Player (33)
Joined: 2/16/2012
Posts: 282
Below is a copypasta of my post on SDA. The mentions of real-time stuff probably don't apply, but the addresses and behaviors can probably help to some extent. ========================================= I did some digging to come up with exactly what seeds Phantoon's actions and the various probabilities that come out of it. There are some very math-y sidenotes I have about the RNG that's used in this game (a specialized class of LCG), but the important thing to know is that it alternates odd/even, and that it has a complete cycle at each bit threshold leading up to 2^16. Another thing to note is that the RNG can be advanced multiple times per frame, so 1 frame != 1 RNG call. So Phantoon. His first round activity is seeded separately from the second round and beyond. His pattern is determined a couple frames before he starts to move. The first thing to note is that his direction (left and down vs right and up) is seeded from the game's always-running RNG (7E05E5). If the number is even (LSB = 0) then he goes down and left. If odd, he goes up and right. Simple as that. The duration before he opens his eye, however, is seeded from a frame counter at 7E05B6. This first round has 4 possibilities, but 2 of them result in the longest pattern of 4 rotations (720 frames). The other possibilities are split between the medium (360 frames or 2 rotations) and best (60 frames) pattern. The pattern changes every 2 frames. Since it works off of a frame counter, each possibility is equally likely. The countdown timer for his eye to open is stored in 7E0FE8 (2 bytes) as soon as it is determined. The movement direction is stored in 7E0FEC as simply 1 or 0. Suffice to say, his direction does not matter at all for a real run since he'll open his eye at the same time regardless of direction, although some positions may be easier to hit than others. For second round and beyond, his entire pattern becomes seeded by the game's RNG. There are instead 8 possibilities for these rounds, with 3 possibilities resulting in the worst pattern, 3 resulting in the medium pattern, and 2 causing the best. The actual numbers and outcomes are described below. This means that it is slightly more lenient than the first round, but getting the best pattern is still only 25%. Again, because of the properties of the game's RNG, each possibility is equally likely.
7E0FEC: Initial Direction
1: Towards
0: away

7E0FE8: counter until eye opens.

Round 1
Loads from 7E05B6, lsr, ands with 0x3

0: 4 loops, 02D0, 720 
1: 0 loops, 003C, 60
2: 2 loops, 0168, 360
3: 4 loops, 02D0, 720

