Topic by Warp

Posted: 2/18/2010 11:11 PM

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Warp

Banned User, Former player

Joined: 3/10/2004
Posts: 7698
Location: Finland

moozooh wrote:

What exactly is factored into download rate?

It's simply how many times the video file has been downloaded (through bittorrent). Of course this number is not very reliable because there have been several resets on those download statistics during the existence of the bittorrent server, so the download amounts only go back so far. Also nowadays those download amounts are getting less and less informative because of the video streaming available. Many people probably now watch the streamed versions rather than downloading the files, which probably skews any "popularity" counts. These are the reasons why the download counts have been commented out in the statistics page. (I wonder if the statistics routine could get hold of how many times a youtube or other video stream has been watched...) (Edit: If you meant how the ratio value is calculated in the "all-time audience favorites" page, the formula is mentioned there.)

Posted: 2/18/2010 11:23 PM

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moozooh

Senior Moderator

Joined: 8/4/2005
Posts: 5770
Location: Away

Well, I knew it didn't count streaming versions, but was unsure whether it only tracks BT downloads or also key input files and clicks on Archive.org links.

Warp wrote:

Edit: I think I understand now: It's my avatar, isn't it? It makes me look angry.

Posted: 3/10/2010 6:20 PM

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andrewg

Experienced player (699)

Joined: 2/19/2006
Posts: 742
Location: Quincy, MA

I really surprised this run doesn't have a star: http://tasvideos.org/1123M.html Just because it's completely awesome. Also, why was Battle of Olympus removed? I think that deserves a star for sure.

Super Mario Bros. console speedrunner - Andrew Gardikis

Posted: 4/7/2010 2:27 AM

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mklip2001

He/Him

Editor

Joined: 6/23/2009
Posts: 2224
Location: Georgia, USA

Just to put in my 2 cents, I would like to nominate the recent Mega Man 8 movie for a star. Even though it's longer than the other Mega Man games, it shows off a lot more than the others. It serves as a very good demonstration of how speed is not the only thing that matters in a TAS.

Used to be a frequent submissions commenter. My new computer has had some issues running emulators, so I've been here more sporadically. Still haven't gotten around to actually TASing yet... I was going to improve Kid Dracula for GB. It seems I was beaten to it, though, with a recent awesome run by Hetfield90 and StarvinStruthers. (http://tasvideos.org/2928M.html.) Thanks to goofydylan8 for running Gargoyle's Quest 2 because I mentioned the game! (http://tasvideos.org/2001M.html) Thanks to feos and MESHUGGAH for taking up runs of Duck Tales 2 because of my old signature! Thanks also to Samsara for finishing a Treasure Master run. From the submission comments:

Shoutouts and thanks to mklip2001 for arguably being the nicest and most supportive person on the forums.

Posted: 4/7/2010 2:30 AM

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Sonikkustar

Skilled player (1308)

Joined: 9/7/2007
Posts: 1354
Location: U.S.

I agree with mklip on Mega Man 8. Also, I think that you should give Kings Bounty's Star over to Shining Force. Its a much more famous game and the amount of luck manipulation is even crazier.

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Posted: 4/7/2010 1:24 PM

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Flygon

Joined: 11/4/2007
Posts: 1772
Location: Australia, Victoria

Sonikkustar wrote:

Also, I think that you should give Kings Bounty's Star over to Shining Force. Its a much more famous game and the amount of luck manipulation is even crazier.

I sort of agree. However, I am also very highly biased due to the game choice, personally? I'd annotate Shining Force a 'Notable run' status... and would do so already if it weren't for the fact that the feature is locked out except for when publication is actually occouring... at least, to publishers.

Posted: 4/7/2010 5:22 PM

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sgrunt

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Emulator Coder, Former player

Joined: 10/28/2007
Posts: 1360
Location: The dark horror in the back of your mind

For the most part, "notable publication" is meant for the benefit of relatively new runs so that they are highlighted on the main page, since it's not really categorised in any other fashion (other than being in Movie Publishing History). That having been said, setting "notable publication" is also meant to be at the discretion of the publishers, so it would be fairly easy for me to go and make that change.

