Joined: 5/2/2006
Posts: 1020
Location: Boulder, CO
This has come up before, and it was deemed acceptable becuase the character available to second player saved a lot of time (the game was in japanese on SNES... forget the name), in this case, it would only save a tiny amout. That said its porbably fine eitgher way.
Duffjr suggested this idea to me and I asked him to make this topic here as I was unsure wether I should use it or not in my SMK run.
(I would have asked myself, but it was 1 am and I was knackered)
reading the replies, I'm still unsure :-/
Joined: 5/1/2004
Posts: 4096
Location: Rio, Brazil
If you actively make it a 2 players TAS, using player 2 to screw up the competition while player 1 races, that'd be fun and would hide the fact that L+R was even used.
Hey Zod, can get my name on the GP site for KB flap of 3.75 using one mushroom? It's in the wip. Or you should at least tell the GP comunity about this trick I found so they can lower the flap time.
"Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocrities. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence."
If you actively make it a 2 players TAS, using player 2 to screw up the competition while player 1 races, that'd be fun and would hide the fact that L+R was even used.
I suggested that a year ago...
but decided there'd be too much happening onscreen and it'd just be distracting as you wouldn't be able to concentrate on watching either kart.
You'd also have to wait around ages on some tracks for player 2 to finish.
---
Note that the trick under discussion in this thread doesn't involve playing SMK two playered, just using the 2nd controller during the start up screen to make Player 1 begin one place higher in the first race of each cup.
I'm not sure if it's a cheat or a glitch, or a glitched-cheat (the cheat is actually meant to swap player 1 and 2, but player 2 hasn't pressed start so it actually just starts player 1 one place ahead in the first track of the cup).
If you actively make it a 2 players TAS, using player 2 to screw up the competition while player 1 races, that'd be fun and would hide the fact that L+R was even used.
but decided there'd be too much happening onscreen and it'd just be distracting as you wouldn't be able to concentrate on watching either kart.
You'd also have to wait around ages on some tracks for player 2 to finish.
Nice to see this trick put to good use. (It's far more exploitable in MK:SC because of different finish line boundaries.)
I wouldn't be so sure you were the first to "find it", though, Blake.
I for one have done it myself a few times, although not as efficiently, of course.
Also, your time is not likely to be accepted if achieved on emulator, With the potential for easy cheating in mind, as well as potential game engine performance differences, the Mario Kart community has opted for a zero-tolerance policy when it comes to emulator use in playing for records.
Andreas
I never said I was the first to find it. I think am I first to get a flap of 3.75" using this trick though, or first to put it to good use in actually saving time. If not I’m surprised the GP community is so far behind the times then.
"Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocrities. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence."
If just for the purpose of shooting other racers around, this is an entertainment tradeoff. I found the map view very helpful and entertaining in the one-player WIPs, and I wouldn't want to exchange it for some playaround on the lower screen.
On the other hand, if you can use player 2 as an obstacle to initiate longboosts or manipulate other racers to serve as such obstacles, this could lead to even better TAS records than possible in one-player mode. (And as FODA pointed out, the second player should press start and give up as soon as player 1 crosses the finish line.) I think route planning and testing would have to be entirely redone for this strategy. To me it sounds like an interesting project, but for time being it seems like developing the one-player TAS is hard enough.
Huffers wrote:
(L+R 7th place trick)I was unsure wether I should use it or not in my SMK run (...) reading the replies, I'm still unsure :-/
I definitely think you should not, except in a complete two-player TAS.
Oh. My God.
You're not going to believe this. No fricking way.
I'm definitely going to have to redo this whole TAS now, without a doubt.
I just discovered pausing the game (start) changes when the items appear.
No need to wait around for ages or slow myself down.
EDIT: start was the only button I never tried.
ROFL!
