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Posted: 12/18/2008 10:29 PM
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samurai_goroh
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Mmm, I though that the strategy was a little different... (That's what I did on Devil's Forest I to get 2000 Km). I'd tried that before, but couldn't lean right & I always ended crashing into the wall when landing. Makes me want to play that game & try it again :D
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Posted: 12/19/2008 12:21 AM
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WMJ
Joined: 5/11/2008
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I briefly contructed a lap 1 on Port Town with this in mind so I suggest you beat me (with a better DTD in particular; watch the WR videos) before going any further.
That way to do the DTD is really slow. I roughly beat that opener by 0"6 on console and I have gotten even better openers using this strategy.
Posted: 4/19/2009 4:47 PM
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Lord_Tom
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Is anyone working on this now? This (amazingly) is the last remaining game that I played extensively which has not yet been done. If no one is doing it, I might give it a try after my current projects finish up, probably late summer. I watched some of the youtube footage for what's been done so far and it's quite impressive, though I was shocked that some of them were apparently done without re-records?!
Posted: 4/20/2009 9:29 AM
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Johannes
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Lord Tom wrote:
Is anyone working on this now? This (amazingly) is the last remaining game that I played extensively which has not yet been done. If no one is doing it, I might give it a try after my current projects finish up, probably late summer. I watched some of the youtube footage for what's been done so far and it's quite impressive, though I was shocked that some of them were apparently done without re-records?!
They were done by Jimmy Thai, former FZX champion. That's why he didn't need re-records. (Though he obsoleted a few of them by using re-records) This game isn't easy to TAS. I tried RR a while ago, and got stuck trying to replicate my first lap's DTD speed in lap 2, and haven't played since. I don't think I'll have the patience or motivation to complete a run myself, so if you have what it takes to make a well optimised run, go ahead. I'll support you all I can. If anyone wants to see my RR attempt: http://sm64.org/johannes/RR.rar
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Posted: 4/20/2009 1:27 PM
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samurai_goroh
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I'll check later your file Johannes :) As for JKT, I don't think he has time anymore to work on TASing this game, so I guess sadly no one is working on this game :(
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Posted: 4/20/2009 3:36 PM
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Comicalflop
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Speedy TAS of 2009
Lord Tom, I encourage you to make a run that plays through all the tracks in time trial mode. I can attest to both the game's impressiveness when completed, and also how difficult it is to make frame by frame. That's one of the main reasons that JKT made it the way he did, because frame-by-frame it is incredibly difficult to determine if what you are doing is going to be faster in the long run. I was at one point trying to make a Death Race, and with less than 10 seconds into the race, I had reached close to 10,000 rerecords, and I still don't know if it's optimal. Also, if my speed-preserving trick works the way I think it does (I still need to test it more) than it'll greatly change the way the game is played. So if you're really thinking about it, you may want to look into that. Check in with me if you do (I also have a lot of useful information in document form, as well as some .m64's to show you.)
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Posted: 11/23/2009 11:52 PM
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alden
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Not entirely sure what's going on in this video, but it's amusing: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fD_nGqB_teY
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Posted: 11/24/2009 5:09 AM
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samurai_goroh
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This bug is what's currently spoken on MFO's board, it's named "air-ground glitch" or just "AGG". With this bug, you'll likely top all the speed records... Floating & turning around was known ages ago. What is new is that someone found a way to refill your energy while floating, therefore being able to do stuff like starting a lap with max speed & so on... You can follow the discussion here: http://www.mrfixitonline.com/viewtopic.php?t=9465
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Posted: 1/27/2010 10:08 PM
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Lord_Tom
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Does anyone here have n64 movie files for some of these runs/tracks? I started trying to TAS this game a while back, but couldn't even duplicate the speed achieved on a rail slide at the start of one of the unassisted WR's on YouTube. I gather this mrfixitonline site may be a fruitful place if noone here has them...
Posted: 1/29/2010 11:54 AM
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Marcokarty
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UlSQXJFBi6k
Posted: 1/29/2010 4:24 PM
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samurai_goroh
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Marcokarty wrote:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UlSQXJFBi6k
If you wanted to help Lord Tom, that's not a N64 movie file... As far as I know, no one has ever released their work. I have a compilation list of all the TAS runs (well only 3lap runs), but is just the videos...
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Posted: 1/30/2010 1:43 AM
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Marcokarty
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samurai goroh wrote:
If you wanted to help Lord Tom, that's not a N64 movie file...
I don't wanted to help Lord Tom there. And yes, I know that doesn't a M64 file.
Posted: 1/30/2010 2:46 AM
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Lord_Tom
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Ah, thanks, Samauri; that's unfortunate. I guess I'll do my best on the MrFixIt site...
Posted: 2/17/2010 6:08 PM
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FunStyle
Joined: 2/17/2010
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I made a Playlist with nearly all of my TAS´s now. There are several TAS´ aren´t the best or they are already improved. I only want to show my new Strats,so maybe most of them could be improved with more work. Enjoy http://www.youtube.com/view_play_list?p=A3CE3810E9AE484A
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Posted: 2/20/2010 7:04 PM
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Lord_Tom
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I've started work again on this game and finally have found a slight improvement to the (unassisted!) WR for the start of Mute City 1, up to the 3rd boost on lap 1. A few observations... -The WR's for this title are absolutely incredible; the ghosting feature on console seems to allow for very precise tuning of the various strats. I'm guessing/hoping this is less prominent later in a 3-lap run, as one can't as easily just keep hitting reset and comparing times after the first 10 seconds or so. -This game is extremely technical, with a huge body of known techniques born of the active speedrunning community, which I'm still trying to unravel -I'll hopefully post a lap-1 wip for Mute City soon...there's just one boost-slide that's giving me trouble...