Posted: 4/29/2010 1:40 AM

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Lord_Tom

He/Him

Expert player (3274)

Joined: 5/25/2007
Posts: 399
Location: New England

Any decision on the puzzle category star? For both objective and biased reasons, I'd love to see Lemmings get a star. But looking at Baxter's list of TAS's in the puzzle genre, I'd say that Arkanoid no-warps stands out as another candidate. I'd further say that 2 stars for the puzzle genre would be very reasonable...

Posted: 6/1/2010 8:42 PM

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NitroGenesis

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Editor, Experienced player (551)

Joined: 12/24/2009
Posts: 1873

Arkanoid had a star once, why not now, damnit? I also think DKC2 any% needs a star. It kicked ass.

YoungJ1997lol wrote:

Normally i would say Yes, but thennI thought "its not the same hack" so ill stick with meh.

Posted: 6/2/2010 6:00 AM

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Warp

Banned User, Former player

Joined: 3/10/2004
Posts: 7698
Location: Finland

NitroGenesis wrote:

Arkanoid had a star once, why not now, damnit?

I'm wondering if part of the reason could be something like "it has had the star for so long that it's about time to recycle the star and give it to something newer and fresher". We have to remember that the stars are a guideline to first-time viewers. They usually don't care when a run has been made or how long it has had a star. The important thing is to offer them a good sample of what TASing is all about. The age of a star doesn't matter in this.

Posted: 6/20/2010 5:03 PM

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Nach

Emulator Coder

Joined: 3/9/2004
Posts: 4588
Location: In his lab studying psychology to find new ways to torture TASers and forumers

I'm still pushing for Lemmings to get a star, and a fighting game, perhaps Mortal Kombat 3. However right now, Mega Man 5 by GlitchMan needs a star.

Warning: Opinions expressed by Nach or others in this post do not necessarily reflect the views, opinions, or position of Nach himself on the matter(s) being discussed therein.

Posted: 6/20/2010 6:32 PM

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Nach

Emulator Coder

Joined: 3/9/2004
Posts: 4588
Location: In his lab studying psychology to find new ways to torture TASers and forumers

Add this to the list of considerations. http://tasvideos.org/2701S.html See my acceptance speech for why I think it deserves a star.

Warning: Opinions expressed by Nach or others in this post do not necessarily reflect the views, opinions, or position of Nach himself on the matter(s) being discussed therein.

Posted: 6/20/2010 9:22 PM

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Baxter

Skilled player (1402)

Joined: 5/31/2004
Posts: 1821

Update: Added: Mega Man 5 New and great movie. Ultimate Mortal Kombat 3 Suggested a few times, there is no star of a fighting game yet. Arkanoid Got positive response after being mentioned and could be interepreted by some as being a puzzle game. Removed: King's Bounty I know it's popular by some, but there were quite a few posts preferring something else over it. For now, it loses its star. Golden Axe When this star was being questioned, people agreed it might as well lose the star. When I wanted to remove it Mukki just made a new version... It would seem a bit mean towards Mukki. It has had the star for a couple of months now, so I'll remove it now. People preferred more of a fighting game like UMK3. Point of discussion: Mega Man 7 has been suggested, Mega Man 8 has been suggested, currently Rockman and Forte (100CD) and the dual Mega Man X1+X2 have a star... how many stars should these games have and how should they be distributed?

http://tasvideos.org/Baxter.html

Posted: 6/20/2010 10:08 PM

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Nach

Emulator Coder

Joined: 3/9/2004
Posts: 4588
Location: In his lab studying psychology to find new ways to torture TASers and forumers

I would give R&F 100 CD star to MM7 (http://tasvideos.org/1550M.html)

Warning: Opinions expressed by Nach or others in this post do not necessarily reflect the views, opinions, or position of Nach himself on the matter(s) being discussed therein.

Posted: 6/20/2010 10:11 PM

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AngerFist

Active player (433)

Joined: 4/21/2004
Posts: 3517
Location: Stockholm, Sweden

I would never ever give Rockman & Forte's star to Mega Man 7.

Nitrogenesis wrote:

Guys I come from the DidyKnogRacist communite, and you are all wrong, tihs is the run of the mileniun and everyone who says otherwise dosnt know any bater! I found this run vary ease to masturbate too!!!! Don't fuck with me, I know this game so that mean I'm always right!StupedfackincommunityTASVideoz!!!!!!

