Topic by thegreginator

Posted: 11/18/2006 5:41 AM

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thegreginator

Former player

Joined: 6/4/2006
Posts: 267
Location: CO

In the Jr Koopa 4 battle, you could get Mario to 1 hp using a defensive action command so he does 4 damage and then 5. Letting him attack twice, however, will probably cost more time than it saves in this example. If we took the extra time and set it up in this battle, however, we could use it in everything after this battle as opposed to having to set it up later anyways. Is there anyway to get Mario's base hp to 5? I seem to remember a guy in the sewers who can change one stat for another for a price. If we took down Mario's base health to 5, we could not only trade that for some bp or fp upgrades, but then it would be much easier to get him to 1 hp for Mega Rush. The time saved here might make up for the time lost going to find this guy, if it even works.

Posted: 11/18/2006 6:34 PM

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TGPrimus

Joined: 11/16/2006
Posts: 66

Sorry, I misspoke about Jr. Troopa 4. His attack power is 5 AFTER the action command so it's 6 normally. I know the level up/down guy you're talking about and I don't think it would be possible to use it to get Mario's max HP down to 5 as I just assume the game makers are smarter than that. Even if you could this costs 39 coins to do and even getting the 50 coins for speedy spin seems like trouble. If it does happen to work and we find enough coins this guy is not out of the way at all, he's in Toad Town on the way to the shyguy place.

Posted: 11/18/2006 7:27 PM

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thegreginator

Former player

Joined: 6/4/2006
Posts: 267
Location: CO

So it looks like coins might be a problem. We should think about the fastest way to get coins. I really dont think battling will be a fast way to get coins, so the way I see it we are left with 2 options: getting some items/badges and selling them or doing the gambling thing. If there is a badge that isnt very far out of the way, we could sell that for probably a good 50 coins, which would be enough for the Speedy Spin badge. I cant remember how the gambling thing works, but do you have to go out of your way to get some kinf od membership card? If so, selling badges we find might be a better idea. If we do fight battles for coins, we could probably manipulate them to yield the most coins and/or items.

Posted: 11/18/2006 11:50 PM

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TGPrimus

Joined: 11/16/2006
Posts: 66

The gambling thing is quite out of the way and I don't even think you can access it until after speedy spin is available. You also can't sell badges. It looks like our only hope would be to fight monsters and get more coins and items to sell. In this way we could also get fright jars from the shop since we have to go there anyway to sell items. Fighting stronger enemies yields more coins too; I'm not sure if the coins enemies drop is random or not but I would think so, it seems to be at least. Same goes for items. It's also possible to get coins from blocks and things of that nature, some of the 10-coin blocks are not all that out of the way and might be a good investment. Any going out of the way we would have to do to get 50 coins would easily be made up for by the speedy spin though-I'm not sure if it would be for the fright jars but if we could tie in making money and getting fright jars without wasting additional time it probably would be worth it.

Posted: 11/23/2006 10:42 PM

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kirbymuncher

Player (36)

Joined: 10/8/2006
Posts: 284

I tried playing this, and after peach talked to the star for this first time, the whole game stopped working and a pile of error messages came up. Maybe it's my version, but you should check this before you do to much planning.

Posted: 11/30/2006 12:14 AM

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Macman

Joined: 11/16/2006
Posts: 75
Location: Michigan

JSmith wrote:

Is there a Pup-Ddown badge in this game?

Yes, but you don't get it until the very last star spirit.

Signature under contruction, still.

Posted: 1/19/2007 5:36 PM

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TGPrimus

Joined: 11/16/2006
Posts: 66

I'd like to start working on a TAS of this game. If anyone would like to help, or at least point me in the right direction for the tools I need (I don't know anything about frame advance or recording movie files so I need a little help with the basic stuff).

Posted: 1/19/2007 9:37 PM

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laughing_gas

Former player

Joined: 10/1/2006
Posts: 1102
Location: boot_camp

You need Mupen and the rom.

