Is this really a test run?
If the completed test run was submitted I think it would be accepted, it is a very high quality run!
I was amazed by some of the tricks, you just run through the stages like there is nothing holding you, it's amazing!
Yes, I think the same. But it's important that he continue with this perfectionism in order to save even more time.
Joined: 6/2/2009
Posts: 1182
Location: Teresópolis - Rio de Janeiro - Brazil
Thankyou guys, but there's lots of things to improve in this test run;
green banana bonus must be manipulated, boss battles are not optimal,
also, some Bear Coins will not be collected in the final run, I'm collecting
them just in case we need to avoid some coins to manipulate a bonus.
here, I'm in the midle of Konveyor Rope Klash with 49 coins.
I am old enough to know better, but not enough to do it.
I'm watching it now and have a few questions, why (when running) you sometimes roll continuosly and some other times roll+jump? also, you start with Dixie which I think is the fastest character but then continue with Kiddy, isn't he slower?
edit: after continuing to watch, I see you switch back to Dixie, is there a reason why Kiddy is faster on the snow level?
in the trees level you switch back to Kiddy, I don't get it
also I noticed a funny glitch after the bonus levels when Kiddy jumps against a wall, how is that executed? xD
Joined: 6/2/2009
Posts: 1182
Location: Teresópolis - Rio de Janeiro - Brazil
Hi ALAKTORN, up to Low G- Labyrinth I just did the banana bonus, the rest is exactly as in ElectroSpecter's wip.
but about the character management, sometimes we need to throw the other kong to reach a higher place or a warp barrel,
and only Kiddy can do this. but there are places where only Dixie can reach with her helicoptery hair, in other words, we need to switch them alot.
to jump after the bonus coin is collected, you must jump one frame before the kong touches the coin.
I am old enough to know better, but not enough to do it.
Joined: 8/6/2006
Posts: 784
Location: Connecticut, USA
ALAKTORN wrote:
I'm watching it now and have a few questions, why (when running) you sometimes roll continuosly and some other times roll+jump?
The reason here is that continuous rolling is slower than the roll+jump but faster than running. So on unique areas that require us to move forward a little before rolling (e.g. running close enough to a cliff to roll off it), we substitute the run+roll+jump with slow-roll+fast-roll+jump, if that makes sense. Of course, roll+jumpX2 would be faster, but often there isn't enough room. Sorry if that's confusing.
ALAKTORN wrote:
edit: after continuing to watch, I see you switch back to Dixie, is there a reason why Kiddy is faster on the snow level?
The real reason here is that it's much faster to use Kiddie on Tidal Trouble and it takes a few dozen frames to switch to Dixie. Dixie has the same running speed as Kiddie, but her roll is indeed faster. This is actually something I've never really tested extensively, but the more important thing is maximizing the utility of the Kongs* while minimizing the amount of time spent switching between them (which usually means getting hit, as this usually allows us to do something in addition to switching Kongs, such as passing through a line of enemies that you usually need to use barrels to get through or something else of that time-consuming nature). Of course, in longer levels it may indeed be best to switch to Dixie manually, and the time would be made up by her slightly faster rolls in the long run, but it's somewhat doubtful.
* Kiddie can bounce on the water, kill large enemies, and handles barrels and team throws much better, Dixie has her helicopter move.
ALAKTORN wrote:
also I noticed a funny glitch after the bonus levels when Kiddy jumps against a wall, how is that executed? xD
You just have to jump at the right time. It actually saves time in some bonus levels, as the bonus will fade when a Kong hits a wall. So in bonus levels that have doors at the end, jumping into the wall lets us exit faster. Any other time you see it done it's just for show.
thanks for the answers :)
I also noticed that in Riverside Race you guys often bounce off the water when the speedrun and TAS records don't, here's the fastest TAS I've found: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cXyi5P1v3AQ by 0xwas
it looks slower to bounce off the water in some places that you guys did
Joined: 8/6/2006
Posts: 784
Location: Connecticut, USA
Whoops, regarding Skidda's Row (the ice level you mentioned), I think it would probably end up being faster to switch to Dixie at the beginning of this level, as she needs to be in the lead anyway for Murky Mill. The reason the run is still like this is because the warp in Murky Mill was originally used, and Kiddie needed to throw Dixie. Now I think we figured out it's faster to just do the level normally. I think.
I don't know about the bouncing off water thing... it might be slower but I have yet to really check, as I haven't TASed this particular level in a couple years.
