Topic by Yrr

Posted: 9/15/2006 6:31 PM

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Yrr

Joined: 8/10/2006
Posts: 289
Location: Germany, Bayern

dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/1981/run.vbm Here's my new run. I made it to the Underground Ceremony. I have to get Flame Demons soul now. Btw, school started, so I can't go on with my run this fast.

Posted: 9/15/2006 8:47 PM

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moozooh

Senior Moderator

Joined: 8/4/2005
Posts: 5770
Location: Away

You mean, Underground Cemetery? :) You're going very good, already 1:06 ahead of Atma, and you have a little less than half the game left. Hmm, I wonder, will you be able to get over two minutes of advantage?

Warp wrote:

Edit: I think I understand now: It's my avatar, isn't it? It makes me look angry.

Posted: 9/30/2006 9:00 AM

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Yrr

Joined: 8/10/2006
Posts: 289
Location: Germany, Bayern

First of all, sry that I didn't go on with my run, but I havn't so much time now. I hope I can go on in future. Btw: the forum updated?

Posted: 9/30/2006 9:04 AM

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moozooh

Senior Moderator

Joined: 8/4/2005
Posts: 5770
Location: Away

Yrr wrote:

First of all, sry that I didn't go on with my run, but I havn't so much time now. I hope I can go on in future.

Take your time, just don't abandon this run. It looks too good to be abandoned now. :)

Yrr wrote:

Btw: the forum updated?

Right.

Warp wrote:

Edit: I think I understand now: It's my avatar, isn't it? It makes me look angry.

Posted: 9/30/2006 9:04 AM

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pirate_sephiroth

Active player (308)

Joined: 2/28/2006
Posts: 2275
Location: Milky Way -> Earth -> Brazil

heh.. I was getting worried that you'd finish your run months before I finish mine... that's a relief... =D

"Genuine self-esteem, however, consists not of causeless feelings, but of certain knowledge about yourself. It rests on the conviction that you — by your choices, effort and actions — have made yourself into the kind of person able to deal with reality. It is the conviction — based on the evidence of your own volitional functioning — that you are fundamentally able to succeed in life and, therefore, are deserving of that success." - Onkar Ghate

Bisqwit wrote:

Drama, too long, didn't read, lol.

Posted: 9/30/2006 11:14 AM

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Yrr

Joined: 8/10/2006
Posts: 289
Location: Germany, Bayern

moozooh wrote:

Take your time, just don't abandon this run. It looks too good to be abandoned now. :)

Yes, I hope I don't lose the interest. I entered The Arena! I can update my sig now ;) I stopped at frame 50450. @sephiroth, if you want to complete your run before, you should hurry up =) I think this is the route I use for the arena: I do it like Atma, but I only kill one red minotaur to get its soul and I skip the killer mantle soul. Before balore I get Ronginus' and lubicants soul.

Posted: 9/30/2006 12:11 PM

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moozooh

Senior Moderator

Joined: 8/4/2005
Posts: 5770
Location: Away

Yrr wrote:

I think this is the route I use for the arena: I do it like Atma, but I only kill one red minotaur to get its soul and I skip the killer mantle soul. Before balore I get Ronginus' and lubicants soul.

Any reason to skip the killer mantle and not to kill the second minotaur?

Warp wrote:

Edit: I think I understand now: It's my avatar, isn't it? It makes me look angry.

Posted: 9/30/2006 4:44 PM

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Yrr

Joined: 8/10/2006
Posts: 289
Location: Germany, Bayern

moozooh wrote:

Any reason to skip the killer mantle and not to kill the second minotaur?

Why should I? Killing a second minotaur wastes (costs) time, and I don't need the killer mantle soul. I need to kill lubicant, erinys, final guard, so I should get enough exp. What do you think? Have I forgotten something?

Posted: 9/30/2006 5:16 PM

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moozooh

Senior Moderator

Joined: 8/4/2005
Posts: 5770
Location: Away

Yrr wrote:

and I don't need the killer mantle soul

You need at least one Red Minotaur soul. Killer Mantle kills a minotaur with just one hit (killing it manually will take no less than 8-9 hits). Later, you may need it to take the Hippogriff soul (again, killing the golem with one hit). Unless getting Killer Mantle soul itself costs you much time, it saves time in any other place I can recall.