Well, at least the result would be what you originally intended: less slowdown due to items. At least you didn't completely finish and submit it yet... :p
Joined: 11/14/2005
Posts: 1058
Location: United States
I would still suggest that you finish and submit your current run. I am quite sure it will be published, and it gives people something to watch while the new run is made.
Joined: 6/13/2006
Posts: 3300
Location: Massachussetts, USA
I agree. you have so few courses left that it'd be so worth it to submit, you've worked very hard and are so close.
So what is the optimal way to go about pausing? start, frame advance, start, holding B throughout, or press start and let go of B on the same frame, then next frame start holding B again to get out of pause menu?
Edit: I just tested, and it looks like holding B throughout , and pressing start, frame advance, start is optimal. B is held throughout, and my alternate idea did not work.
I agree. you have so few courses left that it'd be so worth it to submit, you've worked very hard and are so close.
Yep, and I reckon I can probably hex edit the Special Cup onto the end of the second TAS if I haven't thought of any improvements by then.
I'm 90% through the first run, and this is a bank holiday weekend, I wonder if I can finished it by Tuesday...
I just discovered pausing the game (start) changes when the items appear.
No need to wait around for ages or slow myself down.
EDIT: start was the only button I never tried.
Does this now create a possibility to hexedit a single course in a video ?
90% through? Can we see the WIPs?
For the rerun, I was thinking it might be a good idea to try picking up those items on GV after the main set of items to get another long boost in. You could do the second long boost right before the shortcut or do it against the blocks on the finish line.
"Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocrities. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence."
For the rerun, I was thinking it might be a good idea to try picking up those items on GV after the main set of items to get another long boost in. You could do the second long boost right before the shortcut or do it against the blocks on the finish line.
Once again, you've lost me ;-)
Which Ghost Valley are you talking about?
If you draw it on the map, you might want to scale it 50% before posting it here (the last ones were huge).
Joined: 11/14/2005
Posts: 1058
Location: United States
I don't know if this had been brought up before, but when you restart your run I would *strongly* suggest using Snes9x1.51. It fixes the horrible looking mode 7 bug that was present in Snes9x1.43. Here is a comparison screen which shows the difference. Note the bricks in the background on both the top and bottom of the screen.
http://img515.imageshack.us/my.php?image=comparisonkm9.jpg
Wow, SMK-King duff is here. Welcome to TASvideos!
About the 2nd controller suggestion:
As long as the 2nd player isn't fully involved/used to drive in every race like in a 2-Player competition, but just there to let the 1st Player get a slight starting position advantage and nothing else, then I would strongly disagree to use it, as it would look just cheap and lame otherwise.
It would not only look boring to see the 2nd player standing still in every race, but it would also destroy the originality of the SMK TAS.
A standard "1-player aims for fastest time" TAS would be of much more value and it's racing records would be more recognized and stable as well.
It would not only look boring to see the 2nd player standing still in every race, but it would also destroy the originality of the SMK TAS.
and all others who think the same way:
Huffers wrote:
Note that the trick under discussion in this thread doesn't involve playing SMK two playered, just using the 2nd controller during the start up screen to make Player 1 begin one place higher in the first race of each cup.
I'm not sure if it's a cheat or a glitch, or a glitched-cheat (the cheat is actually meant to swap player 1 and 2, but player 2 hasn't pressed start so it actually just starts player 1 one place ahead in the first track of the cup).
There is no second player using this glitch. There is a second controller, but only one player plays the race. (the bottom split-screen is map).
someone is out there who will like you. take off your mask so they can find you faster.
I support the new Nekketsu Kouha Kunio-kun.
Anyone know why when I try to set 7E0D71 to C0 it always sets it to 0 instead? I want to be able to do mushroom boosts all the time.
I get a desync in that wip after mushroom cup, any ideas as to why?
I'll get a map of the GV idea soon.
"Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocrities. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence."
Basically you get two shrooms in one lap. This seems small enough to me, just use a res over 800. Also I can't change the font in paint so I didn't want to make it any smaller.
"Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocrities. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence."
