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Posted: 8/13/2004 4:37 AM
Post subject: Whomp 'Em
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KaitouKid
Former player
Joined: 6/6/2005
Posts: 384
You know, I took a shot at this earlier. After browsing through a walkthrough on Gamefaqs and after playing for a bit, I learned the following things. 1) Random Indian Boy (I'll call him Billy) has some of the worst controls ever. Billy likes to slip a pixel or three in either direction when turning, making quick turnarounds pretty much impossible. If a boss is diving at you, you WON'T be getting out of the way. 2) Getting hit sends Billy flying upwards. Only use I've found for this is for scaling the vertical areas. Why slowly jump from Platform A to Platform B just to get to Platform C...when you can let Billy get smacked on A and send him flying straight up to C? Faster, but it certainly cancels plans of a no-hit run. 3) The hit detection blows. His spear is just no good when it comes to bouncing off of the heads of your enemies... or for smacking small enemies. Gotta make sure you hit the attack button just right, as a slight pause will send the rerecord count up one more notch. 4) Descending areas bite. If you run at the edge of a cliff and let go of the d-pad right before you fall off, you'll sorta drift out a few pixels. Seemed to me that when I hit the opposite direction, Billy slips off faster. 5) It's very, very boring to watch when walking through long, flat areas where the only thing you can really do is to jump over enemies. The game doesn't seem like it'd take a LONG time to finish, but it'd certainly be trying on the nerves until you get the feel of the controls in slow motion down. I'll keep plugging away at it when I get bored... but VirtuaNES is still my emulator of choice. Anyone with Famtasia care to take a crack at it? c.c;
Posted: 8/13/2004 9:11 AM
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Walker_Boh
Former player
Joined: 4/16/2004
Posts: 1276
Location: Uppsala, Sweden
?I? ?a?c?t?u?a?l?l?y? ?t?r?i?e?d? ?t?h?i?s? ?a?n?d? ?i?t? ?a?p?p?e?a?r?s? ?t?o? ?b?e? ?a? ?c?u?t?e? ?M?e?g?a? ?M?a?n? ?c?l?o?n?e?.? ?I? ?d?o?n??t? ?k?n?o?w? ?i?f? ?I? ?w?a?n?n?a? ?d?o? ?t?h?i?s? ?b?e?c?a?u?s?e? ?t?h?e? ?c?o?n?t?r?o?l?s? ?i?s? ?a? ?b?i?t? ?b?a?d?,? ?a?s? ?y?o?u? ?s?a?i?d?.? ?A?n?y?w?a?y?s?,? ?i?t??s? ?a? ?p?r?e?t?t?y? ?c?o?o?l? ?g?a?m?e? ?a?n?d? ?w?i?t?h? ?s?o?m?e? ?e?f?f?o?r?t? ?i?m? ?s?u?r?e? ?i?t? ?w?o?u?l?d? ?m?a?k?e? ?a? ?g?o?o?d? ?t?i?m?e? ?a?t?t?a?c?k?.?
/Walker Boh
Posted: 8/17/2004 5:41 AM
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Xoria
Joined: 3/21/2004
Posts: 29
this is still one of my favorite NES games ever :o id love to see a speed run of this
Posted: 8/17/2004 5:46 AM
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Blechy
Former player
Joined: 6/27/2004
Posts: 550
Location: New York
This has been on my list of "would love to see" runs for awhile. BombAHead was doing a run for his own enjoyment, and it furthered my thinking that such a run shoudl be made. If I was familiar with famtasia and school didn't start in 2 days, I'd do it myself. But for those looking for a good run to do, this would make a good one. I think the only hard part would really be trying to get offense boosts at the right time, and planning where to take damage to assist mobility.
