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Posted: 7/9/2009 3:28 AM
Post subject: Wonder Boy in Monster Land
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OmegaWatcher
Joined: 5/2/2009
Posts: 656
Well, It seems no one is working on this right now, so I tried a wip http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/1370300363/wip1.mmv It beats round 1 Please be gentle, this is my first time [edit] round 1 version 2, faster: http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/92200858/wip2.mmv [another edit] new wip, round 2 complete http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/1322524288/wip3.mmv
My first language is not English, so please excuse myself if I write something wrong. I'll do my best do write as cleary as I can, so cope with me here =) (ﾉಥ益ಥ）ﾉ
Posted: 7/10/2009 1:35 AM
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OmegaWatcher
Joined: 5/2/2009
Posts: 656
Gee people, calm down. One question at time =p New wip... http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/551508429/wip5.mmv
My first language is not English, so please excuse myself if I write something wrong. I'll do my best do write as cleary as I can, so cope with me here =) (ﾉಥ益ಥ）ﾉ
Posted: 7/10/2009 3:01 AM
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alden
Player (121)
Joined: 2/11/2007
Posts: 1522
Sorry, it's so hard to hold back my enthusiasm :) I think this has potential. Is the falling through the floor trick an intentional part of the game or a glitch? I assume the latter. Also, have you tested out damage boosting? It seems you might also save time at the end of the level when it's giving you points for health left.
I make a comic with no image files and you should read it. While there is a lower class, I am in it, and while there is a criminal element I am of it, and while there is a soul in prison, I am not free. -Eugene Debs
Posted: 7/10/2009 4:12 AM
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OmegaWatcher
Joined: 5/2/2009
Posts: 656
It's a glitch, activated when you jump and press left and right at the same time. Depending of the map, it activates a lot of weird stuff, like warping to the next room, getting back to the last room, losing all our hearts if you touch a boss, ignore item-trigging actions, or just falling through the floor. About damage boost, it seems faster then walking, I should already have tried that. The only thing that I'm worried right now is the damage I'll probably take in the last dungeon, due to damage time-related. That's the reason I always got "perfect" in all rounds.
My first language is not English, so please excuse myself if I write something wrong. I'll do my best do write as cleary as I can, so cope with me here =) (ﾉಥ益ಥ）ﾉ
Posted: 7/10/2009 4:42 AM
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alden
Player (121)
Joined: 2/11/2007
Posts: 1522
RE: damage boosting, I would suggest doing a test run and seeing what happens. Don't worry about optimizing it too much and plan on doing a revision afterwards. I know that's a lot of work, but I bet it'll be worth it in the end. What I've seen so far looks promising, especially that glitch...
I make a comic with no image files and you should read it. While there is a lower class, I am in it, and while there is a criminal element I am of it, and while there is a soul in prison, I am not free. -Eugene Debs
Posted: 7/10/2009 5:27 AM
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OmegaWatcher
Joined: 5/2/2009
Posts: 656
Well, i did some testing... http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/1106156342/test%20wip01.mmv It seems the damage boost speed is the same as the level 2 shoes (the one I bought). So it's faster just at the beginning. It could be used as a second jump, at least. [EDIT] http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/513322069/wip001.mmv GUESS WHAT, ANOTHER WIP, now with 65,7% more damage boost. Stops right after I buy the shoes
My first language is not English, so please excuse myself if I write something wrong. I'll do my best do write as cleary as I can, so cope with me here =) (ﾉಥ益ಥ）ﾉ
Posted: 7/11/2009 10:33 AM
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OmegaWatcher
Joined: 5/2/2009
Posts: 656
OH WOW ANOTHER WIP WHEN THE WACKINESS WILL EVER END http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/1089255629/wip002.mmv This one finishes level 3, I believe it looks way better than the first batch, and its like 500 frames faster Yeah, about the points in the final level... I usually get my health recovered after the boss fight, so it's kinda hard not getting perfect without getting a damage for "no reason". I believe I'll be able to do that in next level. [edit] http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/1821443509/wip003.mmv Well, here it is. No perfect this time, huh
My first language is not English, so please excuse myself if I write something wrong. I'll do my best do write as cleary as I can, so cope with me here =) (ﾉಥ益ಥ）ﾉ
Posted: 7/11/2009 8:54 PM
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alden
Player (121)
Joined: 2/11/2007
Posts: 1522
Looks good to me, I guess. My only suggestion would be more descriptive files than wip003 etc :D How much longer is the game?