Warp wrote:

Edit: I think I understand now: It's my avatar, isn't it? It makes me look angry.

Posted: 9/30/2006 6:28 PM

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Yrr

Joined: 8/10/2006
Posts: 289
Location: Germany, Bayern

As far as I know you don't need to kill iron golem to get hippogriff. And I only kill a single minotaur. Do you think it's worth to get it? Which route would you prefer?

Posted: 9/30/2006 6:30 PM

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moozooh

Senior Moderator

Joined: 8/4/2005
Posts: 5770
Location: Away

Well, if it's all down to one minotaur, then you could just test if it would be faster to kill it manually, or to kill the mantle, take its soul and kill the minotaur with it. Also, it'd definitely be faster to one-hit-kill the second minotaur than jump over him or anything like that.

Warp wrote:

Edit: I think I understand now: It's my avatar, isn't it? It makes me look angry.

Posted: 9/30/2006 6:37 PM

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Zurreco

Former player

Joined: 8/1/2004
Posts: 2687
Location: Seattle, WA

It is faster to kill the Mantle. You should aim to kill two Red Minotaurs: one in the Arena, and one either on the way to or on the way from getting Hippogriff, depending on when you get it. Also, the added exp of the Iron Golem wouldn't hurt.

hi nitrodon streamline: cyn-chine

Posted: 9/30/2006 6:38 PM

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Atma

Former player

Joined: 9/1/2005
Posts: 803

Ok，since I haven't watched this at all, I'm unfamiliar on whether or not you've gotten a spoiled milk, but if you haven't, what was your plan after getting a lubicant soul (since I recall reading you saying you'd be doing damageless)? It does effectively nothing unless you lose health. Also, I think getting a killer mantle soul was faster, it only takes a few hits, and the 6x frame 'got soul' window (and then theres the equipping and such, but i think it was still faster), as opposed to just outright killing a red minotaur by hits. Lightning doll maybe as a compromise of sorts?

Posted: 9/30/2006 9:00 PM

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Yrr

Joined: 8/10/2006
Posts: 289
Location: Germany, Bayern

Oh, damn, I forgot those minotaurs on the way to hippogriff! Then I must get killer mantle soul of course. I really forgot this. Ok, when should I get it? In the second room of the Arena? Or in the minotaur room (before Laevatain)? And yes, Atma, I use two rotten meats (instead of a spoiled milk, because getting rotten meats is easier). But maybe it's faster to skip lubicant soul (or kill it in the top floor). And I think reducing HPs isn't the same as taking damage.

Posted: 9/30/2006 9:01 PM

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Zurreco

Former player

Joined: 8/1/2004
Posts: 2687
Location: Seattle, WA

Either Mantle is fine. I would prefer the one in the Minotaur room, because you won't have to bother thinking about that stupid Werejaguar getting in the way at all. Also, it would be cooler to have one room full of fighting, rather than two rooms with two small and separate battles.

hi nitrodon streamline: cyn-chine

Posted: 9/30/2006 9:04 PM

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moozooh

Senior Moderator

Joined: 8/4/2005
Posts: 5770
Location: Away

I totally agree with Zurreco. Seems the best way to go.

Warp wrote:

Edit: I think I understand now: It's my avatar, isn't it? It makes me look angry.

Posted: 9/30/2006 9:08 PM

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Yrr

Joined: 8/10/2006
Posts: 289
Location: Germany, Bayern

K, killing a minotaur, getting its soul, killing the mantle and collecting its soul, then leave the room? Are you sure it's faster?

Posted: 9/30/2006 9:21 PM

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moozooh

Senior Moderator

Joined: 8/4/2005
Posts: 5770
Location: Away

Hmm, now that I think of it, it may be not. If you would manage to land all the four hits on the first mantle (in the big room) without engaging in a fight with the beam skeleton or some other deadbeef, it'd be a bit faster (that way, you'd kill all the minotaurs with the mantle).