Posted: 8/17/2004 6:04 AM
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KaitouKid
Former player
Joined: 6/6/2005
Posts: 384
Yeah, you guys do one. I suck at this stuff. And anyway, I use VirtuaNES, so it wouldn't get published. c.c; I'm certain the game can be finished well under 15 minutes. After I finished the intro levels and all six that followed, the time was under 11. I gave up on the final stage, though, because it was a hideous bitch goddess. *grumbles*
Posted: 8/27/2004 3:02 PM
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Walker_Boh
Former player
Joined: 4/16/2004
Posts: 1276
Location: Uppsala, Sweden
?I?m? ?o?u?t? ?o?f? ?i?d?e?a?s? ?f?o?r? ?n?e?w? ?t?i?m?e? ?a?t?t?a?c?k?s?.? ?I? ?t?h?o?u?g?h?t? ?I? ?s?h?o?u?l?d? ?d?o? ?t?h?i?s?.? ?C?o?u?l?d? ?y?o?u? ?g?u?y?s? ?p?l?e?a?s?e? ?s?a?v?e? ?m?e? ?s?o?m?e? ?t?i?m?e? ?i?f? ?p?o?s?s?i?b?l?e??? ?=?)? ?W?h?a?t??s? ?t?h?e? ?o?p?t?i?m?i?z?e?d? ?r?o?u?t?e? ?e?t?c??? ?A?n?y?t?h?i?n?g? ?I? ?s?h?o?u?l?d? ?k?n?o?w? ?b?e?f?o?r?e? ?I? ?s?t?a?r?t??? ?V?e?r?y? ?t?h?a?n?k?f?u?l? ?f?o?r? ?s?u?g?g?e?s?t?i?o?n?s? ?a?n?d? ?s?u?c?h? ?i?f? ?I? ?g?i?v?e? ?i?t? ?a? ?t?r?y?.?
/Walker Boh
Posted: 8/27/2004 4:00 PM
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Cazlab
Joined: 7/5/2004
Posts: 551
Location: Karlstad, Sweden
Like megaman?! AND I HAVE NEVER PLAYED IT! got to d-load it now! :D
Posted: 8/28/2004 2:39 AM
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Blechy
Former player
Joined: 6/27/2004
Posts: 550
Location: New York
Excellent, walker! I've wanted to see this for a long time. Check out the one competent faq on gamefaqs. Other than that, the movie will include: 1) Route planning. I think each boss has a weakness of some sort. The FAQ will greatly assist with that. There are also areas which jumping at the right place will net you a bonus item(ex. life recovery item, etc.). You won't be able to get some of these items without stopping, but if this is the case I think you should still uncover every one. Individual level planning is also important for levels such as the ice level, where you have to fall down a vertical corridor as fast as possible, similar to super metroid's early vertical corridor(before the dead mother brain), only without the easy path on the far right. 2) Damage planning. You will be getting items similar to energy tanks in metroid(only they're only used once and can't be filled up again, almost like an extra life), and you will have a lot of life to work with, but taking a lot of damage will be necessary. This is a very platform-heavy platform game, and between this and the fact that taking damage knocks you up into the air(without sacrificing horizontal speed), you'll be taking a lot of damage. I suggest you view Bombahead's video in order to see level layouts, and this can assist in planning where to take damage(though several of his areas can be improved: he didn't plan on submitting this video). 3) Luck abuse. This partly goes along with #2: while you will be taking a lot of damage from enemies, you will also be defeating a lot of enemies, and almost every enemy drops an item of some sort. Some of these you collect to restore health, increase maximum health, and some are those energy-tankish things. But most importantly, some are temporary bonuses to either range, defense, or invincibility(I don't think there is a bonus to offense). I am guessing you will need to manipulate luck to get defense or invincibility bonuses where necessary. I really want this video to be as good as possible, ie the bosses cannot stop blinking. If you try at these parts and just can't get them to stop blinking, I will gladly assist you by doing the boss fights(in the mega man x2 video bosses didn't stop blinking unless it was unavoidable). This should look incredible.
