I need a save right before Richter for some tests.... I'll try hacking first though.
<klmz> it reminds me of that people used to keep quoting adelikat's IRC statements in the old good days
<adelikat> no doubt
<adelikat> klmz, they still do
I'm replaying this in J&C mode on Hard, and I discovered a loop against Balore:
* Balore does his eye laser
* Duck under it at the point where it finishes widening out
* Jump-attack him (I get three hits in with the Alucard Spear)
* He does the eye laser again
I don't know that this would be particularly useful in a TAS, since his other attacks don't prevent you from attacking him in return, but I thought it was interesting enough to be worth posting. He seems to be willing to do this indefinitely; I've used it against him several times now (I tend to use the first loop of the Nest of Evil to train up new subweapons). Getting him to initiate the eye laser in the first place seems to be random, though.
Pyrel - an open-source rewrite of the Angband roguelike game in Python.
Joined: 6/21/2006
Posts: 401
Location: Japan, Nagoya
I've worked on a suspend glitchless run of the game for a week, and I've finished it now.
http://portraitofruin.googlecode.com/svn-history/r263/trunk/Drafts/PoR-NOOB-SloppyTest.dsm
Encodes:
http://dic.nicovideo.jp/v/sm10156246http://dic.nicovideo.jp/v/sm10200666
Since this work has started as a test run with no particular plans, you might find a bunch of unoptimized movements, mistakes, and possibly improvable strategies, in the run. (I didn't even aim for frame-perfect movement at some points). However, I aimed to make it entertaining enough.
If you recommend submitting the run to the site, I probably will later.
Major Mistakes / Improvable Things
Wait Cube room: Jonathan obviously can push a statue faster than Charlotte. There is even no need to push a statue
Buy Knife to perform partner switch jumping faster
(Do Dart boost)
After getting the doublejump ability, we can move faster than partner switch dash, by backdash-doublejump-kick movement (just like AoS!)
Saving is needed to use Magical Ticket. However, there is no need to reset :/
(Wrong selection in the long item-selling part)
Obtaining Moonwalker in City of Haze (and give it to Jonathan) will save time
There is no need to enter a warp room in Nation of Fools
Train in 13th Street can be skipped by the special attack of Katar (thanks Satoryu)
I guess we can skip one more wing attack of True Dracula. I haven't tried that yet though
There might be more things I forgot to note...
Suggestions about general strategy are welcome (especially about better equips)
Enjoy.
That was very nice. But it's definitely not submittable yet, not with the mistakes present.
One thing you didn't do, for example, is use the Axe special attack to skip pushing the train at the beginning of 13th Street.
at the beginning of the second part on nicovideo, you're doing some additional shopping, right after taking a detour to get more money. Looks like the detour can be avoided.
Purify can be cast faster when charlotte is the active character. It takes some luck to survive the cast and still have both sisters in effect range, but wouldn't it be faster?
I enjoyed the run, but IMHO the flaws are too obvious for publication. Are you planning to do an improved run someday?
Joined: 6/21/2006
Posts: 401
Location: Japan, Nagoya
Tub wrote:
at the beginning of the second part on nicovideo, you're doing some additional shopping, right after taking a detour to get more money. Looks like the detour can be avoided.
Yeah, both that detour and shopping can be avoided (merged). That's one of obviously redundant parts.
Tub wrote:
Purify can be cast faster when charlotte is the active character. It takes some luck to survive the cast and still have both sisters in effect range, but wouldn't it be faster?
That might be, thanks. I didn't know she can cast a spell faster when she is active.
No, Charlotte casts a spell in the same speed whether she is active or not (at least, for Sanctuary). Look at 020fcc1c if you want to verify it by yourself.
Tub wrote:
Are you planning to do an improved run someday?
Yeah, I probably will someday. I think the making of a serious run takes much time.
Well, I enjoyed it! Thanks for making it. Just one stylistic request, though -- could you switch one of Charlotte's poses for Jonathan's air guitar, please?
Is there any way to lure Stella closer to the ground so you can use the dart attack down there and she doesn't have as fall to far once you beat her?
Why didn't you do as much team-switching in the room in portrait 4 with the Treant and tombstones? Does it create too much lag or something?
Man, Brauner must look like a pincushion by the time you're done with him!
Is it possible to manipulate the attacks Death uses so he doesn't use the horizontal slash or the dive attack?