Rounds 2+
Pulls from RNG instead, does and with 0x7

0: 4 loops, 02D0, 720 
1: 0 loops, 003C, 60
2: 2 loops, 0168, 360
3: 4 loops, 02D0, 720
4: 2 loops, 0168, 360
5: 0 loops, 003C, 60
6: 2 loops, 0168, 360
7: 4 loops, 02D0, 720
In any case, it seems highly unlikely to find a way to manipulate Phantoon in real time, and the odds are stacked against the runner. Getting perfect luck is no better than 1/16, and getting even one perfect pattern will only happen once in every 4 runs or so. There may also be a phase I'm missing yet (RNG between the rounds?) so this may not even be a complete view of the chances. In any case, good luck guys. I plan to look at Draygon in a little bit, although I don't imagine that will be as complex.
Joined: 11/16/2009
Posts: 68
Since Murder Beam has historically been a part of the any% run (granted this was back in 2004,) would this method of entering Tourian be valid in an any% looking to obsolete the current one? Or would it be relegated to the same category as X-Ray? http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=jcaYFXbVIZc#t=1790s (29:50 in the movie)
Skilled player (1430)
Joined: 7/15/2007
Posts: 1468
Location: Sweden
That's the Space/Time beam, though, not the Murder Beam, and Space/Time has always been avoided in TASes for various reasons (primarily for being a hardware glitch that behaves differently on different emulators). Also, with it you can trigger "zebes exploding" from the entrance to WS, so entering Tourian would be completely unnecessary if it was allowed (and if it worked properly on Bsnes). Even if it was allowed though I would definitely be in the same category as X-ray because it's heavily glitched, and the reason the regular any% runs weren't obsoleted is that they aren't heavily glitched.
Agare Bagare Kopparslagare
Joined: 11/16/2009
Posts: 68
I figured that was probably the case, but was looking at it from the approach of "equipping Spazer+Plasma is the glitch." That said, I did notice mention of triggering Zebes' explosion in the game resources page, but found no implementation details anywhere. Care to elaborate?
BigBoct
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Joined: 8/9/2007
Posts: 1692
Location: Tiffin/Republic, OH
I'd test it with a bsnes-core emulator (lsnes or BizHawk) and see what it does. If it works in either of those, then it's probably valid enough to be worth a submission.
Previous Name: boct1584
Joined: 11/16/2009
Posts: 68
In this case it's known to crash on console, so it probably shouldn't be submission worthy anyway. I would imagine most usages of the Space-Time beam would fail to work on console.
Joined: 11/26/2010
Posts: 444
Location: New York, US
Well here is the New 100% Video Clips, Enjoy!!! 10-Bit http://www.mediafire.com/?si3i87w71tbg145 8-Bit http://www.mediafire.com/?wfqc9eqvtei91o9 Link to video
My name is 4N6/Forensics.
Tompa
Any
Editor, Expert player (2139)
Joined: 8/15/2005
Posts: 1932
Location: Mullsjö, Sweden
So many good clips! Thanks for sharing!
Active player (432)
Joined: 4/21/2004
Posts: 3516
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
Makes the pain even bigger to wait for the whole run.. Is anyone actively working on a new 100% run? Using BizzyHawk?
Nitrogenesis wrote:
Guys I come from the DidyKnogRacist communite, and you are all wrong, tihs is the run of the mileniun and everyone who says otherwise dosnt know any bater! I found this run vary ease to masturbate too!!!! Don't fuck with me, I know this game so that mean I'm always right!StupedfackincommunityTASVideoz!!!!!!
Arc wrote:
I enjoyed this movie in which hands firmly gripping a shaft lead to balls deep in multiple holes.
natt wrote:
I don't want to get involved in this discussion, but as a point of fact C# is literally the first goddamn thing on that fucking page you linked did you even fucking read it
Cooljay wrote:
Mayor Haggar and Cody are such nice people for the community. Metro City's hospitals reached an all time new record of incoming patients due to their great efforts :P
Joined: 5/12/2009
Posts: 748
Location: Brazil
Great Video dood! Thanks for making it! I'm curious too to know if anyone is working in this.
Joined: 8/1/2004
Posts: 178
Oh those aren't from an actual run. Was going to say, the inside-quicksand section didn't use the rapidly crouching-uncrouching technique. The path to ball jump item was the craziest new thing, meanwhile.
<^>v AB X LR s
Joined: 11/26/2010
Posts: 444
Location: New York, US
Here's version 2 one clip was added . Link to video
My name is 4N6/Forensics.
Player (88)
Joined: 11/14/2005
Posts: 1057
Location: United States
Thanks for posting! It is a great resource video to have. Bizhawk is now the official snes emulator of choice for this site. I found it interesting that snes9x 1.52 was actually more accurate than bizhawk. Does anyone have an opinion on which emulator future Super Metroid runs are made on? Not that the matter may even be up for debate, considering rules have been put into place by the staff which prohibit further usage of snes9x. I don't really mind one way or the other, considering they are both exponentially better than snes9x 1.43
They're off to find the hero of the day...
creaothceann
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Joined: 4/7/2005
Posts: 1874
Location: Germany
hero of the day wrote:
I found it interesting that snes9x 1.52 was actually more accurate than bizhawk.
How so?
Player (88)
Joined: 11/14/2005
Posts: 1057
Location: United States