Borg Collective wrote:

Negotiation is irrelevant. Self-determination is irrelevant. You will be assimilated.

Posted: 1/19/2007 9:41 PM

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JSmith

Joined: 8/1/2006
Posts: 428

TGPrimus wrote:

I'd like to start working on a TAS of this game. If anyone would like to help, or at least point me in the right direction for the tools I need (I don't know anything about frame advance or recording movie files so I need a little help with the basic stuff).

http://tasvideos.org/UsingEmulatorTools.html http://tasvideos.org/GenericTips.html

Trying 127.0.0.1... telnet: connect to address 127.0.0.1: Connection refused telnet: Unable to connect to remote host

Posted: 1/19/2007 9:50 PM

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Comicalflop

Editor, Experienced player (730)

Joined: 6/13/2006
Posts: 3300
Location: Massachussetts, USA

once you have the emulator and ROM, you can configure the keys in mupen to your likings. also highly suggested is downloading Nitsuja's TAS Input Plugin. once you have those, load the ROM, and wait for the game intro to play out a little. then go to utilities, movie, and star movie recording. (crt shift r.) browse for the folder you want your .m64 to be in, and make a new .m64 file with the desired name, and select it. fill in the autho/description info, select starts from reset, then hit ok. If the ROM in the emulator reloads, and starts from the very beginning, you did it right. If it starts recording from that spot in the intro that you stopped at, try again. it is very important for the ROM to reload every time you replay the movie file. Good luck! if the results are good, I might download the ROM myself and take part in reviewing your work.

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Posted: 1/20/2007 5:18 AM

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Kitsune

Joined: 4/29/2005
Posts: 1212

I don't know if these badges will speed things up, but you can try the Charge or Mega Focus Badges. :3 Of course, they are somewhat out of the way I guess.. I really doubt they would say time anyway. ;3 I have a lot of knowledge about this game for the most part. The best Partners for the game are Goombario and Watt. Sushi is really only needed once, against Lava Pirahna. Lakilester can be used to speed up travel after getting him. But I don't really know if his travel speed is faster than Spin Dashing. Haven't done the research. It possibly is faster since you don't have to repeatedly slow down with a jump. The only fights where Kooper even comes in hand really, is in the Fuzzy Fight...And a few other places. I think Lakilester is a better choice against Huff N. Puff so he can't recover as much health if you use the multiple Spiny attack. Plus Cloud Nine or whatever the technique is called should help out there with avoiding Huff N. Puff's attacks. You probably won't need a lot of Heart Points if you can manipulate the attacks to miss every time with the Close Call Badge. So you can focus on BP and FP. :3 That is all of my Input on this for now. ^^

Posted: 1/20/2007 7:06 AM

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ZeXr0

Joined: 8/27/2006
Posts: 883

Would it be interresting ? I mean, on SDA it was 5hour long, and I don't think that frame advance can cut 1 hour of gameplay. But I might be wrong, I know there's Chrono Trigger and FFIII that are long movie, but is this game popular ? I would get the opinion of some people before starting this TAS.

Posted: 1/20/2007 8:28 AM

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Kitsune

Joined: 4/29/2005
Posts: 1212

This game is one of my all time favorites. If it wasn't popular, I doubt a second would have been made for the GameCube. And now a third is planned for the Nintendo Wii. ^^ I myself found the SDA run entertaining, but made a lot of mistakes as far as stats, and unwanted battles. :3 The game doesn't really pick up until you get the "Lucky Star Amulet", which grants Timed Attacks. So until then, you're only doing 1 damage with a normal attack, and 3 with a Power Jump. Aftward it's 2 damage per timed hit, and 4 damage with a Power Jump. ;3 I myself feel Watt's power charging Technique would be useful in boss fights, since it adds +1 to all of Mario's attacks for three rounds. ^^ It's a excellent game.

Posted: 1/21/2007 6:26 PM

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TGPrimus

Joined: 11/16/2006
Posts: 66

Thanks for all the help guys. Would a lot of people be interested in seeing a TAS of this game? I don't want to make it if I don't have at least some support. Some boring parts include a few long cut scenes and the parts where you play as Peach. Other than that I think some things would be very interesting such as killing bosses in one turn and fancy footwork avoiding enemies. If enough people would like to see this TAS I'll make it. Any recommendations for the rom I should use?

Posted: 1/21/2007 6:29 PM

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Comicalflop

Editor, Experienced player (730)

Joined: 6/13/2006
Posts: 3300
Location: Massachussetts, USA

I'm doing a game which will roughly consist of 1 1/2 hours of cutscenes, so don't worry about that. There was a topic started for this, with lots of people offering huge amounts of ideas/strategies. Plus, many have said that they've played this, it was mentioned at the beginning of the N64 TAS wishlist, we have other RPGs on the site, and this game has many sequels due to its popularity. Go for it!

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Posted: 1/21/2007 6:38 PM

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Mukki

Skilled player (1090)

Joined: 8/26/2006
Posts: 1139
Location: United Kingdom

I'd definitely like to see a run of this game. Good luck and i'll offer whatever assistance I can. Use a ROM that looks something like this (important parts in bold): Paper Mario (U) [!].

http://tasvideos.org/Mukki.html

Posted: 1/21/2007 7:49 PM

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TGPrimus

Joined: 11/16/2006
Posts: 66

I've run into a problem and I can't even get started. After I start recording a movie the rom acts as if there's no controller, so I can't do anything. I'm using the (U)[!] version of the rom, but this problem also occurs in the european version (KEIN CONTROLLER!) and in the (U)[!] version of the Quest 64 rom. This problem does NOT occur in the Star Fox and Kirby 64 roms (both good US dumps) which both record input fine and play back perfectly. If I'm not recording a movie, the Quest and Paper Mario roms still read the controller just fine. Any idea how to solve this problem?

Posted: 1/21/2007 9:05 PM

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Mukki

Skilled player (1090)

Joined: 8/26/2006
Posts: 1139
Location: United Kingdom

Have you unchecked the 'raw data' option in the input menu? That sounds like the kind of problem that causes.

http://tasvideos.org/Mukki.html

Posted: 1/21/2007 9:56 PM

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TGPrimus

Joined: 11/16/2006
Posts: 66

I'm sorry but I don't know what menu you mean and I can't find that setting. Could you be more specific? It looks like I might not be able to do this run though because it is emulated poorly. I am using the Paper Mario (U)[!] Rom but there are a lot of graphical errors in some places including flickering of the background, especially in battle. I'm using the Rice 6.1.1 beta 10 video plugin and I changed the settings to "after the first C1 change" as was suggested in another post. This fixed a lot of the problems but there are still quite a few, especially in battle. So of course this is a really big problem since people won't want to see a run with the video messed up this badly. Also, even though some problems were fixed there are some new ones too (for instance I rarely experienced flickering in battle with Jabo). Another problem is that savestates seem to get corrupted in battles sometimes which is obviously a problem since it makes it hard to redo things, but this seems to happen rarely and only if you do something specific (I think save stating while the emulation is paused and trying to reload while it is running). Other interesting and negative notes: Sushi can't do unlimited damage. If the prompts get too far offscreen the game freezes. Since the most she can do is 13 and the animation for tidal wave is long it makes it kinda pointless. How sad. This may also have something to do with the savestate problem I mentioned earlier though, so I'm not giving up hope yet. Power Bounce doesn't do unlimited damage either. You can only do it about 5 times before the game forces you to stop. It seems that the number of times you're allowed to do it is also random but I haven't seen more than 6. I was doing this with frame percision of course, so unless I was pressing A on the wrong frame (possible, I kept doing it on the frame or a couple frames right before Mario lands on the enemy but you might have to press it even earlier) Power Bounce damage is relatively meager. These things are no problem though, they'll just make the project more interesting ^^ So if anyone can fix the input problem and the graphics problem I'll be all set. Also is it possible to fast forward with Mupen 64? Sorry for all the noob questions.

