Topic by bluefoxicy

Posted: 4/6/2014 7:30 AM

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bluefoxicy

Joined: 8/5/2012
Posts: 7
Location: United States

Any low% runs that get the gravity suit first? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FKHjKRFHfZw Theoretically, you can mockball the super missile, go for early power bombs, then continue up and get into the wrecked ship early. That gives you some missiles and an energy tank, at the very least 5 super missiles 1 energy tank 10 missiles 5 power bombs. Can get Kraid on the way back I guess--you still have to kill all 4 on non-glitch routes.

Posted: 4/7/2014 5:35 AM

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Vykan12

Player (98)

Joined: 3/20/2008
Posts: 466
Location: Montreal, Quebec, Canada

What's the point? Glitched any% GT code: The TAS goes straight to lower norfair without even the varia suit, ends the game with arbitrary code execution immediately after Golden Torizo. Glitched any% X-ray: Head to Maridia and X-ray climb until the game glitches into the explosion sequence. Gravity suit would allow you to move faster in Maridia but requires a huge detour + fighting Phantoon.

Posted: 4/17/2014 10:51 PM

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amaurea

Former player

Joined: 2/19/2007
Posts: 424
Location: UK

I've done some work on making it easier to make EAC TASes for super metroid by making a small macro language that lets you write inline assembly in lsnes input files. It's only partially tested at the moment, but it should remove some of the error-prone tedium from this when it's done. The example from the readme-file (which you can see by scrolling down on the linked page) bootstraps a general main loop that lets you run arbitrary amounts of subframe input each frame while the game is still running.

Posted: 4/18/2014 6:30 PM

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Cpadolf

Skilled player (1431)

Joined: 7/15/2007
Posts: 1468
Location: Sweden

That's very cool! I hope that a good EAC TAS could be made for this game. I've had some ideas that might be fun if they could be realized but I don't have any of the knowledge necessary to actually make any of it.

Agare Bagare Kopparslagare

Posted: 4/25/2014 12:56 PM

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Dessyreqt

Joined: 11/16/2009
Posts: 68

Well, humans have once again beaten the X-Ray Glitch category, this time playing by its rules (instead of pulling out GT code shenanigans): http://www.twitch.tv/ivan/c/4128088 I'm pretty sure a TAS could still do this with only 6% though, it appears to be the same sort of setup as in the statues room. EDIT: apparently the method in that video is already obsolete and a new method can cut a couple of minutes off of the time. Not that that's relevant for TASing, it's just a different method to get stuck in the door deep enough.

Posted: 4/25/2014 5:51 PM

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OmnipotentEntity

He/Him

Player (36)

Joined: 9/11/2004
Posts: 2623

Stupid question. I'm sure it's been researched before. Do you actually need 11 power bombs to do the crystal flash? Or is 10 + a PB drop enough? (Lay bomb, kill enemy, it drops a power bomb item, pick up item, crystal flash triggered?) It might be hard to arrange an enemy to die and grab the pickup after laying the bomb, (because you can't move after laying the bomb?)

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Posted: 4/25/2014 6:34 PM

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Derakon

Joined: 7/2/2007
Posts: 3960

As I understand it, as long as you return to precisely where the bomb was dropped before the Crystal Flash starts, you can do it correctly. So yes, it should be possible to lay a bomb, then grab a refill, then return to where you laid the bomb.

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Posted: 4/25/2014 7:02 PM

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AzumaK

He/Him

Joined: 5/5/2011
Posts: 42

Yes, exactly as Derakon said. I can't comment on when the game checks PB # for Crystal Flash, though. In his 100% run, Cpadolf dropped a PB, finished GT boss and returned to the PB to CF and get the missile pack early. Shown here: http://youtu.be/TNTv68Ngbs4?t=51m

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Posted: 4/25/2014 7:24 PM

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Dessyreqt

Joined: 11/16/2009
Posts: 68

Yeah, I'm pretty sure you just need to have 10 when the CF would start. In either case, it's not really relevant since that run is outdated (they now use a damage boost to get stuck into the door far enough to not need a crystal flash.) Also, a TAS can simply get stuck in the door the same way it does in the gold statue room; the same type of slope is what would block ascending in a normal x-ray climb.

