Topic by Comicalflop

Posted: 12/13/2006 3:31 AM

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Comicalflop

Editor, Experienced player (730)

Joined: 6/13/2006
Posts: 3300
Location: Massachussetts, USA

Also, I bet you're playing in real speed, desynchs occur when TASing extremely optimized and doing stuff on the first possible frame and at the correct angle, but I don't know if you having the japanese version matters.

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Posted: 12/13/2006 6:25 AM

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petrie911

Joined: 7/16/2006
Posts: 635

Well, here's the alternative way that I spoke of before, and it's quite clearly faster than the first way into the red switch room I posted. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VPQjKxsI1nQ

Posted: 12/13/2006 6:41 AM

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Comicalflop

Editor, Experienced player (730)

Joined: 6/13/2006
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Location: Massachussetts, USA

Hehe that was really fast. I always wondered what the potential for jumping out of water as a Zora was. Can that sort of boost be used in other areas, in GBT or elsewhere?

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Posted: 12/14/2006 2:18 AM

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petrie911

Joined: 7/16/2006
Posts: 635

I don't think so. The Boss door room's ledge is WAY too high, and the main red switch has the wrong kind of slope. Other than those two, I can't think of any other use for it.

Posted: 12/16/2006 3:51 PM

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Mukki

Skilled player (1090)

Joined: 8/26/2006
Posts: 1139
Location: United Kingdom

I hoped to post a new WIP when I got into Termina Field, but desyncs have taken a turn for the worse. I can't seem to get out of the bomb shop, I've experienced 7 in here so far. This doesn't seem to be easy like the other desyncs, it's being very stubborn. I'll try and get this done by the end of the weekend. EDIT -- YES!!! I nailed the bastard (9 desyncs in a single room O_O). I'll try and get the next WIP up tonight. Just have to deposit rupees and get into Termina Field, but I don't know how much West Clock Town will desync...I've had problems here before...wish me luck :)

http://tasvideos.org/Mukki.html

Posted: 12/16/2006 8:37 PM

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Comicalflop

Editor, Experienced player (730)

Joined: 6/13/2006
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Location: Massachussetts, USA

good luck! we're both working on long runs, but you're dealing with the desynching one so kudos. I await the WIP.

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Posted: 12/17/2006 12:24 AM

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Shadow_Byrn

Joined: 3/16/2006
Posts: 289

JUST out of curiosity, what's making this particular game so de-sync prone?

I am just a silhouette, a silhouette of a memory of a solitary night .. nothing more.

Posted: 12/17/2006 1:00 AM

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laughing_gas

Former player

Joined: 10/1/2006
Posts: 1102
Location: boot_camp

it requires the expansion pack

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Posted: 12/17/2006 7:41 AM

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Comicalflop

Editor, Experienced player (730)

Joined: 6/13/2006
Posts: 3300
Location: Massachussetts, USA

Interestingly, some other N64 games also have the expansion pak (or are enhanced by it); or require controller paks (or something extra of that nature, it's early in the morning and I can't remember) but I have a bunch of N64 ROMs that, I assume would also desynch alot while making. So Majora's Mask is not unique in this aspect, but the fact that it's the first game that absolutely requires the expansion pak plays a big role.

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Posted: 12/17/2006 11:19 AM

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Mukki

Skilled player (1090)

Joined: 8/26/2006
Posts: 1139
Location: United Kingdom

We will, we will WIP you. http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/3137/ZELDA%20MAJORA%27S%20MASK.m64 This is up until entering Termina Field. Take a look and get back to me. I've got spare time to proceed tomorrow afternoon so I'd like to have this confirmed as being good or not by then. Effectively, on British time, 28 hours after this post has been made. I'll encode an AVI if this is confirmed as being good.

http://tasvideos.org/Mukki.html

Posted: 12/17/2006 9:20 PM

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YautjaElder

Joined: 3/29/2006
Posts: 273
Location: Sweden

Unfortunately, it desynched for me right before the owl statue, but still I found something to comment on. You should probably have jumpslashed in mid air instead of grabbing the ledge when going for the silver rupee in east clocktown. Also, I'm pretty sure Deku Link moves faster than link does so it might be worth it to use the deku mask asap. Nice improvement over the previous wip btw.

Posted: 12/18/2006 12:44 AM

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Raiscan

Joined: 11/11/2006
Posts: 1235
Location: United Kingdom

Watched this WIP, you flail about after you deliver the rupees at the end then stand there. I'm hoping that was your intention. Just wondering, why do you not use the reverse Song of Time to slow down time? would it not allow more things to be accomplished in one day?

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Posted: 12/18/2006 1:20 AM

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Mitjitsu

He/Him

Banned User, Experienced player (532)

Joined: 4/24/2006
Posts: 2997

It desynced in the same place for me, I had two savestates and they desynced so I watched the movie from the beggining and it desynced for me just before the owl statue on the second cycle.

Raiscan wrote:

Just wondering, why do you not use the reverse Song of Time to slow down time? would it not allow more things to be accomplished in one day?

This has been discussed in great length, but it won't be used in the second cycle as very little is being done other than getting the Goron mask. Mukki would do very well to hold his nerve up till getting it. Since this part of the game is only 10% of the actual game.