Pyrel - an open-source rewrite of the Angband roguelike game in Python.
No, Charlotte casts a spell in the same speed whether she is active or not (at least, for Sanctuary). Look at 020fcc1c if you want to verify it by yourself.
hmm, you're right. Looks like my brain is playing tricks on me.
Or maybe it was related to the sorceress crest, which wouldn't be feasible to get in an any% anyway.
Another thing I remembered. I believe it's quicker to scroll the text in the cutscene when you first enter City of Haze instead of skipping it. At least it feels that way.
Hey, I'm not dead yet, and I'm still working on my own NOOB run (used to be a co-authored run, but ljffdb2 quitted the two-player team at the beginning). I don't know the exact date when I can finish it, but I suppose this year.
EDIT: It is going to take much longer than I expeced.
I think moozooh was right with that two players making two runs of the same category of the same game would be a waste. However, I won't interfere with your plan. If you feel like put your run (not this test run) in the workbench, just do it.
<klmz> it reminds me of that people used to keep quoting adelikat's IRC statements in the old good days
<adelikat> no doubt
<adelikat> klmz, they still do
<klmz> it reminds me of that people used to keep quoting adelikat's IRC statements in the old good days
<adelikat> no doubt
<adelikat> klmz, they still do
In case no one considered it yet, getting STR Boost (+30 STR fully charged) might be beneficial - it saves over two minutes on Drac unassisted, at least. Looking at the published TAS, you would either
- move past the spot where you SG into The Throne Room, partner jump up to STR Boost and suspend back to the exit on the right side
or
- suspend back into the map right after Behemoth and the pushing block (after SGing outside next to Raging Fire), traverse the two big Great Stairway rooms, get STR Boost, activate the warp next to where you SG into The Throne Room, continue to Sandy Grave as usual, then warp right next to where you SG into The Throne Room after getting Holy Claymore. This seems faster.
For SG-less runs, you're traversing the room anyway, so definitely get it.
For the record, I was also considering SGing to (from Wind's room (it might also be faster (real-time) to SG from Wind's room to Raging Fire after getting Lizard Tail) and Magical Ticketing from Offensive Form (+8 STR), but I don't really think it's worth it. Still something to look into, I guess.
Well you know, you could open desmume, load up the movie, and test it by yourself, i realy have doubt you could offset the time lost with dracula battle, because, if you realy try what you suggested, youll see by yourself youll loose a lot of time to get the +30, considering it takes a while to suspend, reset and reload (SG), those times are part of the movie you know.
Oh and yeah, unassisted is totaly irrelevant for comparing, i think.
Also, are you sure it realy provide a boost at all? i remember perfectly to have try to get a few extra level up (giving more STR), but the damage done on (true)dracula would not be affected at all, or just by 1.
What does happen to darts once you have +30 STR ? hmm, do you still have enought mp to use some darts ? or is it just based on INT maybe....
I'm just suggesting possible improvements - you don't have to test it, and I don't intend to TAS anything myself. At lvl 9, Holy Claymore does 90 dmg with STR Boost and 64 dmg without. Dart dmg is based on INT. Another possible alternative is partner jumping off the drawbridge to get ALL Boost (STR,CON,INT,MND,LCK +15) - considering the speed of Dart spam and the time it takes to charge the spell, the INT boost probably won't help, but you could still get it for the STR.
With the latest dart spam method found by klmz/gocha, even at 10 dmg i assume it would be worthy, because you can actually trow extremly fast.
The problem iirc is since darts are not holy based, they dont do shit on true dracula, how much damage you get with +15 INT ?
The casting time for the spell should not be a problem, theres a bunch of spare time, and the battle is quite long.
Getting +26 dmg should be enought to warrant a significiant boost on true dracula, but how much you get with "just" +15 STR then ?
I didnt sayd you should start tasing, all i sayd its easy to make a (sloppy) test on the time it takes to get the spell, its a common approach around to try directly by making a small test movie to demonstrate suggestions, this generaly tend to help make decisions over just talking in the dark. (unlike movies we are not perfect, and im far from having enough memory to remember every situations and everything) Its a plus, not required anyway.
I didn't suggest using Darts on Drac; if anything, it would speed up the Astarte fight. Holy Claymore + ALL Boost does 76 dmg. My STR Boost-related suggestions are TAS-only since the route doesn't include Stone of Flight and Speed Up.