Posted: 8/28/2004 3:01 AM
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KaitouKid
Former player
Joined: 6/6/2005
Posts: 384
Seeing as how I started this whole mess, I figured I may as well throw in what I could remember. I've chucked the VMV, or else I'd send it over to you so that you could see what I'd done in my run. But the final level is a hideous bitch goddess in which mini-versions of the 6 level bosses come at you. First thing - little Billy drifts when he's falling and turning out of a run. If you run towards an edge - and you will, since there are a lot of descent areas - hit left RIGHT as he hits the edge and you'll turn back the other way and drop straight down. I wish I could tell you something useful about the ice level. It's basically two huge, vertical shafts with interconnecting tunnels. Grab the spear powerup from the first miniboss fight at the bottom of shaft one, as the boss is annoying. Also, use the flame spear on him for added damage. There's an on-again/off-again invincibility item you can grab out of the first enemy at the start of the second vertical shaft. I only got it 2 out of the 3 times I did that spot, but it let me bypass the first half of it without having to worry about ducking into the leftmost ledges or downward-spearing enemies and bouncing. Pogo on the bosses. Most of 'em can be, and it's usually a good idea (and visually entertaining) if you can pogo on 'em for a good deal of the match without falling to the ground. The cloud boss that turns into the fire demon thing is a good example of this. You can literally pogo on top of it until he reaches his second form. You can mess with luck (or maybe glitch) the mushroom at the top of the intro level's vertical climb if you jump just right underneath it. In my final run, I jumped just enough to make a few pixels of sky above the topmost ledge visible, and when I continued on up, the mushroom that usually is there wasn't, saving me a second or so. I never really fiddled with the special items you get from bosses, save for the fire spear... there's a cloud you can ride, which is horribly slow in both forming and moving... there are spears you can throw that stick into walls (required for reaching certain ledges in the final stage unless you pogo a boss' mini-me...x.x;) and there's even some thing that apparently does a lot of damage but eats up a whole heart when it's used. One odd thing was this tractor-beam like weapon...you can grab and hold an enemy, then turn and release it at another, making them both die. I'm wanting to say that I used this in the water level's vertical climbing area of PAIN, but... Best of luck to ya, you're gonna need it. The game's a cake walk until the final stage. Maybe if I had gained better control of the special weapons, it woulda been easier, I dunno. But you should be able to pull a sub-15 minute run once it's done. It's a SHORT game, it's just frustrating in spots.
Posted: 8/28/2004 3:10 AM
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Blechy
Former player
Joined: 6/27/2004
Posts: 550
Location: New York
http://www.thezorz.com/agile/WhompEm2.vmv That's some version of Bombahead's run, but I'm not sure how far it goes. I'd really like to help as much as I can, so maybe after each level the three of us can collaborate or something to talk about it. But you're the one who wishes to take it on, so whatever you'd like.
Posted: 8/28/2004 2:11 PM
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Cazlab
Joined: 7/5/2004
Posts: 551
Location: Karlstad, Sweden
I started to play the game yesterday and i found it really fun! Would be great to see a timeattack at it :>
Posted: 8/28/2004 2:59 PM
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Walker_Boh
Former player
Joined: 4/16/2004
Posts: 1276
Location: Uppsala, Sweden
?T?h?a?t??s? ?a?w?e?s?o?m?e? ?g?u?y?s?!? ?I?'?l?l? ?f?i?n?i?s?h? ?t?h?i?s? ?i?n? ?t?h?e? ?n?e?x?t? ?w?e?e?k?,? ?i?f? ?s?c?h?o?o?l? ?d?o?e?s?n??t? ?t?u?r?n?s? ?o?u?t? ?t?o? ?b?e? ?a? ?b?i?t?c?h?.? ?T?h?a?n?k?s? ?f?o?r? ?t?h?e? ?u?s?e?f?u?l? ?i?n?f?o?!?
/Walker Boh
Posted: 9/1/2004 2:08 PM
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Walker_Boh
Former player
Joined: 4/16/2004
Posts: 1276
Location: Uppsala, Sweden
Firt playthrough gave a time of ~26 minutes =) Gonna start v1 soon.
/Walker Boh
Posted: 9/1/2004 9:24 PM
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Cazlab
Joined: 7/5/2004
Posts: 551
Location: Karlstad, Sweden
Gj ;> Looking forward to see it completed :)
Posted: 9/2/2004 7:32 PM
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Walker_Boh
Former player
Joined: 4/16/2004
Posts: 1276
Location: Uppsala, Sweden
?I?t? ?w?i?l?l? ?b?e? ?f?i?n?i?s?h?e?d? ?s?o?m?e? ?d?a?y? ?a?f?t?e?r? ?t?h?e? ?w?e?e?k?e?n?d?.? ?D?o?n??t? ?g?o?t? ?t?i?m?e? ?t?o? ?f?i?n?i?s?h? ?i?t? ?t?o?n?i?g?h?t? ?a?n?d? ?i?m? ?g?o?i?n?g? ?a?w?a?y? ?t?o?m?o?r?r?o?w?.? ?B?u?t? ?i?m? ?a?t? ?t?h?e? ?b?e?g?i?n?n?i?n?g? ?o?f? ?t?h?e? ?l?a?s?t? ?s?t?a?g?e? ?w?i?t?h? ?~?1?0? ?m?i?n?u?t?e?s?.?