Posted: 4/25/2014 7:54 PM

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Cpadolf

Skilled player (1431)

Joined: 7/15/2007
Posts: 1468
Location: Sweden

Dessyreqt wrote:

Well, humans have once again beaten the X-Ray Glitch category, this time playing by its rules (instead of pulling out GT code shenanigans): http://www.twitch.tv/ivan/c/4128088 I'm pretty sure a TAS could still do this with only 6% though, it appears to be the same sort of setup as in the statues room. EDIT: apparently the method in that video is already obsolete and a new method can cut a couple of minutes off of the time. Not that that's relevant for TASing, it's just a different method to get stuck in the door deep enough.

That seems like it probably beats the EAC method. I guess I'll try to get back to this in a few weeks unless someone else picks it up :P It should be a pretty easy run too, It's basically the current X-ray run with somewhat less stringent drop requirements up till after X-ray, and then it's a cakewalk up until the X-ray part at the ship. The only challenge would be to figure out what drops/damageboosts are optimal.

Agare Bagare Kopparslagare

Posted: 4/25/2014 11:04 PM

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Dessyreqt

Joined: 11/16/2009
Posts: 68

It will definitely be faster than the EAC run. Here's a mockup I did based on a "human" route (theory TAS): http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/1594158150/any%25%20xray%20bs%2020140425.smv In TAS timing, this run comes out to ~15:33.30. Your run using the old X-Ray method is already a minute ahead leaving X-Ray, and you had a save that I didn't have to use. I had a small snafu with PBs, if I had saved the PB I used in the X-Ray room (which didn't even save time :( ) I would have had one left for the last room. Oh well. I look forward to your results. EDIT: encode: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aqW8tn2SWuQ

Posted: 4/26/2014 12:10 AM

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hero_of_the_day

Player (88)

Joined: 11/14/2005
Posts: 1057
Location: United States

Is there something specific about that door to the left of the ship that makes this trick possible? Are any of the other 3 doors viable options? Especially the super missile door to the right of the ship, which would certainly save some time. Of course if it is only possible with the door on the left, then it would probably require some testing to see if it is quicker to go through red brinstar or blue brinstar when heading towards the landing site.

They're off to find the hero of the day...

Posted: 4/26/2014 6:15 PM

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Dessyreqt

Joined: 11/16/2009
Posts: 68

I believe the bottom left door requires the least amount of climbing to leave the bounded area, only having to climb to the top of the screen. Any of the other doors would require climbing higher to get to the area outside of the room, and from there you would have to travel to further areas. I'm not an expert on how the OOB area works exactly, but you seem to need to get to a certain y position before activating the x-ray to mess around with the OOB area. There is another slightly faster method for transition that has been discovered here: http://www.twitch.tv/twocat/c/4136437 It seems that any method will start from the bottom left door though for the reasons described.

Posted: 4/28/2014 6:23 PM

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Cpadolf

Skilled player (1431)

Joined: 7/15/2007
Posts: 1468
Location: Sweden

Anyone know what particular adress and value you should look for to know that you have triggered the explosion?

Agare Bagare Kopparslagare

Posted: 4/28/2014 7:20 PM

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Dessyreqt

Joined: 11/16/2009
Posts: 68

The address you should be looking at is 7ED821. I think you just need to set the second most significant bit, so 0x40 should work. My smv sets the value 0xFF.

