Normally, I accept the 2nd chance idea.
However we are talking about someone who gont a "last chance" 5 years ago. (Perhaps more since, but...).
I'd be more comfortable if such a staff gets "fired". But then allowed back if he does show proofs. I can think of one example where someone was removed of their duty by a superior. Later in the year he got those powers back.
I can think of one example where someone was removed of their duty by a superior. Later in the year he got those powers back.
I don't recall which anime isn't all about this.
Poll: What to do with Spikestuff? (Or whoever to witch hunt)
1 - League of Legends (Riot Games) style:
- Player: Give a chance by letting them express (requires open letter if the person in question plays in the league, where players need to demonstrate professional attitude)
- He must write an A4 sized apology containing the words: "princess", "no spindash" and "#LoveColin"
- Staff member: Goodbye, you are fired.
2 - Evil Assholes style:
- Player: Season pass
- Staff member: Time to bullshit for the moneyz
- The 💰 intent 💰 is 💰 to 💰 provide 💰 viewers 💰 with 💰 a 💰 sense 💰 of 💰 pride 💰 and 💰 accomplishment 💰 for 💰 uploading 💰different 💰 encodes.
3 - Guild Wars 2 (ArenaNet) style:
- Player: Strip down his clothes live stream on his next stream.
- Staff member: Reddit wants you to be fired. Sorry, you are fired.
- "I want to be clear that the actions they made do not reflect the views of TASVideos at all. As a community we always strive to have a collaborative relationship with the shitposters. We value your input. We make this site for you."
4 - Hollywood movie industry style:
- Viewer: 2 popcorns and a cup of coke, $420.69 please.
- Staff member: Your sentence "Hi" deemed too aggressive and overly sexually assaulting, all your projects now cancelled, please pay 0.00002% of all your income you dirty bastard.
5 - Comic style:
6 - Meme style:
PhD in TASing 🎓 speedrun enthusiast ❤🚷🔥 white hat hacker ▓ black box tester ░ censorships and rules...
Joined: 12/28/2013
Posts: 396
Location: Rio de Janeiro, Brasil
I feel like saying something here... When you can't think of anything or almost anything positive about someone, you are probably being blinded by emotions. There are some posts here that just don't sound reasonable. I might even have said something similar when I was too angry, but I can't agree with the statement that Spike does 'more harm than good' to the site.
It's obvious to me that he's a very competent publisher and not easily replaceable at all (weren't we just talking about mistakes in publications done by less experienced encoders?). He cares a lot about achieving the highest possible quality, and apparently about maintaining a good publication rate too. You can also note he has more than 1% (!) of the posts on these forums, and surely many of them were actually pretty helpful. I remember seeing many times him giving pointers to welcomers (such as that they should remove blank frames from the ending of input), even if that hasn't always necessarily been done in the most possible polite way.
About his past bad behavior, I don't know if I really should say this, but just take a look at Threaded Gruefood for some examples. He's definitely not the only user with occasional bad behavior and not even the only staff member with records of unprofessionalism. It puzzles me a bit that someone said to have lost interest in TASing because of him, but then the only interaction they ever had was about soccer. Calling soccer a shit sport is something I could say myself in a bad day, so honestly I think we could be more tolerant with these smaller things. Heated discussions are and will probably always be a strong characteristic of TASVideos, and it's a good idea to try to accept this fact. Furthermore, Spikestuff has apologized for his actions, which is something I had never seen him doing before, so we have good reasons to believe he will improve his behavior in the future.
As it was brought up before in this thread, not too long ago a demotion has happened against a staff member that used to sporadically act somewhat unprofessionally. I believe that demotion was a very big mistake and I don't see how the site got any better because of it. We have to keep in mind we are not a very big community, and while we must encourage people to improve and call them out when they screw up we shouldn't get rid of them because of traits we dislike. Let's not commit that mistake again.
Ya that’s sort of the problem. When you have users like those who frequently show up in threaded gruefood all over the place, people aren’t really inclined to join your community. Or when you have jerks who post shitty, unfunny, and counterproductive memes on serious topics like meshuggah. It’s what happens when you don’t put community first. I’d rather be part of a nicer community, even if I’m not the nicest person myself.
I haven’t interacted directly with him at all, but I already know enough from reading old threads that I’m glad I haven’t. And honestly, my desire to contribute more to this site was already low after the hundo TAS. With the way I’m seeing this community handle this (especially the administration), my desire to contribute is at 0. This site is definitely losing users and potential users, and it’s easy to pinpoint why.
For people with such high standards for video games, you all have really low standards for behavior.
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11495
Location: Lake Chargoggagoggmanchauggagoggchaubunagungamaugg
fmp, it's not that we give "too many second chances", it was just a real problem for the last few years that the standard for behavior was basically non-existent. Lots of people suffered from it, and lots of people contributed to the problem. The thing that's different now is that we've had an earthquake affecting basically everyone. People have been tolerating this for long and now it can't be tolerated anymore.
As I said several times, this will be used as a clear indicator that it can't continue this way any longer. We are currently working on the code of staff/contributor conduct, and we're taking it as seriously as we can. When it's completed, our tolerance to staff toxicity will not just be virtually lowered ("oh I wish this guy didn't insult everyone around him"), but officially lowered ("if you don't work on yourself for real and remain toxic, you lose your rank").