Posted: 12/18/2006 1:27 AM

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petrie911

Joined: 7/16/2006
Posts: 635

I don't think that we'll be using the inverted song of time at all. In fact, my biggest worry about the route is that there will be too much time before the ranch bottle. If there is it's still fixable, but we definitely don't need the inv. song of time.

Posted: 12/18/2006 1:30 AM

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kirbymuncher

Player (36)

Joined: 10/8/2006
Posts: 284

You're going to the ranch? With which method, going over the rock or blowing it up?

Posted: 12/18/2006 2:12 AM

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petrie911

Joined: 7/16/2006
Posts: 635

Over the rock. We're not getting certified for powder kegs.

Posted: 12/18/2006 3:04 AM

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mwl

Joined: 3/22/2006
Posts: 636

petrie, didn't you say months ago that you had done an unrecorded test run up to at least the Great Bay Temple, and everything worked out just fine? If not, I'll try to work out the time issue and the rupee route in the coming weeks. (There are a few rupee sources that aren't even accounted for, especially those involving luck manipulation. We may not need to make as many diversions for rupees as the current route suggests.) I'll watch the WIP tomorrow.

Posted: 12/18/2006 7:37 AM

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Mukki

Skilled player (1090)

Joined: 8/26/2006
Posts: 1139
Location: United Kingdom

YautjaElder wrote:

You should probably have jumpslashed in mid air instead of grabbing the ledge.

Ah never thought of that. I'll redo it if it will be faster.

http://tasvideos.org/Mukki.html

Posted: 12/18/2006 7:55 AM

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mwl

Joined: 3/22/2006
Posts: 636

Yautja's right -- never grab a ledge and climb it if there are other alternatives. It's very slow. Also, speaking of jumpslashes, be sure to perform them when jumping into deep pits (like those leading to boss chambers in the GBT and STT). I'll mention this again when the time comes.

Posted: 12/18/2006 8:15 AM

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bkDJ

Joined: 7/26/2006
Posts: 1215

mwl wrote:

Also, speaking of jumpslashes, be sure to perform them when jumping into deep pits (like those leading to boss chambers in the GBT and STT). I'll mention this again when the time comes.

Assuming he is backwalking towards the pit, why would he want to jump slash rather than backflip?

Posted: 12/18/2006 4:14 PM

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Andypro

Joined: 5/24/2004
Posts: 262

I'm using the same rom / plugin settings Mukki has with the exception of the TAS input plugin. It desyncs at the name entry screen (or before, perhaps). Suggestions?

Posted: 12/18/2006 4:37 PM

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Mukki

Skilled player (1090)

Joined: 8/26/2006
Posts: 1139
Location: United Kingdom

If you have already created a savefile it will desync. You will need to delete that before you can watch it. ...or you can watch this AVI i made. It includes from after the song of healing to Termina Field (i skipped the whole happy mask stuff because it's trivial). This way I can get total feedback before tidying up and moving on. http://files.filefront.com//;6378903;;/

http://tasvideos.org/Mukki.html

Posted: 12/18/2006 7:31 PM

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Comicalflop

Editor, Experienced player (730)

Joined: 6/13/2006
Posts: 3300
Location: Massachussetts, USA

YautjaElder wrote:

Also, I'm pretty sure Deku Link moves faster than link does so it might be worth it to use the deku mask asap.

I noticed this too, it might be worth it to put on the mask now to get the 'transformation' animation out of the way, and use Deku Link to get to the silver rupee chest (transforming back to Link in order to catch the ledge, unless Deku link can do another creative angled backflip)? It'd be overall slower than the WIP, but it'd save time if Deku Link can walk over to the silver rupee chest faster. just a thought, it might be wrong.

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Posted: 12/18/2006 7:32 PM

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Comicalflop

Editor, Experienced player (730)

Joined: 6/13/2006
Posts: 3300
Location: Massachussetts, USA

YautjaElder wrote:

Also, I'm pretty sure Deku Link moves faster than link does so it might be worth it to use the deku mask asap.

I noticed this too, it might be worth it to put on the mask now to get the 'transformation' animation out of the way, and use Deku Link to get to the silver rupee chest (transforming back to Link in order to catch the ledge, unless Deku link can do another creative angled backflip)? It'd be overall slower than the WIP, but it'd save time if Deku Link can walk over to the silver rupee chest faster. just a thought, it might be wrong.

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Posted: 12/18/2006 9:08 PM

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mwl

Joined: 3/22/2006
Posts: 636

bkDJ wrote:

Assuming he is backwalking towards the pit, why would he want to jump slash rather than backflip?

The distance might be too short for the setup time to be worth it. See GBT.

comicalflop wrote:

it might be worth it to put on the mask now to get the 'transformation' animation out of the way, and use Deku Link to get to the silver rupee chest (transforming back to Link in order to catch the ledge, unless Deku link can do another creative angled backflip)? It'd be overall slower than the WIP, but it'd save time if Deku Link can walk over to the silver rupee chest faster. just a thought, it might be wrong.

Similarly, I think the distance to the chest is too short to make all this back-and-forth transforming worthwhile. If I recall correctly, the difference in traveling speeds between Link's two forms amounts to just over a second when timed across Termina Field.