Arc wrote:

I enjoyed this movie in which hands firmly gripping a shaft lead to balls deep in multiple holes.

natt wrote:

I don't want to get involved in this discussion, but as a point of fact C# is literally the first goddamn thing on that fucking page you linked did you even fucking read it

Cooljay wrote:

Mayor Haggar and Cody are such nice people for the community. Metro City's hospitals reached an all time new record of incoming patients due to their great efforts :P

Posted: 6/21/2010 2:23 AM

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Derakon

Joined: 7/2/2007
Posts: 3960

I would give a star to MM8 in preference to MM7, just because the quality of the game in question is so much higher (neither are very good games to play, but MM8 is leagues better to watch than MM7). But I like R&F better than either of the two games. On the other hand, the X1/X2 dual TAS has had a star for quite some time; it might be time to switch out to a different movie.

Pyrel - an open-source rewrite of the Angband roguelike game in Python.

Posted: 6/21/2010 9:18 AM

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Xkeeper

Banned User, Former player

Joined: 12/23/2004
Posts: 1850

Derakon wrote:

On the other hand, the X1/X2 dual TAS has had a star for quite some time; it might be time to switch out to a different movie.

Warp wrote:

I'm wondering if part of the reason could be something like "it has had the star for so long that it's about time to recycle the star and give it to something newer and fresher". We have to remember that the stars are a guideline to first-time viewers. They usually don't care when a run has been made or how long it has had a star. The important thing is to offer them a good sample of what TASing is all about. The age of a star doesn't matter in this.

Perma-banned

Posted: 6/21/2010 10:09 AM

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NitroGenesis

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Editor, Experienced player (551)

Joined: 12/24/2009
Posts: 1873

AngerFist wrote:

I would never ever give Rockman & Forte's star to Mega Man 7.

This.

YoungJ1997lol wrote:

Normally i would say Yes, but thennI thought "its not the same hack" so ill stick with meh.

Posted: 6/21/2010 3:21 PM

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andrewg

Experienced player (699)

Joined: 2/19/2006
Posts: 742
Location: Quincy, MA

AngerFist wrote:

I would never ever give Rockman & Forte's star to Mega Man 7.

I'm another for this

Super Mario Bros. console speedrunner - Andrew Gardikis

Posted: 6/22/2010 12:22 AM

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Mukki

Skilled player (1090)

