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Posted: 1/23/2007 8:11 PM
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mmbossman
Experienced player (828)
Joined: 11/18/2006
Posts: 2426
Location: Back where I belong
GBx TAS of 2008
The difference is like night and day: http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/3546/TUROK_DINOSAUR_HUNTE%20%28USA%29.m64 This is my restart, completed sooo much faster than when I first started. Using the mouse to make small adjustments not only makes my motions more precise but saves me time and rerecords. I still feel like an @$$ for not thinking to use it like this... grrr. In any case, here's my run up to the first teleporter, with more natural looking movements, and it's 39 frames ahead of nfq's updated run (which was around 80 frames better than my first try). Take a look and let me know any thoughts. I also decided to ignore damage, since I'll have to die in the 3rd level by raptor bite anyway, and I won't be able to use the energy gunner to take away most of my life. It probably won't save me much time, but it will save me a ton of sanity. However after I'm done using death respawns I'll probably make a no damage run from there on out.
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Posted: 1/24/2007 12:59 PM
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nfq
Player (93)
Joined: 5/10/2005
Posts: 1204
I can't even use a keyboard when I do a 2D game run because I'm not used to... use a keyboard.
mmbossman wrote:
Ok, I feel like a tool.
lol, i wonder how tools feel :/
Youtube channel | Goldeneye and PD TAS times
Posted: 1/25/2007 2:00 PM
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evilchen
Joined: 6/9/2006
Posts: 614
Location: Mettmann
iam glad to read that you are continuing your tas :) good luck for it !
https://www.youtube.com/user/armitageyt
Posted: 1/25/2007 3:01 PM
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mmbossman
Experienced player (828)
Joined: 11/18/2006
Posts: 2426
Location: Back where I belong
GBx TAS of 2008
evilchen wrote:
iam glad to read that you are continuing your tas :) good luck for it !
Thanks:) I really appreciate any moral support! I'm having to take this in small chunks because learning (ie school) likes to get in the way, but right now I just finished up the 3rd key of level one and I'm 6.5 seconds ahead (compared to 2.4 seconds at the same spot in my first run). Wall and ladder jumping really helps a lot. EDIT: One warp away from the 4th key and I'm up over 9 seconds.
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Posted: 1/25/2007 8:45 PM
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mmbossman
Experienced player (828)
Joined: 11/18/2006
Posts: 2426
Location: Back where I belong
GBx TAS of 2008
EDIT: Last post was a little early, here's the start of level 3, a little less than 12 seconds faster http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/3585/L2%2C%20Start%20%28-712%29.m64 EDIT 2: The first wall jump of level 3 saves exactly 5 seconds, so I'm up to 17 total. Much better than my first try. Now for some random questions that somebody may know: Can the last key of level 2 be wall jumped to from any point below (ie get to the key without diving down the long cavern that leads to the leapers)? If possible, that would save gobs of time. I've played around with this one some and haven't found a solution, but can the key above the level portal on level 4 be wall jumped to? Or, if I decide to run through level 5 first, is there such a thing as grenade jumping in this game? Again, if possible, it would save at least a minute. Also in level 4, can the checkpoint right before the second key be avoided at all? A death warp after getting the key would save another 45 seconds, but unfortunately there isn't a space between the wall and the checkpoint like in level 3 :-/ I hope at least one of these ideas works, if so I'll be sure to get my 36 minute total time mark, maybe even down to 35.
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Posted: 1/28/2007 4:34 AM
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mmbossman
Experienced player (828)
Joined: 11/18/2006
Posts: 2426
Location: Back where I belong
GBx TAS of 2008
Ok, this will be my last update for a few days, since I have a big test coming up that hasn't been getting the studying it deserves. I am currently right after the first death respawn in the run, and I'm *drum roll please* 1451 frames ahead, which is just over 24 seconds for those of you scoring at home. Here's the WIP link http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/3603/L2%2C%20After%20Death%20%28-1451%29.m64 nfq: I think you'll be pleasantly surprised with my pillar climbing, it's damn near flying. And if anyone has taken the time to see about answers to the questions in my last post, thanks for helping! And if not, they'll just wait till I get there myself I guess. I'm hopeful that I'll be able to break the 36 minute mark for total run time, but breaking 37 is all but assured. I'm enjoying working on this so much more now that I know a little more about the game's mechanics and espcially about how to use the TAS plugin correctly.
