or GBA port. I just finished a swordless run of my own for fun, and I used save/quit at least 100 times, and I still have a big fat "0" next to my name. Even if it did count, not using it would make the game longer and I at least would be less inclined to accept it for lack of optimization.
As for the rod, I sort of agree that it shouldn't be obtained first by default, but I don't think the places that need it should be left deliberately last either, if there is a faster route. Even if one did get the wand early, that doesn't mean it MUST be used everywhere. Look at the current run...there are plenty of places where bombs are used instead of the sword.
The screenscrolling glitch...meh. The only reason I would see it being "allowed" not to use it is because there isn't a previous swordless run already posted.
The major problem with the swordless run remains: how to end the movie?
Either way... doing it without the glitch seems like a pretty well defined goal... but "getting the rod as late as possible" (or just later than what would be the fastest) seems rather random.
