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Posted: 2/5/2010 8:47 PM
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Sonikkustar
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Stage 3 Boss Redo What do you guys think now? Total Savings:206 frames
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Posted: 2/7/2010 2:17 AM
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mklip2001
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Much better boss fight. Nice going! I'm really enjoying this run so far.
Used to be a frequent submissions commenter. My new computer has had some issues running emulators, so I've been here more sporadically. Still haven't gotten around to actually TASing yet... I was going to improve Kid Dracula for GB. It seems I was beaten to it, though, with a recent awesome run by Hetfield90 and StarvinStruthers. (http://tasvideos.org/2928M.html.) Thanks to goofydylan8 for running Gargoyle's Quest 2 because I mentioned the game! (http://tasvideos.org/2001M.html) Thanks to feos and MESHUGGAH for taking up runs of Duck Tales 2 because of my old signature! Thanks also to Samsara for finishing a Treasure Master run. From the submission comments:
Shoutouts and thanks to mklip2001 for arguably being the nicest and most supportive person on the forums.
Posted: 2/7/2010 2:22 AM
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Sonikkustar
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Thanks! :) Anyways. I'm kinda stuck right now since there is so much lag. Here is my progress so far. http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/1324963302/Vice%20-%20Project%20Doom%20TAS.fm2 Total time saved so far is 257 frames btw.
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Posted: 2/7/2010 4:03 AM
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mklip2001
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In 4-1, there's one particularly laggy segment when you're trying to take the top path. Is it possible to shoot the gun while on the lower level, so that the bullet takes out an enemy once you've scrolled the screen to the right? I don't know if the timing works out, or if this would reduce lag (since a bullet is an extra sprite after all), but maybe it could work. Or potentially it's worth it to turn around very briefly and shoot a cat or something.
Used to be a frequent submissions commenter. My new computer has had some issues running emulators, so I've been here more sporadically. Still haven't gotten around to actually TASing yet... I was going to improve Kid Dracula for GB. It seems I was beaten to it, though, with a recent awesome run by Hetfield90 and StarvinStruthers. (http://tasvideos.org/2928M.html.) Thanks to goofydylan8 for running Gargoyle's Quest 2 because I mentioned the game! (http://tasvideos.org/2001M.html) Thanks to feos and MESHUGGAH for taking up runs of Duck Tales 2 because of my old signature! Thanks also to Samsara for finishing a Treasure Master run. From the submission comments:
Shoutouts and thanks to mklip2001 for arguably being the nicest and most supportive person on the forums.
Posted: 2/7/2010 4:27 AM
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Sonikkustar
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If I gow down there, then I'll have to jump back up because that is the only path. When you use a weapon, your momentum is kept along with it. Its also sometimes faster to let enemies run off screen than to kill them because the game doesnt have to focus on their sprite which reduces lag.
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Posted: 2/9/2010 7:16 PM
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Sonikkustar
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http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/1305882547/Vice%20-%20Project%20Doom%20TAS.fm2 I had to stop and collect some drops in order to reduce lag. 5-2 is probably going to be redone. 311 saved so far.
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Posted: 2/11/2010 2:13 AM
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mklip2001
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Looks nice so far! Your strategies for getting through the rock wall thingies looks a lot better than the current run, and it even seems a little better than Hisatoki's run. The lag is pretty heavy at the end of 5-1. Would more grenades help clear out enemies there? As for 5-2, it looked like you got on the last log a little late. Overall, this stage looks obnoxious... it's probably worth a redo to see if anything better happens. Have you figured out what influences the log drops?
Used to be a frequent submissions commenter. My new computer has had some issues running emulators, so I've been here more sporadically. Still haven't gotten around to actually TASing yet... I was going to improve Kid Dracula for GB. It seems I was beaten to it, though, with a recent awesome run by Hetfield90 and StarvinStruthers. (http://tasvideos.org/2928M.html.) Thanks to goofydylan8 for running Gargoyle's Quest 2 because I mentioned the game! (http://tasvideos.org/2001M.html) Thanks to feos and MESHUGGAH for taking up runs of Duck Tales 2 because of my old signature! Thanks also to Samsara for finishing a Treasure Master run. From the submission comments:
Shoutouts and thanks to mklip2001 for arguably being the nicest and most supportive person on the forums.
Posted: 2/11/2010 2:26 AM
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Sonikkustar
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If I throw a gernade, then thats just another sprite that the game has to worry about. I actually have figured out what causes the logs to fall. Its kinda on a timer of sorts. Each log falls at a certaint position, regardless of where you are. So it would be very annoying.
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Posted: 2/11/2010 3:46 AM
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mklip2001
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Ok, if the grenade doesn't kill enemies quickly enough to reduce the lag sufficiently, I'll buy that. Good luck with the logs!
Used to be a frequent submissions commenter. My new computer has had some issues running emulators, so I've been here more sporadically. Still haven't gotten around to actually TASing yet... I was going to improve Kid Dracula for GB. It seems I was beaten to it, though, with a recent awesome run by Hetfield90 and StarvinStruthers. (http://tasvideos.org/2928M.html.) Thanks to goofydylan8 for running Gargoyle's Quest 2 because I mentioned the game! (http://tasvideos.org/2001M.html) Thanks to feos and MESHUGGAH for taking up runs of Duck Tales 2 because of my old signature! Thanks also to Samsara for finishing a Treasure Master run. From the submission comments:
Shoutouts and thanks to mklip2001 for arguably being the nicest and most supportive person on the forums.
Posted: 2/11/2010 4:15 AM
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Sonikkustar
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mklip2001 wrote:
Good luck with the logs!
You have no idea how bad that sounds right now....XD Anyways, I saved another 20 frames on the logs! I'll post another WIP when i'm done with the next few stages.
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Posted: 2/12/2010 3:10 AM
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Sonikkustar
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Stage 5! At the begining, Its actually gaster to avoid killing the fishes because if you kill a fish, then another one spawns a few frames later causing more lag. It is also faster to tale damage as far to the right as possible. I'll just post this to tie you guys off. ;) 45% of the game done!
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Posted: 2/12/2010 3:54 AM
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mklip2001
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It's a shame that the logs can't be made to work any better than that, but I'll believe you tried really hard. As for 5-3, nice damage boost off the fish to go through the first set of vines. I'm a little surprised that you don't kill more enemies near the end of the stage, though... that area crawls with lag. As for the boss fight, I've never liked the way that fight looks, jumping and whipping twice. How many times does the grenade hit? I was wondering if it would be possible / faster to whip once then throw a grenade in a jump. It seems to me that if you could do this, then the grenade would still do some damage when you're lower to the ground. However, I haven't actually run this game before... I just like watching it. So if I'm wrong, that's fine, but I thought it would be helpful to throw out ideas in the WIP forum.
Used to be a frequent submissions commenter. My new computer has had some issues running emulators, so I've been here more sporadically. Still haven't gotten around to actually TASing yet... I was going to improve Kid Dracula for GB. It seems I was beaten to it, though, with a recent awesome run by Hetfield90 and StarvinStruthers. (http://tasvideos.org/2928M.html.) Thanks to goofydylan8 for running Gargoyle's Quest 2 because I mentioned the game! (http://tasvideos.org/2001M.html) Thanks to feos and MESHUGGAH for taking up runs of Duck Tales 2 because of my old signature! Thanks also to Samsara for finishing a Treasure Master run. From the submission comments:
Shoutouts and thanks to mklip2001 for arguably being the nicest and most supportive person on the forums.
Posted: 2/12/2010 3:58 AM
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Sonikkustar
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For the end of 5-3, I cant kill any enemies at all because they're too spread out. At the boss, the gernades will do 2 damage. But if you slash while the gernade is still going off, the second hit doesnt register. The gernade was only used to get the hit early in the fight. The rest was just slashing because bullets cant reach it. Thanks for your ideas & feedback! It helps that this run has interest! :)
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Posted: 2/13/2010 5:23 AM
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Sonikkustar
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Hey guys. I wont be here for a while, so I want to give you guys a heads up. Total Saved:789 frames
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Posted: 2/16/2010 4:04 AM
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Sonikkustar
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Quick heads up. I got past the laggy area and are now heading into the boss! I saveda few more frames over my last attempt so now the grand total is 801 frames! EDIT: Im at Stage 9 right now. And the grand total so far is.....1184 frames saved!
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Posted: 2/21/2010 6:33 PM
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Sonikkustar
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Hello again. I just wanted to say that I'm almost done with the game. I wont mention how many frames I have saved to keep the surprise. ;)
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Posted: 12/9/2016 1:14 AM
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Tarbash
Joined: 12/9/2016
Posts: 2
Sorry for the messy video, but I was just curious whether this trick would be worth anything for a TAS in this particular spot or elsewhere in the game. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3lm-9Sk75sE
Posted: 12/9/2016 10:13 PM
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TaoTao
Experienced player (941)
Joined: 9/18/2008
Posts: 153
Location: Japan
Tarbash wrote:
Sorry for the messy video, but I was just curious whether this trick would be worth anything for a TAS in this particular spot or elsewhere in the game. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3lm-9Sk75sE
I am not so familiar with this game, but I could easily reproduce this (and in another place). I could not perform this wallzipping when I jump rightward. I suspect you can perform it only when you jump leftward... EDIT: I am not sure but probably this will be useful here (or in some other places)?
Posted: 12/10/2016 12:59 AM
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WhiteHat94
Joined: 5/2/2015
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Here are a couple I found as well, might make a compilation of all the ones I found https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ZO20hNKNd4
Posted: 12/10/2016 4:15 PM
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TaoTao
Experienced player (941)
Joined: 9/18/2008
Posts: 153
Location: Japan
I analyzed this game roughly, so I put the result for reference (as you might already know). EDIT: I analyzed only about platforming levels. First, I put some memory addresses:
$05     U8      input_1         # ABSTUDLR
$06     U8      input_2
$07     U8      input_new_1
$08     U8      input_new_2
$09     U8      input_prev_not_1
$0A     U8      input_prev_not_2