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Posted: 1/28/2007 4:46 AM
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Comicalflop
Editor, Experienced player (734)
Joined: 6/13/2006
Posts: 3300
Location: Massachussetts, USA
Speedy TAS of 2009
I sadly don't have answers to your technical questions. However: I am very pleased that you have adapted to the TAS Input Plugin (see? told ya it was helpful :P) and I even MORE pleased on the great amount of time you have saved in such a short time span, both in real time and in the TAS itself. 24 seconds? congrats!
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Posted: 1/28/2007 12:39 PM
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nfq
Player (93)
Joined: 5/10/2005
Posts: 1204 
Can the last key of level 2 be wall jumped to from any point below (ie get to the key without diving down the long cavern that leads to the leapers)?
I've played around with this one some and haven't found a solution, but can the key above the level portal on level 4 be wall jumped to?
is there such a thing as grenade jumping in this game?
Also in level 4, can the checkpoint right before the second key be avoided at all?
i haven't been able to do any of these. but how can i ever be sure that something is NOT possible?
Youtube channel | Goldeneye and PD TAS times
Posted: 1/29/2007 6:46 PM
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mmbossman
Experienced player (828)
Joined: 11/18/2006
Posts: 2426
Location: Back where I belong
GBx TAS of 2008
Crap... I was just playing around, trying some of the techniques that I mentioned earlier, and it turns out that the entire perimeter of the watery area below the last key on level 2 can be utilized. However, although I can get "stuck" between the polygons wherever I want, it's always at a height of three presses of the jump button (ie. get next to the wall, hold the jump button for three frames, and release). After I get stuck I wait about 30 frames and the game automatically jumps me up a little bit higher for some reason. I've tried to piggyback the jumps to get to the key, but I haven't been able to find a place where I can get stuck for a second time on one jump. I can get high enough to see the majority of the structure that holds the key, but can't get up to it. I haven't played around with the rocket trick in level 6, but maybe it can be utilized here too, except to shoot me upward? So many questions to try and work through..... EDIT: LONGHUNTER TIME!!
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Posted: 1/31/2007 12:15 AM
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nfq
Player (93)
Joined: 5/10/2005
Posts: 1204
what? are you on longhunter already? post some wips. i'm not sure i understood your post, but were you actually able make that jump to the last key on level 2? that would be a pretty good time saver but i never managed to do that.
Youtube channel | Goldeneye and PD TAS times
Posted: 1/31/2007 12:45 AM
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mmbossman
Experienced player (828)
Joined: 11/18/2006
Posts: 2426
Location: Back where I belong
GBx TAS of 2008
As requested, here's a WIP. http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/3636/L2%20Boss%20Start%20%28-1489%29.m64 As for level 2, I wasn't able to make the jump, although I'm really really close. I'm pretty confident I'll be able to find a seam between polygons to jump on, when I actually get there (I was just playing around and experimenting with some save states earlier). As for my run, I wasn't able to save much time after the 2nd key in level 3, but there really isn't a whole lot between that key and the boss. All in all it added up to about 2/3 of a second, although I did improve the last set of wall jumps a little. I think my column jumping might be able to be improved a little too, so I may go back and see before I seriously start on the longhunter. So, for total time saved, I'm just under 25 seconds. Lemme know if you see anything glaringly improvable. EDIT: Eh, redid the jumping pillars sequence and saved 4 frames, but at least it looks a little cleaner, since I only do 1 turn instead of 3. I also saved a little time with a cleaner start down the hallway leading to the arena/pit, so now I'm ahead by just over 25 seconds (1502 frames). EDIT 2: Got the first humvee done with a full compliment of explosive shells waiting for the second one, and great starting aim (not to mention half a second saved, which surprised me). I've worked my way through the second humvee twice now but I just can't get so that I'm happy with it. It'll get done sometime tomorrow.