Joined: 8/26/2006
Posts: 1139
Location: United Kingdom

I'm surprised that Mega Man 5 has been given a star so readily. Only Nach suggested that it should prior to publication and even then he only suggested that it should be considered by the star committee. In the spirit of this I'd like to offer some reasons as to why I believe a star is better elsewhere. One of the reasons that the star system was so drastically overhauled by Baxter is that certain franchises were soaking up too many stars and so no longer represented the site's content, or the interests of the viewers, appropriately. In my opinion, it is indicative of the video game industry that these franchises change considerably over time resulting in games within a franchise that differ enough to warrant more than one star. For example, few would argue that Super Mario Bros. 3 and Super Mario 64 are too similar, despite being of the same franchise, from a TASing perspective, they differ in almost every way. This distinction is not quite as obvious between the Mega Man runs that we have starred. I believe that, because of its novel nature, the dual run is not directly relevant to this argument. Perhaps some would argue that the Mega Man formula did not change sufficiently between Mega Man 2 and Rockman and Forte, but they are, at least, of different console generations and not quite of the same sub-series. I believe that Mega Man 2 and Mega Man 5 are too similar to both have a star. The changes to the Mega Man formula through the original series are too superficial; they are mainly a steady graphical improvement, an additional sliding technique and other minor changes. I don't believe that these differences are enough to warrant two stars. I also don't believe that the way in which the TASes played is enough of a distinction i.e. degree of esoteric glitching. This is not like the distinction between, say, alttp "glitched" and non-glitched, where the difference is tremendous and obvious. Both MM2 and MM5 still make considerable use of glitches, and on the differences in 'glitchiness' we wouldn't dream of making a categorical distinction between the two in any other aspect of the site and I don't think that we should do so here. Of the two I believe that Mega Man 2 is best suited for a star. As stated above the six games of the original series are similar enough to offer many of the same things to the viewer. Both the MM2 and MM5 TASes show fantastic lag control and luck manipulation under difficult circumstances and exceptional route planning in order to optimise pick-ups. It is on the issue of glitches that I believe MM2 is superior. MM1 is too esoteric to be of particular interest to some viewers, but MM2 and MM5 are both still 'legible' so to speak. I prefer MM2 because it utilises various items and other game phenomena (i.e. mecha-dragon). Most of MM5 glitching comes from Super Arrow use in (to some viewers) a rather repetitive manner. Also, the use of the super arrow detracts from the entertainment value. It is unfortunate that it is the fastest method of movement as it makes the run appear to suffer from SMW Syndrome (to fly over everything), which, in my opinion, if avoidable (which, incidentally, in this case it is not) is a TAS style taboo on par with clinging to the right in an auto-scroller or excessive wobbling. In MM 2 this is not done and so all the challenges that a normal player deals with are played TAS-style which is good for a starred run. Of course, it'd be unwise of me to suggest removal of a star without suggesting somewhere to put it. I'd like to see the star invested in the Donkey Kong franchise. Over the last year or so the Donkey Kong Country series in particular has seen considerable effort from some of our best TASers. The any% and 100% of DKC2 are the best of what we now have published and I used the word 'invest' in that new runs of DKC1 any% and 100% are on there way as is DKC3 100% (I think...) and so this star can be moved around within what should hopefully be a series of some of our best TASes. I'd suggest the DKC2 100% for now, but mainly I think that a series that has seen so much work from spectacular Comicalflop, Tompa, NxCy Arne etc. should have at least one star to it. Don't get me wrong, I enjoyed GlitchMan's run, but I'd like to stimulate more discussion on this as I believe it is now integral to the starring process and it just seems to me that this star was something of a knee-jerk reaction to an impressive new run of a popular series.

http://tasvideos.org/Mukki.html

Posted: 6/27/2010 1:06 AM
(Edited: 8/29/2010 3:03 PM)

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Sonikkustar

Skilled player (1308)

Joined: 9/7/2007
Posts: 1354
Location: U.S.

[Removed Crap] Also, as Mukki stated, certaint franchises seem to be taking the most stars. Mostly the Castlevania & Mega Man games. Ironically, there seems to be a scarce amount of Sonic runs. So I am in full support of giving the Donkey Kong Country 2 100% TAS a star.

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Posted: 7/9/2010 7:23 PM

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sgrunt

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Emulator Coder, Former player

Joined: 10/28/2007
Posts: 1360
Location: The dark horror in the back of your mind

I'll be the first to suggest it here: Brain Age.

Posted: 7/9/2010 7:43 PM

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Flygon

Joined: 11/4/2007
Posts: 1772
Location: Australia, Victoria

Assigned Notable publication status, just in case from the very unlikely chance that this isn't starred.

Posted: 7/10/2010 7:26 AM

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Baxter

Skilled player (1402)

Joined: 5/31/2004
Posts: 1821

Mukki's post makes sense. I changed Mega Man 5's star to a moon. I added Donkey Kong Country 2 100% and the new Brain Age TAS to the starlist.

http://tasvideos.org/Baxter.html

Posted: 7/10/2010 1:51 PM

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Nach

Emulator Coder

Joined: 3/9/2004
Posts: 4588
Location: In his lab studying psychology to find new ways to torture TASers and forumers

Nice additions. DKC2 really deserved it. Speaking of the moon, perhaps we consider giving it to more runs? We have a bunch of runs that perhaps aren't groundbreaking enough for a first timer, but are notable for members of the site. Commander Keen 5 is notable as being for DOS, a popular franchise that we haven't really tapped into, and beats known records. (not to mention, if you don't know about the glitches, you're shocked) Then perhaps we should consider some games for a moon that didn't quite make the star cut, or were replaced by something else? Family Feud? Battle of Olympus? We could easily enough add a lesser recommended but still recommended section. Yay? Nay?

Warning: Opinions expressed by Nach or others in this post do not necessarily reflect the views, opinions, or position of Nach himself on the matter(s) being discussed therein.