I make a comic with no image files and you should read it. While there is a lower class, I am in it, and while there is a criminal element I am of it, and while there is a soul in prison, I am not free. -Eugene Debs
Posted: 7/11/2009 10:18 PM
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OmegaWatcher
Joined: 5/2/2009
Posts: 656
=p I will Well, it have 12 stages, but the next stages are hard as hell. http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/837261099/wip-WonderboyinMonsterLandsecondtrypart4stage7.mmv new wip, up to stage 7.
My first language is not English, so please excuse myself if I write something wrong. I'll do my best do write as cleary as I can, so cope with me here =) (ﾉಥ益ಥ）ﾉ
Posted: 7/15/2009 7:40 AM
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OmegaWatcher
Joined: 5/2/2009
Posts: 656
Ok, I finished my TAS. But I still want to do something. Can anyone help me with hex-editing?
My first language is not English, so please excuse myself if I write something wrong. I'll do my best do write as cleary as I can, so cope with me here =) (ﾉಥ益ಥ）ﾉ
Posted: 7/15/2009 10:11 AM
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AngerFist
Active player (437)
Joined: 4/21/2004
Posts: 3517
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
First edition TAS of 2015 Innovative TAS of 2007
OmegaWatcher wrote:
Ok, I finished my TAS. But I still want to do something. Can anyone help me with hex-editing?
Have you seen Xebra's submission of this game? If you haven't, it might be useful.
Nitrogenesis wrote:
Guys I come from the DidyKnogRacist communite, and you are all wrong, tihs is the run of the mileniun and everyone who says otherwise dosnt know any bater! I found this run vary ease to masturbate too!!!! Don't fuck with me, I know this game so that mean I'm always right!StupedfackincommunityTASVideoz!!!!!!
Arc wrote:
I enjoyed this movie in which hands firmly gripping a shaft lead to balls deep in multiple holes.
natt wrote:
I don't want to get involved in this discussion, but as a point of fact C# is literally the first goddamn thing on that fucking page you linked did you even fucking read it
Cooljay wrote:
Mayor Haggar and Cody are such nice people for the community. Metro City's hospitals reached an all time new record of incoming patients due to their great efforts :P
Posted: 7/15/2009 4:07 PM
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OmegaWatcher
Joined: 5/2/2009
Posts: 656
....no, I didn't. And his movie beats mine by 361 frames, and answer some questions I had in my run... Now I feel stupid... If anyone's interest, here's the "test" run... Well, back to the start. Yet another wip. It goes from the first stage to the boots, faster than both movies.
My first language is not English, so please excuse myself if I write something wrong. I'll do my best do write as cleary as I can, so cope with me here =) (ﾉಥ益ಥ）ﾉ
Posted: 7/17/2009 4:19 AM
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OmegaWatcher
Joined: 5/2/2009
Posts: 656
Ok, I finished a new version. It's on the workbench right now =p
My first language is not English, so please excuse myself if I write something wrong. I'll do my best do write as cleary as I can, so cope with me here =) (ﾉಥ益ಥ）ﾉ
Posted: 7/19/2009 6:06 AM
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OmegaWatcher
Joined: 5/2/2009
Posts: 656
Ok, I finished yet another version, after criticism that I received in the Workbench. http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/499788743/guesswhatanotherwonderboy2wip.mmv If you don't hear anything until monday, send Link.