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
It puzzles me a bit that someone said to have lost interest in TASing because of him, but then the only interaction they ever had was about soccer. Calling soccer a shit sport is something I could say myself in a bad day, so honestly I think we could be more tolerant with these smaller things.
I'll have to address this silly thing since you're the second person mentioning it.
I don't give a fuck about anyone calling soccer a shit sport or whatever they think of it. My emulators have been called shit since the first day, I personally have been called a retard, a dick and a million of other worse things in these forums, which I didn't mind because we were in the middle of a discussion and I probably deserved it. But, if you join a thread about something just to tell the other members that this thing is shit...
Imagine if I were to write several toxic posts in the anime thread to tell other people to stop watching retarded stuff for kids and losers and instead watch only smart indie movies from Iran or whatever?
What would that make me?
(And I disliked him way before that incident, as you can tell from my response in that thread. I've been here for years before he came, and he's always been the same. That was the only time I bothered to interact with him, thus why I used it in my example here.)
You're just fucking stupid, everyone hates you, sorry to tell you the truth. no one likes you, you're someone pretentious and TASes only to be on speed game, but don't have any hope, you won't get there.
For like the fifth time this thread isn't titled "Reasons I hate Spikestuff"
Him dicking around here isn't in any way related to the flooding incident.
It in no way implies that he's the only one that would've done it if he was mad. Anyone could've under the right circumstances. Stop using it as a way to take him down for the wrong reason.
Him dicking around here isn't in any way related to the flooding incident.
Yes, it is related.
adelikat posted that they decided not to ban Spikestuff or remove him from the staff because he was valuable. Then I replied, telling him why it was a bad idea not to remove a toxic member, even if he may appear valuable. Now we were discussing why Spikestuff is or isn't a toxic member.
adelikat is an admin of our community, so I believe it is important to let him know if we agree or not with what he had written.
Posting many times to say "this isn't 100% related to the first post or thread name", though, can be annoying and it breaks the conversation other people are having.
You're just fucking stupid, everyone hates you, sorry to tell you the truth. no one likes you, you're someone pretentious and TASes only to be on speed game, but don't have any hope, you won't get there.
Ok let me rephrase:
Any kind of fights or less than civil conversations anyone has had with Spike are not relevant here. This thread is about discussing the TVC flooding not to discuss his so called "toxicity".
And by "valuable" I'm pretty sure they mean his publishing work. Which again is not related to him being a dick. (Sorry Spike.)
Maybe stop discussing unrelated stuff and nobody would have to till you to stay on topic.
And I never said anything about relation to the first post because it has parts of the other incident because of the thread split.
If the only thing that comes out of this whole mess is that an official Staff Code of Conduct is adopted and enforced, it will still be an extremely valuable and important step forward.
So long as it is actually enforced.
How fleeting are all human passions compared with the massive continuity of ducks.
This thread is about discussing the TVC flooding not to discuss his so called "toxicity".
No, it's been clear that not many people care about that specific incident in isolation (I think only some staff members and one or two regular members tried to steer the conversation that way, worried more about losing 850 YouTube users than about the bullying against our TASers by some staff members).
Most regular users only wanted to say their piece about the response the administrators had regarding the culprits.
Specifically, Nach's trying to imply that this thing wasn't that serious ("this wasn't a kidnapping or a murder") or telling HappyLee that only those who wronged him should apologize, for example.
And as I said, my talking about Spike's toxicity was in response to adelikat's reasons (posted in this thread) for not banning/removing Spike from staff because they valued him very much, enough to make them overlook some stuff that would/should have gotten other people banned.
(Usually moderators would split or rename a thread to make it clear what people are talking about, then others don't come around to complain about users not following the thread's name. But since most of Nach's posts have been about trying to hide this discussion behind "this thread is only for the TVC flooding", maybe none of them wants to touch it, since Nach's responses wouldn't make much sense anymore.)
You're just fucking stupid, everyone hates you, sorry to tell you the truth. no one likes you, you're someone pretentious and TASes only to be on speed game, but don't have any hope, you won't get there.
Emulator Coder, Site Developer, Site Owner, Expert player
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Joined: 11/3/2004
Posts: 4754
Location: Tennessee
mz wrote:
Then I replied, telling him why it was a bad idea not to remove a toxic member, even if he may appear valuable. Now we were discussing why Spikestuff is or isn't a toxic member.
adelikat is an admin of our community, so I believe it is important to let him know if we agree or not with what he had written.
I agree with this. And do feel like the post after mine was relevant to this thread and I appreciated the input.
Having said that, I would prefer if this thread not turn into singling out and bashing a community member.
I don't give a fuck about anyone calling soccer a shit sport or whatever they think of it.
If you are talking about someone else's toxicity, perhaps it would be wise to watch your own language a bit. Else you'll end up sounding a bit hypocritical.
You might not find that kind of language inappropriate, but I'm sure you understand that many do. And it kind of undermines your message a bit when you use crass language, especially in this particular context.
6 - Meme style:
