Topic by klmz

Posted: 2/10/2009 9:56 AM

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klmz

Editor, Emulator Coder, Expert player (2105)

Joined: 5/22/2007
Posts: 1134
Location: Glitchvania

Atma wrote:

Yrr wrote:
Sorry for the looong delay, but I have continued my TAS! -> Floating Garden <-
Looks awesome Yrr. I only have one question though, which I probably should have mentioned ages ago: Why get 2 rotten meats? One rotten meat is more than enough, as the small amount of extra HP you get back from using the succubus soul on graham aren't enough to impede on the bonuses given by the lubicant soul.

If it would matter much can't be told until actual tests are made.

<klmz> it reminds me of that people used to keep quoting adelikat's IRC statements in the old good days <adelikat> no doubt <adelikat> klmz, they still do

Posted: 2/10/2009 4:20 PM

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Yrr

Joined: 8/10/2006
Posts: 289
Location: Germany, Bayern

Atma wrote:

I only have one question though, which I probably should have mentioned ages ago: Why get 2 rotten meats? One rotten meat is more than enough, as the small amount of extra HP you get back from using the succubus soul on graham aren't enough to impede on the bonuses given by the lubicant soul.

I got 320 HP. One rotten meat reduces my HP by 200, so I need 2 in order to get 1 HP. Besides, by unequiping Succubus at the right frame, it is possible to finish Graham off without getting +5 HP (I did so in my other run). Thanks for the positive feedback =)

Posted: 2/12/2009 5:09 PM

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klmz

Editor, Emulator Coder, Expert player (2105)

Joined: 5/22/2007
Posts: 1134
Location: Glitchvania

Yrr wrote:

I got 320 HP. One rotten meat reduces my HP by 200, so I need 2 in order to get 1 HP. Besides, by unequiping Succubus at the right frame, it is possible to finish Graham off without getting +5 HP (I did so in my other run).

You would need just 1 piece of rotten meat if you took damage to get through enemies ;)

<klmz> it reminds me of that people used to keep quoting adelikat's IRC statements in the old good days <adelikat> no doubt <adelikat> klmz, they still do

Posted: 2/13/2009 12:17 AM

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Atma

Former player

Joined: 9/1/2005
Posts: 803

Yrr wrote:

I got 320 HP. One rotten meat reduces my HP by 200, so I need 2 in order to get 1 HP. Besides, by unequiping Succubus at the right frame, it is possible to finish Graham off without getting +5 HP (I did so in my other run). Thanks for the positive feedback =)

Oh right, I was thinking rotten meat = Spoiled milk. My bad, carry on :)

Posted: 2/26/2009 1:01 PM

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Yrr

Joined: 8/10/2006
Posts: 289
Location: Germany, Bayern

I got a question. The previous strategy for Floating Garden was: upper path (Iron Golem, skipped) -> lower path (Manticore, killed) -> lower path (2 Werewolves, both skipped) I am now thinking of a different way: lower path (2 Werewolves + 1 Disc Armor, kill all 3) -> lower path (Manticore) -> lower path (2 Werewolves, skip both) (I don't know if I should skip Manticore or not) I want to change the previous strategy because I want to kill 1 Werewolf to get its Black Belt. What do you think?

Posted: 2/27/2009 7:59 AM

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eternaljwh

Joined: 3/11/2008
Posts: 583
Location: USA

That's definitely not an Iron Golem there. Black Belt's the best physical attack accessory, I suppose, and much earlier than the next best (Satan's Ring isn't it?)- so it might help a little.. What categorys's it going for again?

Posted: 2/27/2009 8:09 AM

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moozooh

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Posted: 2/27/2009 8:47 AM

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eternaljwh

Joined: 3/11/2008
Posts: 583
Location: USA

I'm guessing you mean "no wall/warp glitching", thanks for the refresher. Anyway, +5 attack against...sundry enemies, Death, Balore, Graham, Julius, Chaos...shouldn't need to save more than a few hits, if you can get the drop quickly, and a few more if it gets its own pause to equip (probably something to avoid) I suppose since you're going No Damage saving e'en a single hit against Graham (2nd form) would save a bundle of time, due to less need of dodging the hands, and in decreasing value, Julius and Balore. If small amounts of attack are mattering against Chaos, then you might consider Demon's Mail (drops from Demon Lord), 3 over Dracula's Tunic, though it is later (Chaotic Realm). On the way, if a slight pause needed to kill/manipulate/equip.

Posted: 2/27/2009 10:57 AM

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Yrr

Joined: 8/10/2006
Posts: 289
Location: Germany, Bayern

eternaljwh wrote:

I suppose since you're going No Damage saving e'en a single hit against Graham (2nd form) would save a bundle of time, due to less need of dodging the hands, and in decreasing value, Julius and Balore.

Have you seen my other WIP? I defeated Graham so fast that he wasn't able to perform a single attack. And yeah, I meant Golem, not Iron Golem. lol So I will test which path is the fastest.

Posted: 3/8/2009 5:51 PM
(Edited: 3/16/2009 2:17 PM)

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klmz

Editor, Emulator Coder, Expert player (2105)

Joined: 5/22/2007
Posts: 1134
Location: Glitchvania

Will Golem's +12 STR soul help? You may kill the Golem very quickly with Manticore's soul. EDIT: Ahh, it's +12, not +8.

<klmz> it reminds me of that people used to keep quoting adelikat's IRC statements in the old good days <adelikat> no doubt <adelikat> klmz, they still do

Posted: 3/8/2009 6:29 PM

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Yrr

Joined: 8/10/2006
Posts: 289
Location: Germany, Bayern

I don't think so. It costs to much time to get it and I don't benefit much from it.

Posted: 3/23/2009 10:10 PM

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Cpadolf

Skilled player (1432)

Joined: 7/15/2007
Posts: 1468
Location: Sweden

Okay, so if there is any real interest in a full Julius run (to either obsolete the current one, or get rejected, whatever)? If there is I would be interested in doing it if I could just get help with making up a good route.

Agare Bagare Kopparslagare

Posted: 3/23/2009 11:17 PM

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Bablo

Player (223)

Joined: 10/17/2005
Posts: 399

Yeah, gief moar Julius. I liked the SDA run and would enjoy seeing a TAS of it.

<adelikat> I've been quoted with worse

Posted: 3/23/2009 11:59 PM
(Edited: 3/24/2009 5:41 PM)

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Derakon

Joined: 7/2/2007
Posts: 3960

Olé! Olé! Olé! (I'd be interested in watching such a run, but I don't know how much of a help I'd be on route planning) Edit: just throwing this out here as a starting point. I expect it's all kinds of flawed. I'm assuming you don't use any out-of-bounds traveling, too, which means the map is actually useful. Basically work your way around in a clockwise circle, starting with Creaking Skull, then Big Golem, Headhunter, etc. After killing Manticore, it might be worth teleporting back to the beginning and going down to the Arena and Underground Cemetary, then getting to Great Armor via the Forbidden Area (Julius can get through the waterfall with careful use of the backdash, right?). This would replace the run from Manticore to Great Armor with a run from Legion to same, which I think is worthwhile. If it isn't, then you'd tag Great Armor and then backtrack to the chapel teleporter before doing the arena/cemetary run. There's a pretty big "lag" (lack of bossfights) between Death and Manticore. Fortunately Manticore itself is right near a teleporter. Edit: duh, if you have to go from Great Armor to a teleporter anyway, you might as well go to the Chapel one and kill Manticore on the way; thus, after killing Death you'd teleport and sweep the lower half of the map.

Pyrel - an open-source rewrite of the Angband roguelike game in Python.

Posted: 3/24/2009 10:33 AM

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eternaljwh

Joined: 3/11/2008
Posts: 583
Location: USA

Yes, he just needs to wait for the boat to get near enough. To throw out an option: Creaking Skull, Big Golem, Headhunter, go through Top Floor, tagging teleporter for later, to Death. Now, go right-left into Floating Gardens (and back to the Underground Reservoir) and do Balore and Legion (either way)- then, cut through Forbidden Area, do Great Armor, Manticore, and teleport back up to near Graham.

Posted: 3/24/2009 12:24 PM

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Cpadolf

Skilled player (1432)

Joined: 7/15/2007
Posts: 1468
Location: Sweden

What about the current SDA route? It goes Creaking Skull, Big Golem, Headhunter, activate teleport in Inner Quarters and exit down through the top floor, Manticore, Great Armor, teleport to Castle Corridor from the Chapel, Legion Balore, Death and then Graham. I think eternaljwhs suggested route is shorter, but you will have to fight Death Balore and Legion while still quite weak, which should cost a lot of time due to the massive health of those bosses.

Agare Bagare Kopparslagare

Posted: 3/24/2009 12:33 PM

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Ver_Greeneyes

Joined: 4/2/2008
Posts: 103
Location: The Netherlands

What is the maximum map completion you can get with Julius? (I'm not very familiar with glitches for this game except the 100.1, 100.2 and 100.3% map completion glitches)

Posted: 3/24/2009 5:21 PM

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Satoryu

Joined: 7/1/2008
Posts: 272

for what it's worth, there is at least one way for Julius to get out of bounds. using this, Julius can enter the Julius bossfight and Chaotic Realm. i see it requires a lengthy setup, but it's something to keep note of. especially if you want to fight every boss possible.

Posted: 3/24/2009 7:47 PM

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Cpadolf

Skilled player (1432)

Joined: 7/15/2007
Posts: 1468
Location: Sweden

Well that's really cool, but I don't know if it should be in the run. The setup is ugly and would probably take a lot of time even if optimized, and since the fight is completely unintended it shouldn't really count anyway. That's my opinion at least.

Agare Bagare Kopparslagare

Posted: 3/24/2009 8:34 PM

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Derakon

Joined: 7/2/2007
Posts: 3960

What happens if Julius kills Chaos? What ending do you get? Agreed on it not really being relevant to this run concept, though.

Pyrel - an open-source rewrite of the Angband roguelike game in Python.

Posted: 3/24/2009 8:48 PM
(Edited: 3/25/2009 10:34 PM)

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Cpadolf

Skilled player (1432)

Joined: 7/15/2007
Posts: 1468
Location: Sweden

Derakon wrote:

What happens if Julius kills Chaos? What ending do you get?

I don't think that he is there, because the fight gets trigged by Somas conversation with the other characters in that room, and that won't take place when you play as Julius.

Agare Bagare Kopparslagare

Posted: 3/25/2009 9:57 PM

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pirate_sephiroth

Active player (308)

Joined: 2/28/2006
Posts: 2275
Location: Milky Way -> Earth -> Brazil

Yeah, as far as we know the only way to enter that fight is through a cutscene, and only Soma triggers it.

"Genuine self-esteem, however, consists not of causeless feelings, but of certain knowledge about yourself. It rests on the conviction that you — by your choices, effort and actions — have made yourself into the kind of person able to deal with reality. It is the conviction — based on the evidence of your own volitional functioning — that you are fundamentally able to succeed in life and, therefore, are deserving of that success." - Onkar Ghate

Bisqwit wrote:

Drama, too long, didn't read, lol.

Posted: 3/25/2009 10:49 PM

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Ver_Greeneyes

Joined: 4/2/2008
Posts: 103
Location: The Netherlands

What happens if you GS Julius into the fight itself? I think I've read about this, but my memory fails me..

Posted: 3/26/2009 6:40 PM

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pirate_sephiroth

Active player (308)

Joined: 2/28/2006
Posts: 2275
Location: Milky Way -> Earth -> Brazil

Well, if you find a code to activate the cutscene, then maybe it will start the fight normally, and you'll see Soma's Ending, or maybe crash the game, because of the soul stealing sequence.

"Genuine self-esteem, however, consists not of causeless feelings, but of certain knowledge about yourself. It rests on the conviction that you — by your choices, effort and actions — have made yourself into the kind of person able to deal with reality. It is the conviction — based on the evidence of your own volitional functioning — that you are fundamentally able to succeed in life and, therefore, are deserving of that success." - Onkar Ghate

Bisqwit wrote:

Drama, too long, didn't read, lol.

Posted: 3/27/2009 7:09 PM

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eternaljwh

Joined: 3/11/2008
Posts: 583
Location: USA

Is the Chaos boss room(s) separate from the cutscene room?