Joined: 6/2/2009
Posts: 1182
Location: Teresópolis - Rio de Janeiro - Brazil
Um... I thought water could slow us down! anyway, this test run will also be useful to plan character management, that's cool.
but there's something not so cool; Creepy Cavern's ghost barrels, they can be worst than green banana bonus...
I am old enough to know better, but not enough to do it.
Joined: 8/15/2005
Posts: 1942
Location: Mullsjö, Sweden
About the riverside race... I have a run that's 51:87. But I know it is improveable, so I was going to improve it to the max before uploading it somewhere.
But here it is http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/1781577036/RiversideraceHARDR.smv
Keep on going with your run, Dooty. Going to be nice to see the optimised version later on! I won't even bother to complain on stuff you could have done better right now :).
Joined: 8/6/2006
Posts: 784
Location: Connecticut, USA
Also remember that the Riverside Race timer jumps around stupidly (easy to see with frame advance) so touching the flag later might result in a lower real-time record.
Joined: 8/15/2005
Posts: 1942
Location: Mullsjö, Sweden
My run was only meant to get the fastest time possible, not 100% the level. And it's faster to enter the bonuses than to not to.
Specter: Yeah, the timer makes no sense... Stupid programming that one. I don't remember if I delayed anything in my run though.
it's not really simple, I know nothing about SNES TASing, I can't tell what emulator I should use from the file's extension and downloading emulator+ROM takes time, I'm pissed off of you people taking for a given that everyone should have emulator+ROM of everything to play these movies, I simply asked for a favour if someone wanted to encode it, if you don't want to, don't post, you don't need to tell me I have to download things as if it's a given
Joined: 8/15/2005
Posts: 1942
Location: Mullsjö, Sweden
Well, sorry... Didn't mean to be rude or anything. And if you think it's hard and confusing to use the emulators, just read on the site how to or ask about it :).
A .smv file is the movie file for SNES. In this case you can see the emulator version by checking the link I posted. On the top it says "(Snes9X Movie -- v1.43(-WIP". The 1.43 is the SNES9X version used.
And it can be found here.
To load the movie, you first open the emulator and then load the rom, which you'll have to find yourself. Rom version is U 1.0. When you have loaded the rom, you go to File -> Movie -> Play Movie... Find the movie and play it.
If it says that the rom versions, the rom the movie used and the rom you are using, mismatch, you are most likely using the wrong version.
And yeah, I can agree it's easier to just watch an encode. But people don't feel like encoding every single emulator movie out there. So it is a good thing to learn how to play them through an emulator anyway.
Dear Alakaza... ALAKTORN, here's a useful link for you:
Emulator Resources
Please take a moment to read through the page and help yourself to the correct emulator. I'm pretty sure you're intelligent enough to figure out which one you should get.
Using the emulator to watch a WIP is pretty common in here and I think everyone should practice this, since it gives you an ability to watch the movie more closely with frame advance and slowdown and input display and such. It's also very easy and doesn't consume someone elses time and resources, because that's what encoding takes! If you want to watch a WIP and there are no other options than the input file, please use that option.
Also, please drop the hostile attitude. It's not very nice.
Yours truly,
Brushy
EDIT: Oh and Tompa was nice and gave you instructions on how to watch the movie with the correct emulator. Be sure to thank him!
Joined: 8/15/2005
Posts: 1942
Location: Mullsjö, Sweden
Yeah, I watched and commented on that (I'm Tomtelala). As soon as you bump into such door, you are pushed to the other side. But with the cheat he was using, he was pushed to the right instead.
If you are carrying a partner, the push to the left isn't as far, but it still isn't enough to be pushed once more in the same jump and certainly not going to the right.
So I doubt it is possible. But I would certainly be happy if someone found a way to do it!
Joined: 8/15/2005
Posts: 1942
Location: Mullsjö, Sweden
Haha, really nice method there! Certainly nothing I thought about.
So you have to destroy the DK barrel in order to make it, or can you just take damage? If you need the DK barrel, it won't even be possible to do considering that all (most) DK-barrels are removed with the TUFST code.
But still, nicely done! This game need more useful glitches.
So you have to destroy the DK barrel in order to make it, or can you just take damage? If you need the DK barrel, it won't even be possible to do considering that all (most) DK-barrels are removed with the TUFST code.
You can do it with normal barrel :)
It just take damage, but it seems only to work through shutter by Dixie.
Edit : There is no need barrel. It needs only to take damage.