Posted: 2/20/2010 10:50 PM
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samurai_goroh
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Good luck on your run Lord Tom, I'll be eager to watch the WIP :)
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Posted: 2/24/2010 2:56 AM
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Lord_Tom
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Here at last is a wip for Mute City 1, lap one! Mupen64 v0.5.0; -Video=Jabo's 1.5.2 -Input=TAS Input 0.6 -Sound=Jabo's 1.6 -RSP=RSP emulation plugin The latter half is still unoptimized. Once I came upon the boost-slide + rail slide strat off the 3rd booster I just wanted to finish out the lap and feel good after many hours of frustrating testing. The basics: -Lap 1 time is 0.39s faster than the unassisted WR -0.1s saved in optimizing the first 2 rail slides and closer wall hugging; the rest comes from the (still unoptimized) slide into the wall off the 3rd booster. -I'm hoping the life lost improving lap 1 will be recoverable in later laps by skipping boosts that closely coincide with the boosters on the track, and therefore have minimal impact... Please give me any feedback/tips you see. No one else who's TAS'd this game seems forthcoming with their emulator inputs (.m64 files), so in some ways I had to start from scratch figuring things out. Also, I didn't find any previous TAS's for this track, though many others have vids on YouTube.
Posted: 3/3/2010 4:39 PM
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WMJ
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I watched the wip. I used exactly the same settings you described but it keeps desyncing for me every time on the 3rd boostplate. The beginning of the lap seemed really good though so keep up the good work. From my experience with this track it is really tight with the energy and there is practically no room to recover energy in later laps and still stick to the strategy. It might be possible to skip the first or the second boostplate in lap 2 because you can do the railslide into the little tunnel with almost no energy loss if optimized.
Posted: 3/3/2010 9:22 PM
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samurai_goroh
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Is not that it desynchronize, but it ends there (maybe it got a few seconds erased). I was wondering the same until I saw the frames...
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Posted: 3/7/2010 3:19 PM
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Lord_Tom
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Sorry about the apparently incomplete movie file before. WMJ was right about there not being much energy to spare, so I'm reworking that 3rd booster strat to use essentially the same path used in the WR (slower in the short term, but doesn't lose any energy). I'm picking up tons of useful subtleties relating to turning and speed, which I'll document for posterity. For instance, the key to maintaining speed out of a slide is un-spin as late as possible, as quickly as possible, and end up at such an angle that you can maneuver immediately without sliding again. I'll repost after I get another lap 1 wip...
Posted: 3/14/2010 7:46 PM
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Lord_Tom
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New WIP: Mute City 1, Lap 1, 17.10 Notes: -After (seriously) 15 hours and 5k re-records of tinkering, I watched the WR frame-by-frame and figured out how he was taking the 3rd boost so fast...it uses the double-tap-right attack to swing around really fast; the trick is you then need to hold R for a certain time or the car will grip, causing a big loss of speed -Late in the lap, note how I'm hiking up on the rail a bit during some turns...with precise control, one can do so without taking damage (and losing speed), and obviously being right on the rail has the advantage of being the shortest possible path around the turn. This wip doesn't take full advantage, but I'm moving on to lap 2 to make some more progress finding new strats -The 1st half of the lap was also improved to get a bit more speed coming off the 2nd boost -I finish with full energy, 0.33s ahead of the WR; as WMJ noted this is desirable as laps 2 and (more so) 3 are limited in the WR by energy, both for rail slides and boosts -I promise the link works this time! Same settings as before.
Posted: 3/15/2010 7:44 PM
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WMJ
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This looked very good. I hadn't thought there was this much improvement left in the world record run from the opener alone. You can use the side attack into slide method for the second boostplate as well when you railslide into the tunnel. This is the most optimised non-assisted word record for sure so no wonder it is tough to really get a significant improvement.
Posted: 3/16/2010 7:20 PM
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samurai_goroh
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Lord Tom wrote:
Notes: -Late in the lap, note how I'm hiking up on the rail a bit during some turns...with precise control, one can do so without taking damage (and losing speed), and obviously being right on the rail has the advantage of being the shortest possible path around the turn. This wip doesn't take full advantage, but I'm moving on to lap 2 to make some more progress finding new strats
I like to refer that as hugging the wall, though I don't remember seeing it defined before... You can also use it on lap 2 & 3 after the 2nd boost, in the roofed part before the refill zone. Is easier as jumper, but IIRC, it can also be done as slider (haven't played in ages :P) BTW, keep up the great job :D
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Posted: 3/17/2010 1:03 AM
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Noob_Irdoh
Joined: 6/4/2009
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Can you post, an encode on Youtube? I can't Mupen, sadly. But I like F-Zero X.
Posted: 3/20/2010 12:24 AM
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WMJ
Joined: 5/11/2008
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Location: Netherlands
I've improved the world record by over a second with a completely new strategy. This is just the first run I completed like this too. At least most of the opener TAS you made is still relevant :). http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GK1mu4xOJWs
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