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Posted: 2/1/2007 4:43 PM
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mmbossman
Experienced player (828)
Joined: 11/18/2006
Posts: 2426
Location: Back where I belong
GBx TAS of 2008
Sorry for the double post, but I've made short work of the Long hunter I was able to shave off around 4 and a half seconds from nfq's fight, mainly due to the longhunter's boss meter coming up much more quickly. Better manipulated ammo drops help too. 28.7 sec so far, and the final shot to the camo-wearing, earring sporting, pulse rifle carrying pansy was delivered before the 8 minute mark.
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Posted: 2/5/2007 8:40 AM
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scooty
Joined: 1/15/2007
Posts: 22
not to discredit your run mmbossman, because you are delivering a great TAS, but on a more general note i wish the game designers would make it so that your velocity was standard regardless of if you were runnning, strafing, or run+strafing. This is a formidable run to say the least, i just wish i could see where silly old turok is running and jumping.
Posted: 2/5/2007 1:03 PM
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mmbossman
Experienced player (828)
Joined: 11/18/2006
Posts: 2426
Location: Back where I belong
GBx TAS of 2008
scooty wrote:
i wish the game designers would make it so that your velocity was standard regardless of if you were runnning, strafing, or run+strafing. ... i just wish i could see where silly old turok is running and jumping.
You and me both :-\
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Posted: 2/5/2007 3:12 PM
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L4yer
Joined: 6/12/2006
Posts: 368
Yeah I wish I could move in two directions at once to achieve 40% more speed, great work programmers!
Posted: 2/5/2007 5:02 PM
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laughing_gas
Former player
Joined: 10/1/2006
Posts: 1102
Location: boot_camp
What do you mean? Straferunning is also present in PD.
Borg Collective wrote:
Negotiation is irrelevant. Self-determination is irrelevant. You will be assimilated.
Posted: 2/5/2007 6:00 PM
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mmbossman
Experienced player (828)
Joined: 11/18/2006
Posts: 2426
Location: Back where I belong
GBx TAS of 2008
laughing_gas wrote:
What do you mean? Straferunning is also present in PD.
Um, I think he was talking about movement in real life, as in "I'm going to run this 100 meters in 7 seconds by running sideways and forwards at the same time!!!" Cuz yeah, that really works well for me... probably explains why I fall down all the time when I go out jogging. EDIT: Speaking of doing impossible things like running faster diagonally, I've discovered that Turok is a second cousin of Jesus, since he can not only jump again and again on water, but he can actually run across the surface too! I'll post some sort of WIP when I get farther.
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Posted: 2/5/2007 7:11 PM
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laughing_gas
Former player
Joined: 10/1/2006
Posts: 1102
Location: boot_camp
A general question: when you record, do you have to press "stop recording" before making the savestate? It seems like every time I open a movie in non-read-only mode and load a savestate it causes a desynch instead of re-recording.
Borg Collective wrote:
Negotiation is irrelevant. Self-determination is irrelevant. You will be assimilated.
Posted: 2/5/2007 7:25 PM
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Comicalflop
Editor, Experienced player (734)
Joined: 6/13/2006
Posts: 3300
Location: Massachussetts, USA
Speedy TAS of 2009
mmbossman wrote:
laughing_gas wrote:
What do you mean? Straferunning is also present in PD.
Um, I think he was talking about movement in real life, as in "I'm going to run this 100 meters in 7 seconds by running sideways and forwards at the same time!!!" Cuz yeah, that really works well for me... probably explains why I fall down all the time when I go out jogging. EDIT: Speaking of doing impossible things like running faster diagonally, I've discovered that Turok is a second cousin of Jesus, since he can not only jump again and again on water, but he can actually run across the surface too! I'll post some sort of WIP when I get farther.