$0B     U16     scroll_x
$0D     U8      scroll_y

$0E     U8      prg_id_saved(16k)

$93     U8      flags           # bit7:paused, bit0:cheat allowed

$EF     U8      weapon          # 0:whip, 1:gun, 2:grenade

$0100-$013F     U8[0x40]    stack

# objects
# -------
# the hero is always the first object.
# velocity and acceleration are signed-magnitude format.
# (i.e. bit7:sign, bit6-0:absolute value)

$0190-$019F     U8[16]      obj_accel_y
$01A0-$01AF     U8[16]      obj_vel_y
$01B0-$01BF     U8[16]      obj_pos_y_subpx     # 0..15
$01C0-$01CF     U8[16]      obj_accel_x
$01D0-$01DF     U8[16]      obj_vel_x
$01E0-$01EF     U8[16]      obj_pos_x_subpx     # 0..15
$01F0-$01FF     U8[16]      obj_pos_x_px_lo
$0200-$020F     U8[16]      obj_pos_x_px_hi
$0210-$021F     U8[16]      obj_pos_y_px_lo
$0220-$022F     U8[16]      obj_pos_y_px_hi

$0280-$028F     U8[16]      obj_hp

$035D   U8      time(frame)
$035E   U8      time(sec)
$035F   U8      bullet_num
$0360   U8      grenade_num
$0361   U8      coin_num        # 0..99
$0362   U8      life            # 0..9
$0363   U16     score           # 100x

$036F   U8      cheat:slow_motion

$0700-$07FF     Sprite[64]  sprite_buffer
For the cheat, see gamefaqs. I think 2P input is used only for the cheat. I wrote a HUD script to display position, velocity, acceleration, and HPs. As you may notice by using the HUD script, velocity value is actually not correct when you go leftward. For some reason, the actual velocity is oscillated when you go leftward. I suspect this might be the reason why you can perform the wallzipping only leftward. As the latest submission says, it seems that you can manipulate y-subpixel by pressing select at the moment you jump. For object position calculation code, see $06:88A0 and $06:891B (object index is passed via X register). Bank switching (16K, $8000-$BFFF) routine is at $DFC2, $DFC6. $DFC6 simply switches bank. $DFC2 saves the specified PRG-ID to $0E.
Posted: 12/11/2016 10:41 PM
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TaoTao
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It seems that you can start the first stage faster than the current run. If you press A at frame 276 or after, the first stage starts 4 frames faster. I may be still overlooking something and there may be room to optimize more, so please tell me if you find something. I do not know whether original authors took this into account. But anyway, this game looks unfriendly to hex-editing, so I still cannot say whether it really saves time. EDIT:I could start the first stage 5 frames faster than the current run.
Posted: 12/12/2016 5:16 AM
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XYZ
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Btw, is ducking run really slowly? Pressing down and run.
Posted: 12/12/2016 5:39 AM
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TaoTao
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XYZ wrote:
Btw, is ducking run really slowly? Pressing down and run.
No, as far as I have watched memory. But if you start running with <down+right> button, you will be delayed by 1 frame. You have to press <down> after you start running. Now I do not take lags into account. This game is laggy, so ducking (or not ducking) may lead to unexpected lags.
Posted: 12/12/2016 5:45 AM
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XYZ
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Location: 2bastuz
I asked based only on observations. Lags. Of course. Laggy game.
Posted: 12/13/2016 12:19 PM
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TaoTao
Experienced player (941)
Joined: 9/18/2008
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Location: Japan
I tried doing 1-1, and saved 28 frames from the current run (5 frames at opening, and 23 frames at 1-1). I will continue based on this movie. And feel free to use (or improve :) this movie. After you kill the 1-1 boss, your position seems to affect the amount of lags before 2-1 starts. And, subpixels are not reset even if next stage starts. Considering these, strict optimization will be hard...
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