The console timing comparison thread in the bizhawk forum. I know the differences are minimal, but I figured it was worth mentioning on this thread. Snes9x 1.52 stays in perfect synchronization with the actual console for the 10 minute loop. I also read the official explanation on the higan forums as to why there was a timing difference between bizhawk and the console, and unfortunately it was not convincing. Again I will emphasize that the difference is so minimal that it does not matter, I was just bringing up the point that it was there :)
They're off to find the hero of the day...
Joined: 9/13/2010
Posts: 138
Location: Tallahassee, FL
Any chance of seeing the current WIP?
Player (88)
Joined: 11/14/2005
Posts: 1057
Location: United States
There isn't much progress to speak of on my end. A few weeks ago I started to make a new Vegas Stakes movie (found a massive timesaver) using the new edition of bizhawk. My intention was to get a feel for the new emulator and then move on to Super Metroid. The problem was that I ran into numerous desync issues. Before I start a new Super Metroid run, I want to make sure the newer version of bizhawk corrects this. The Vegas Stakes movie is only 2 minutes long and already suffering from desyncs, so naturally I am worried about starting an hour long Super Metroid run. At least for me, when progress is made, I will post it here. I can't speak for anyone else who may be working on a run.
They're off to find the hero of the day...
Joined: 9/13/2010
Posts: 138
Location: Tallahassee, FL
Thanks hero
creaothceann
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Editor
Joined: 4/7/2005
Posts: 1874
Location: Germany
hero of the day wrote:
The problem was that I ran into numerous desync issues.
Maybe trying it on lsnes could help determine if it's a problem with BizHawk or bsnes... just an idea.
Player (88)
Joined: 11/14/2005
Posts: 1057
Location: United States
I would assume it is a bizhawk issue, since bsnes does not normally support rerecording. Maybe it has been fixed in subsequent releases. I will check it out soon and report it to the appropriate forum if desyncs happen.
They're off to find the hero of the day...
Editor, Emulator Coder, Site Developer
Joined: 5/11/2011
Posts: 1108
Location: Murka
hero of the day wrote:
There isn't much progress to speak of on my end. A few weeks ago I started to make a new Vegas Stakes movie (found a massive timesaver) using the new edition of bizhawk. My intention was to get a feel for the new emulator and then move on to Super Metroid. The problem was that I ran into numerous desync issues. Before I start a new Super Metroid run, I want to make sure the newer version of bizhawk corrects this. The Vegas Stakes movie is only 2 minutes long and already suffering from desyncs, so naturally I am worried about starting an hour long Super Metroid run. At least for me, when progress is made, I will post it here. I can't speak for anyone else who may be working on a run.
Have you posted about this in the Bizhawk forums (possibly the bugs thread?) I can't seem to find it.... If not, please do so there.
Joined: 1/11/2007
Posts: 279
Location: Finland, Lieksa
lxx4xNx6xxl wrote:
Well here is the New 100% Video Clips, Enjoy!!!
What's happening spesifically in 3:20?
<Deign> .dice 1d1999191023443691 <BisqBot> Deign rolls a blackhole and destroys the planet.
Joined: 9/29/2005
Posts: 460
The power bomb opens the door to blue brinstar, and doing it at that point will allow quicker access to blue brinstar by the end of the game, when cleaning up blue brinstar and the crateria shaft, seeing as you wont have to wait for the power bomb to clear the door. Edit: Wrong clip, I guess Falling onto spikes from a specific height will push Samus downward when unmorphing, allowing you to run on the very first frame of unmorphing. This for some reason allows for keeping momentum even after a jump, and so, even speed booster build up counters.
Joined: 5/12/2009
Posts: 748
Location: Brazil
Decided to post some small findings here. WS Spiked Platforms Room: -------------------------------- Used the pseudo screw to cancel the invencibility time after the first damage boost in the spiked room, so Samus can damage boost again earlier. If i calculated right the smv is 36 frames faster than the strategy used in the current 100% run, though health management could be a problem since i took one more damage from the spikes than Cpadolf took in his run. smv Note: For this trick to work, Samus has to charge the beam before the first damage boost (or maybe just before the second) so she can use the pseudo screw to cancel invencibility. WS Walljump: ---------------- This is more an update of the walljump strategy found by Kriole in the spiked platforms room going for the ET. I managed to get a damage boost that makes Samus land in the right spot in the next room, so you don't need to run in the water to jump up. smv Under Charge ET Exit: ------------------------- This one is just 1 frame in-game time faster and 3 realtime frames faster. My idea at first was to use the reverse walljump trick to jump up in highspeed, but unfortunatelly i got the walljump animation too close to the wall, so Samus touches it and loose her speed. So, although i used a reverse walljump here, i could have used a normal walljump and the result would be just the same. smv Draygon's Eyed Door: ------------------------- Managed to hit Draygon's eyed door 10 frames earlier. smv Note: I only used memory watch to keep an eye on the in-game timer to see if the strategy was faster or not, so the SMVs are not optimized. Edit: Here is one that would probably save time but i couldn't make it work. Good luck. smv
Experienced player (858)
Joined: 11/26/2007
Posts: 400
Location: Sueeden
Eye Of The Beholder wrote:
Edit: Here is one that would probably save time but i couldn't make it work. Good luck. smv
Pie Probably a little easier with a better starting position or something. I don't know.