Posted: 1/21/2007 10:26 PM

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Comicalflop

Editor, Experienced player (730)

Joined: 6/13/2006
Posts: 3300
Location: Massachussetts, USA

I can answer some questions, not all. before starting a game, it's good to test all of the video settings. I use gln64 for practically all of my N64 ROMs, and for Paper Mario there didn't seem to be any graphical problems at all. you have to be careful with savestates in mupen. making/loading savestates during dead input frames can be bad; I don't know if there's any dead input frames during battles, maybe before there is. (A dead input frame is frames that go by normally where you can;t do any input at all. In most N64 games there's two frame counters: the one on the left is total viewable frames, on the right is actual input frames.) Fast fowarding in mupen is holding down tab. but it's the slowest fast foward of all emulators, so some people have little pet peeves about that. so that's some questions answered. the rest I'm sure other people can provide.

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Posted: 1/21/2007 11:00 PM

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TGPrimus

Joined: 11/16/2006
Posts: 66

Thanks for the input! glN64 didn't make things any better though, in fact it made them worse (sometimes no video shows at all!) Maybe it's just my old-man computer or something. I have most of the video settings on default, but I'll play around with them for a while and see if I can get it to look nicer. The "no controller" during video thing is a big problem and I have no idea what to do about that. It only seems to affect some roms and not others. I don't change the settings between using these roms and i use the (U)[!] version for all of the roms, the problem seems to vary between games. The emulator recognizes that there is a controller there, but the game does not. I would play around with settings for this if I could, but I don't know where they are or what to do. Help would be appreciated! If these two things get taken care of it'll be smooth sailing for the most part.

Posted: 1/22/2007 12:37 AM

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N._Harmonik

She/Her

Joined: 8/27/2006
Posts: 502
Location: Canada

TGPrimus wrote:

Power Bounce doesn't do unlimited damage either. You can only do it about 5 times before the game forces you to stop. It seems that the number of times you're allowed to do it is also random but I haven't seen more than 6. I was doing this with frame percision of course, so unless I was pressing A on the wrong frame (possible, I kept doing it on the frame or a couple frames right before Mario lands on the enemy but you might have to press it even earlier) Power Bounce damage is relatively meager.

That is not true! I was able to do between 20 and 30 Power Bounces once and I did it using an actual Nintendo 64.

Why, oh, why do I even <i>try</i> to understand my own species?

Posted: 1/22/2007 3:06 AM

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TGPrimus

Joined: 11/16/2006
Posts: 66

I've heard about people getting 70+ power bounces on an N64 as well, so it might have something to do with the rom too. I'll test it out more since I could just be pressing A too late. I can't get many more than 6 bounces using frame advance or normally, even rerecording a lot! Anyone have any ideas about this?

Posted: 1/22/2007 9:18 AM

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Mukki

Skilled player (1090)

Joined: 8/26/2006
Posts: 1139
Location: United Kingdom

What input plugin are you using? Also, it sounds like you need to gain more knowledge of the game before diving in. Watch whatever videos etc. you can find and really learn how the game works.

http://tasvideos.org/Mukki.html

Posted: 1/22/2007 6:32 PM

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TGPrimus

Joined: 11/16/2006
Posts: 66

The input problem is solved! I also got power bounce to work-I was just hitting A too late (I figured as long as Mario wasn't actually on the enemy yet it would be OK but you actually have to hit A quite a few frames before. Silly me.) How embarrassing! The only problems that remain are the video in a few places is still problematic, including battle, and I can't seem to load a state that was saved in battle unless I'm still in that battle. Any suggestions would be appreciated!