Warp wrote:

Edit: I think I understand now: It's my avatar, isn't it? It makes me look angry.

Posted: 9/30/2006 9:51 PM

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Yrr

Joined: 8/10/2006
Posts: 289
Location: Germany, Bayern

I killed beam skeleton and then the killer mantle and got its soul in this big room, I'm sure this way is faster.

Zurreco wrote:

Also, it would be cooler to have one room full of fighting, rather than two rooms with two small and separate battles.

With the mantle soul there isn't a minotaur battle, I just hit it one time. And, there are some more battles in this big room.

Posted: 9/30/2006 11:40 PM

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Zurreco

Former player

Joined: 8/1/2004
Posts: 2687
Location: Seattle, WA

Battle is a relative term, but it doesn't really matter.

hi nitrodon streamline: cyn-chine

Posted: 10/1/2006 4:59 PM

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Yrr

Joined: 8/10/2006
Posts: 289
Location: Germany, Bayern

Here is how I killed killer mantle. I'm sure it's the fastest way. Then, what comes after? I'll aim for killing a single red minotaur to get its soul. Before balore I'll try to get Ronginus and lubicant's soul.

Posted: 10/1/2006 5:41 PM

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moozooh

Senior Moderator

Joined: 8/4/2005
Posts: 5770
Location: Away

Yrr wrote:

I'll aim for killing a single red minotaur to get its soul. Before balore I'll try to get Ronginus and lubicant's soul.

You mean, skipping the Laevatain? That could work, but I think you'd need that experience you get from the minotaurs to fight Balore quicker. Try testing the time difference between killing him on 16th and 17th (you'd hardly reach 18th before him without a slowdown but it is possible) levels.

Warp wrote:

Edit: I think I understand now: It's my avatar, isn't it? It makes me look angry.

Posted: 10/1/2006 6:06 PM

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Yrr

Joined: 8/10/2006
Posts: 289
Location: Germany, Bayern

Using Ronginus and lubicant at lv16 is faster than laevatain at lv17. With the laevatain at lv17 does 62 damage, Ronginus does 90-100; using lubicant alone is better than reaching a new level. I have to kill some additional enenmies like final guard, so I should get enough experience. Ah, btw, I created a program which calculates damage. Where should I upload it?

Posted: 10/1/2006 6:19 PM

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moozooh

Senior Moderator

Joined: 8/4/2005
Posts: 5770
Location: Away

Yrr wrote:

Using Ronginus and lubicant at lv16 is faster than laevatain at lv17. With the laevatain at lv17 does 62 damage, Ronginus does 90-100; using lubicant alone is better than reaching a new level.

I know, I meant using Laevetain before you obtain the spear. If you go for it and kill all the four minotaurs on your way (inevitably), you'd definitely have your 17+ levels by the time you reach Balore, be it with or without the spear.

Yrr wrote:

I have to kill some additional enenmies like final guard, so I should get enough experience.

Another argument in favor of killing all the minotaurs and getting Laevatain.

Yrr wrote:

Ah, btw, I created a program which calculates damage. Where should I upload it?

I could temporarily host it until you find a better host (mine is not available 100% of the time and I can't control it directly; it drops dead for a day approximately once every month). Send the prog to moozooh@gmail.com and I'll upload it.

Warp wrote:

Edit: I think I understand now: It's my avatar, isn't it? It makes me look angry.

Posted: 10/1/2006 6:31 PM
(Edited: 10/1/2006 7:10 PM)

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Yrr

Joined: 8/10/2006
Posts: 289
Location: Germany, Bayern

Done, I sent you the prog. Getting laevatain and killing 4 minotaurs costs about 1000 frames, 16 seconds or so. Even if I could hit balore only 1 time a second, it have to save 16 attacks. How should it save time? And here's a calculation about the experience: I'll kill iron golem twice instead of one time, I'll kill final guard and lubicant which makes more then 3000 extra experience. I also kill a erinys and I have already more experience than Atma had at this place. So, no reason why to get laevatain.