Posted: 4/29/2014 5:41 AM

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Cpadolf

Skilled player (1431)

Joined: 7/15/2007
Posts: 1468
Location: Sweden

Thanks! Also, does anyone know if the lua script to see block positions OoB is available in Bizhawk, or if it would take a lot of work to convert it? EDIT: And if anyone knows the reason for the game sometimes getting in a state where it will semi-freeze after the next door transition. It's impossible to move or even change equipment, but all enemies still move and samus can still take damage. It seems that once you have done *something* (touched some block, reached a specific position, etc), the game will always do this after a door transition, even though the very same door transition will not freeze the game if you haven't done that thing.

Agare Bagare Kopparslagare

Posted: 4/29/2014 9:28 AM

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Twocat

Joined: 4/29/2014
Posts: 2

That happens when you land on a transition block that doesn't take you anywhere before hitting one that does. I think you're still able to touch the sides of these blocks without this happening, but I might have just gotten lucky with some of the blocks.

Posted: 4/29/2014 9:55 AM

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Cpadolf

Skilled player (1431)

Joined: 7/15/2007
Posts: 1468
Location: Sweden

Thats interesting! Is there any good method of spotting/identifying these blocks?

Agare Bagare Kopparslagare

Posted: 4/29/2014 10:06 AM

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Twocat

Joined: 4/29/2014
Posts: 2

If you're using the hitbox script to look into the oob area they're cyan, the tiles are 09xx in memory. Some of them crash you and some of them act as if they were solid.

Posted: 4/29/2014 2:12 PM

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creaothceann

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Editor

Joined: 4/7/2005
Posts: 1874
Location: Germany

256 pages reached, congratulations! :)

Posted: 4/29/2014 3:21 PM

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total

Player (38)

Joined: 1/22/2014
Posts: 38
Location: Sweden

Cpadolf wrote:

Thanks! Also, does anyone know if the lua script to see block positions OoB is available in Bizhawk, or if it would take a lot of work to convert it? I had a port of the script to Bizhawk that I've uploaded: http://tas.speedga.me/Super%20Hitbox%202%20Bizhawk.lua

Posted: 4/29/2014 4:18 PM

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Cpadolf

Skilled player (1431)

Joined: 7/15/2007
Posts: 1468
Location: Sweden

Thanks total! Twocat, do you know which Y position you were at in the video Dessyreqt posted? The best one I've been able to find so far is a small platform at Y=9451, where you can do a quick jump to reach a door transition to the tube room.

Agare Bagare Kopparslagare

Posted: 4/29/2014 5:25 PM

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total

Player (38)

Joined: 1/22/2014
Posts: 38
Location: Sweden

Cpadolf wrote:

Thanks total! Twocat, do you know which Y position you were at in the video Dessyreqt posted? The best one I've been able to find so far is a small platform at Y=9451, where you can do a quick jump to reach a door transition to the tube room.

The position in that video should be around X=-300 and Y=9307. It's pretty much the green "step" blocks to the left of the block you describe at 9451. The reason we didn't stop at the blue block at 9451 and then jump right is that it would be very risky to do in realtime compared to going left and then hitting a transition there. For a TAS though, I'm pretty sure landing on that blue block at 9451, X-raying and then jumping right and hitting that door transition from behind is the best bet.

Posted: 4/29/2014 5:50 PM

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Cpadolf

Skilled player (1431)

Joined: 7/15/2007
Posts: 1468
Location: Sweden

Yeah I just found it. I think it'll be somewhat close, both ways definitely need to be optimized to be sure.

Agare Bagare Kopparslagare

Posted: 5/4/2014 5:45 PM

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Baka94

He/Him

Joined: 2/17/2014
Posts: 39
Location: Finland

I was playing this game few days ago and I came across something odd. You know that room in Brinstar that has the Shinespark tutorial. I was next to the bomb block wall (on the right side) and ran to the right until Speed Booster turned on (I was maesuring the correct spot to start running to get through the wall and wouldn't fall to the Shinespark tutorial). Then I turned around and started running left. Few blocks before I was right above the "Shinespark pit" Speed Booster turned on even tough Samus harldy had any speed and then I fell to the pit. I couldn't find any information about this so I decided to ask if anyone knows about this.

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