My young brother Edge once tried to do his gym class by running like in Naruto with his arms behind his back. Needless to say he was told to run normally to conserve oxygen. Not only can Turok jump on water, but run across it too? wow. I gotta see that. Pretty soon he'll transform into a Flying Spaghetti MonsterTM and convert people.
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Posted: 2/5/2007 7:27 PM
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mmbossman
Experienced player (828)
Joined: 11/18/2006
Posts: 2426
Location: Back where I belong
GBx TAS of 2008
laughing_gas wrote:
A general question: when you record, do you have to press "stop recording" before making the savestate? It seems like every time I open a movie in non-read-only mode and load a savestate it causes a desynch instead of re-recording.
You're probably trying to load a savestate that you've created without properly saving it to the movie file (the Mupen rerecording thread explains this better than I can). Basically, when you make your last save state that you want, advance the movie a few more frames and then load the savestate. That *should* fix it. This will inflate your rerecord count some, but it's Mupen's fault. Hope this answers your question.
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Posted: 2/5/2007 8:14 PM
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Mukki
Skilled player (1098)
Joined: 8/26/2006
Posts: 1139
Location: United Kingdom
GBA TASer of 2012 GBA TAS of 2012 Lucky TAS of 2011 Gameboy TAS of 2011 N64 TASer of 2007
laughing_gas wrote:
It seems like every time I open a movie in non-read-only mode and load a savestate it causes a desynch instead of re-recording.
If you are planning to watch the movie only open in read-only mode, otherwise you will just be resuming recording.
http://tasvideos.org/Mukki.html
Posted: 2/5/2007 8:25 PM
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laughing_gas
Former player
Joined: 10/1/2006
Posts: 1102
Location: boot_camp
Well actually I want to re-record, but loading a savestate only causes a desynch. Now I've narrowed the culprit down to two possibilities: 1) I'm recording the movie from a snapshot, and I load a different savestate after the initial snapshot. 2) I'm using the wrong input plugin. Every movie that's desynched for me was made with NRage's plugin, while I made some movies with Jabo today and they worked fine. Which one of those sounds more correct?
Borg Collective wrote:
Negotiation is irrelevant. Self-determination is irrelevant. You will be assimilated.
Posted: 2/5/2007 8:48 PM
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L4yer
Joined: 6/12/2006
Posts: 368
laughing_gas wrote:
Well actually I want to re-record, but loading a savestate only causes a desynch. Now I've narrowed the culprit down to two possibilities: 1) I'm recording the movie from a snapshot, and I load a different savestate after the initial snapshot. 2) I'm using the wrong input plugin. Every movie that's desynched for me was made with NRage's plugin, while I made some movies with Jabo today and they worked fine. Which one of those sounds more correct?
??? You said you always chose stop recording before making a savestate... of course once you load it it will desync because you never made the state during recording. From scratch: - start movie recording - make savestate while recording - if you error, load that savestate, whether in read only mode to play it back or in read/write mode to continue recording from where the savestate is - stop movie recording when you want to stop using the recording feature - to continue again, play back the movie you created in read only mode, create a savestate of where you want to continue and switch back to read/write. after that, load that state to continue from there
Posted: 2/5/2007 8:54 PM
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laughing_gas
Former player
Joined: 10/1/2006
Posts: 1102
Location: boot_camp
I've had some movies desynch when I make a savestate while recording, so I'm not sure if that's the exact cause of the problem.
Borg Collective wrote:
Negotiation is irrelevant. Self-determination is irrelevant. You will be assimilated.
Posted: 2/5/2007 8:58 PM
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L4yer
Joined: 6/12/2006
Posts: 368
Yes, that's a known problem, has happened hundreds of times and there is no solution yet :( but it should be okay most of the time.
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