/Walker Boh
Posted: 9/6/2004 6:55 PM
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Walker_Boh
Former player
Joined: 4/16/2004
Posts: 1276
Location: Uppsala, Sweden
?I?t??s? ?f?i?n?i?s?h?e?d? ?w?i?t?h? ?a? ?t?i?m?e? ?o?f? ?1?2?:?1?6?.?
/Walker Boh
Posted: 9/7/2004 2:50 PM
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Cazlab
Joined: 7/5/2004
Posts: 551
Location: Karlstad, Sweden
Nice! Gonna watch it now :>
Posted: 9/8/2004 7:48 PM
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Cazlab
Joined: 7/5/2004
Posts: 551
Location: Karlstad, Sweden
Great run! :> But does it realy goes faster with the cloud than to jump at those (i think they're green) things?
Posted: 9/8/2004 7:49 PM
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Walker_Boh
Former player
Joined: 4/16/2004
Posts: 1276
Location: Uppsala, Sweden
Yeah, they only makes me "climb" for a short distance every jump, with the cloud I can go all the way up with the only delay it takes me to get on it.
/Walker Boh
Posted: 9/8/2004 8:08 PM
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Cazlab
Joined: 7/5/2004
Posts: 551
Location: Karlstad, Sweden
Ok, nice ;> How many frames do you save by using the cloud?
Posted: 9/8/2004 8:09 PM
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Walker_Boh
Former player
Joined: 4/16/2004
Posts: 1276
Location: Uppsala, Sweden
?D?o?n??t? ?k?n?o?w? ?e?x?a?c?t?l?y?.? ?W?h?y? ?d?o?n??t? ?y?o?u? ?c?h?e?c?k? ?i?t???
/Walker Boh
Posted: 9/8/2004 8:17 PM
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Cazlab
Joined: 7/5/2004
Posts: 551
Location: Karlstad, Sweden
Cuz I don't do timeattacks ;/ Just love to watch them
Posted: 9/8/2004 8:26 PM
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Walker_Boh
Former player
Joined: 4/16/2004
Posts: 1276
Location: Uppsala, Sweden
?Y?o?u? ?d?o?n??t? ?h?a?v?e? ?t?o? ?m?a?k?e? ?a? ?w?h?o?l?e? ?t?i?m?e? ?a?t?t?a?c?k? ?t?o? ?c?h?e?c?k? ?t?h?a?t?.? ?y?o?u? ?c?a?n? ?u?s?e? ?m?y? ?.?f?m?v? ?i?f? ?y?o?u? ?w?a?n?t? ?t?o?o?.?
/Walker Boh
Posted: 9/9/2004 2:12 PM
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Cazlab
Joined: 7/5/2004
Posts: 551
Location: Karlstad, Sweden
?a?h? ?o?k?e?y?,? ?f??n?x? ?;?D?
Posted: 7/10/2006 9:54 PM
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adelikat
He/Him
Emulator Coder, Site Developer, Site Owner, Expert player (3573)
Joined: 11/3/2004
Posts: 4754
Location: Tennessee
TASer of 2010 NES TASer of 2010 DS TASer of 2010 Arcade TAS of 2010 NES TASer of 2008 NES TAS of 2008 Funny TAS of 2008 TASer of 2007 NES TASer of 2007 Funny TAS of 2007
Here is my first version of my TAS of this game. At the point that the last boss appears I am 857 frames ahead of Walker's run. It is flawed in that I didn't have enough energy to use the dragon weapon against the boss. Finishing this run would require going back and getting some energy refills. Since this is just my first version, I will just start a new run. Any comments would be most helpful. Also I am testing possible route changes but it seems that getting the cloud or spear immediately fails due to boss fights. The bosses have a 72 frame invulnerability period. Having the wrong weapon is an immediate 288 frame loss. These weapons save a lot of time in the early levels but not enough to compensate.
It's hard to look this good. My TAS projects
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