My first language is not English, so please excuse myself if I write something wrong. I'll do my best do write as cleary as I can, so cope with me here =) (ﾉಥ益ಥ）ﾉ
Posted: 7/20/2009 10:08 AM
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Twisted_Eye
He/Him
Active player (398)
Joined: 10/17/2005
Posts: 632
Location: Seattle, WA
http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/1087035216/Wonder%20Boy%202%20-%20Wonderboy%20in%20Monsterland%20%28UE%29%20%5B%21%5D.mmv Here, I made this to show you some techniques to making a better run. After Stage 1, it's 3 seconds faster than your latest WIP. Try to compare to your run to see what you can do to make the run better. The first thing you'll notice is that your run uses 1274 rerecords during the entire playthrough. My WIP uses 627 for just Stage 1. That's a rerecord about every three and a half frames. It took me over two hours to do just Stage 1. That doesn't necessarily mean that that much work is required to do every stage; I was pretty distracted and spent time just figuring out the details of how to TAS this game. Try everything several different ways to get the fastest result you can find. Manipulating gold is easy, but takes a LOT of time through brute force--any slight change to Wonderboy's x-y coordinates or even his speed will alter the amount you get, so you can change how much you get without losing more than a frame or two of optimum movement. That's what took the bulk of my work time--doing the exact same coin-grab from 50 different speeds and directions to get that high score. I ended up 1 gold more than your run, and I didn't even spend any effort manipulating the gold collecting after beating the Reaper. I hope this gives you an idea what to do from here. Put more effort into frame hunting, but if it starts to suck your soul out from under you, it's okay to ease back a little until you feel comfortable. I look forward to a better run! Here's a challenge: See if you can get the end movie to be less than 11 minutes long. I'm sure you can do it!
Posted: 7/23/2009 5:58 PM
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OmegaWatcher
Joined: 5/2/2009
Posts: 656
Oh.. I'm trying very hard to at least get close from your framecount, but I'm failing miserably. I mean, my last wip goes just before you take damage from the first snake, and it's way slower... I'm sure I'm missing something. can you please help me? http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/352055327/wip%205%20t%201.mmv
My first language is not English, so please excuse myself if I write something wrong. I'll do my best do write as cleary as I can, so cope with me here =) (ﾉಥ益ಥ）ﾉ
Posted: 8/17/2009 5:00 PM
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Twisted_Eye
He/Him
Active player (398)
Joined: 10/17/2005
Posts: 632
Location: Seattle, WA
Oh, I didn't see that last post there. I've been reworking my WIP--I noticed that I screwed up big at the end, since my health was still full. Every quarter-heart drained during the 'Completed!' screen is 7 frames lost, and every quarter-heart given back is another 4 frames lost, or about 3/4s a second for every full heart remaining, and I was full! Using an interesting part of the left-right jumping glitch, I dropped my health to 0 using the larger snake (the smaller ones only drop it half) and tweaking my movements better I've cut off another couple seconds. I'll post it when I'm done with the stage proper. If you want to see how my style and your style compare framewise, just open up the emulator twice and put the windows next to each other, one running one mmv and the other the other. In the Graphics menu, make sure the both emulators are showing the button states and the frame counter. Then just watch how I do and compare it to yours with the frame counter and frame-by-frame replay, and strategy will reveal itself to you. http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/290853587/Wonder%20Boy%202%20-%20WIP%202-1.mmv Here's the new WIP. Every part of the stage is improved over what I showed last time. Damage-boosting off the last snake like you did was a good idea; your run was just littered with good ideas everywhere, really! Rewatching your whole run, I wondered about that Wizard that gives 10 lightnings. Maybe it really is worth it, but I'd like to use Memory Watch to check how much damage everything is doing to see for sure. Heck, maybe even skipping one of the swords saves time in the long run. Poking through the ram would be the way to go there.
Posted: 8/19/2009 7:58 AM
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Twisted_Eye
He/Him
Active player (398)
Joined: 10/17/2005
Posts: 632
Location: Seattle, WA
Holy crap. I always TAS with the sound turned off on the emulator, so when I rewatched my WIP just now I discovered an unfortunate fact about being as fast as possible: Having HP as low as possible turns on an incredibly irritating low-health-warning noise. Should the run go as quickly as possible by keeping the health as low as possible, or should the health stay just above one full heart to keep the wretched alarm from ruining the entertainment of watching?
Posted: 8/19/2009 4:14 PM
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Derakon
Joined: 7/2/2007
Posts: 3960
Oh man, I hate those low-health alarms. I hate them much more than I'd hate losing 44 frames each time you do a health tally.
Pyrel - an open-source rewrite of the Angband roguelike game in Python.
Posted: 8/19/2009 4:16 PM
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OmegaWatcher
Joined: 5/2/2009
Posts: 656
Please, PLEASE, above one full heart.
My first language is not English, so please excuse myself if I write something wrong. I'll do my best do write as cleary as I can, so cope with me here =) (ﾉಥ益ಥ）ﾉ
Posted: 8/23/2009 9:31 PM
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Twisted_Eye
He/Him
Active player (398)
Joined: 10/17/2005
Posts: 632
Location: Seattle, WA
Thankfully, it turns out that that's what I need to have anyway. The run has enough damage boosts throughout that I need to be prepared, and since bosses give a whole heart of health when killed, I have enough to keep the alarm from sounding and still bounce off of snakes as necessary. Almost done with Round 2. I'm doing a lot of thought for the rest of the run. I'll put off getting the Legendary Boots until after the pyramid--The 72 gold you get from the Sphinx makes sitting around waiting for coins to drop earlier a waste of time, and there's a shoe store right at the start of the next area anyway. I really need to figure out how to get the Python fietures working in Dega on my PC. Memory tools will make planning much easier. Is the gauntlet worth waiting for? Is every sword necessary to pick up? edit: Here's the WIP. Beats Round 3 it does. http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/811457804/Wonder%20Boy%202%20-%20WIP%203.mmv I won't post WIPs from now on like this probably. This here though is a good watch.
Posted: 8/25/2009 6:30 PM
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OmegaWatcher
Joined: 5/2/2009
Posts: 656
The gauntlet, as far as I know, gives a HUGE damage boost. As swords, it's not mandatory, but the damage may worth it. I'm not sure, though.
My first language is not English, so please excuse myself if I write something wrong. I'll do my best do write as cleary as I can, so cope with me here =) (ﾉಥ益ಥ）ﾉ
Posted: 8/26/2009 9:33 PM
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alden
Player (121)
Joined: 2/11/2007
Posts: 1522
For mem watch you need to install Python 2.4 (specifically that version) and also not use the new 1.16 build of dega...
I make a comic with no image files and you should read it. While there is a lower class, I am in it, and while there is a criminal element I am of it, and while there is a soul in prison, I am not free. -Eugene Debs
Posted: 8/26/2009 10:16 PM
(Edited: 9/18/2009 6:27 PM)
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Kumquat
Player (122)
Joined: 8/11/2009
Posts: 73
Location: Texas
I figured out how to get memory watch to work in Dega 1.16:
    1: Make sure you are not using Windows Vista. (This step is important!) 2: Install Python 2.5.4. 3: Yay, memory watch!
Edit: I finally got it to work with Vista! You just have to set Dega's compatibility mode to XP.
Posted: 8/27/2009 6:07 AM
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Twisted_Eye
He/Him
Active player (398)
Joined: 10/17/2005
Posts: 632
Location: Seattle, WA
alden wrote:
For mem watch you need to install Python 2.4 (specifically that version) and also not use the new 1.16 build of dega...
hahaha, somehow I have 2.6 and 2.5.4 installed but not 2.4. Thanks much! I'll see if I can use it without desyncing. And sadly I AM using Vista. New computer came with it. boo.
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