Q*Bert 3 is the next puzzle game in this long running series starring Q*Bert, Coily and the rest of the bad guys. Q*Bert's objective is to jump around the board changing the color (paint) of each of the blocks into the final color, while multiple enemies chase him.

Game objectives

  • Emulator used: SNES9x ver1.53
  • Aims for fastest time
  • Forgoes time-saving deaths
  • Manipulates enemy spawning
  • Contains speed/entertainment tradeoffs
  • Genre: Puzzle

About the game

Q*Bert 3 is a puzzle game in which Q*Bert jumps on the blocks to change their paint by the paint rule for that level. There are many different paint schemes, some more complex than others. The paint schemes are 1>2, 1>2>3, 1>2>1>2... 1>2>3>2>3..., and 1>2>3>1>2>3. These different paint schemes change the way a level is played.
Also in dealing with paint, a player has to take "polarity" into mind. Polarity is the term used for if a level is solvable as is or not. The only levels this applies to are the 1>2>3>1>2>3 paint scheme. There may become a point, where Q*Bert is standing on the last square to be painted, and can not complete the level. By jumping on an adjacent block, only changes the next block, and it will end up as the only block with Q*Bert standing on it. There are three ways to fix polarity: 1-Deathwarp, 2-Discs, 3-Sam/Slick. This run uses discs and Sam/Slick. To execute a polarity deathwarp, Q*Bert has to jump off the board from an even numbered row, most easily the second row. Discs can be used if jumped on from an odd number row, which may be harder to count during gameplay. Sam/Slick can be used in the easiest way if they jump on an odd number of blocks.
There are also different enemies and objects the can help or hinder Q*Bert. The first and simplest enemy is the Red Ball. It falls from top to bottom following a set path. Q*Bert just needs to dodge these. The main enemy in the game is Coily the snake. He starts as a purple ball that falls down to the bottom, then transforms into a snake and chases Q*Bert around the board. The only way to kill Coily is to have Q*Bert jump on a disc and Coily will follow and jump off the side of the board, which also clears all enemies (except for Frogg).
Frogg is a frog that jumps around the board following the movement of Q*Bert. He moves at half the speed Q*Bert does, so out running him is a good solution. The only way to kill Frogg is to have Q*Bert jump into him and die. After this, Frogg will reappear if Q*Bert jumps off the board.
The other major enemies in the game to deal with are Beacons, Ugg/Wrong Way, and Derby/Top Hat. The Beacon shoots small fast red balls like a cannon, these can be easily dodged. Ugg/Wrong Way travel across the board using the edges of squares as their surface. This can sometimes be difficult to tell exactly where they are. The Derby/Top Hat just jump between 4 or 2 squares, and can be timed to miss their movements.
Sam and Slick, the little green guys as everyone knows them by, can be the toughest enemies of the game sometimes.They change the paint of every block they land on, either 2>1, 3>2, or 1>2 which can help Q*Bert.
The only other items in the game that help Q*Bert are discs and freezeballs. The disc will transport Q*Bert to another part of the board and can be used to kill Coily. The freezeball does exactly what it says. It will freeze time and allow Q*Bert to continue playing, but all enemies are frozen, and Q*Bert can not be killed even if he jumps through an enemy. These two techniques are used extensively throughout the run.

Stage by Stage comments

Level 1 (Paint scheme 1>2)

This level is the easiest, and fastest to complete by not using discs. Also, backtracking the least amount of times saves jumps.

Level 2 (Paint scheme 1>2>3)

This level is pretty straightforward. Coily manipulation starts on this level. Based on how close Q*Bert is and when he jumped on the adjacent block will determine, if Coily continues on his path, or turns back to chase Q*Bert. The same manipulation is used with Frogg.

Level 3 (Paint scheme 1>2)

This level is the same as Level 1. Discs are used to minimize number of jumps.

Level 4 (Paint scheme 1>2>3)

A fairly simple level with heavy Frogg manipulation.

Level 5 (Paint scheme 1>2>1>2)

This level more Frogg manipulation, and also shows how much of a level that Sam/Slick could mess up a level if not caught.

Level 6 (Paint scheme 1>2>3>2>3)

This level is a combination of previous levels using the same techniques. This level also shows off how the jump on extra blocks while waiting for enemies to clear the path.

Level 7 (Paint scheme 1>2>1>2)

This level shows that any enemy can be jumped through using a freezeball. The Beacon has its block painted then repainted.

Level 8 (Paint scheme 1>2>3>2>3)

This level is pretty straightforward with Coily and Frogg manipulation.

Level 9 (Paint scheme 1>2>3>1>2>3)

This is the first level using the most complex paint scheme. Discs are used to change polarity and Sam/Slick are caught before they can change any paint.

Level 10 (Paint scheme 1>2)

The simple paint scheme returns, however the speed everything moves is ramped up. Also adding difficulty is the small size of the board requiring faster jumps to complete the stage and avoiding more enemies.

Level 11 (Paint scheme 1>2>3)

The speed from Level 10 is still there, but most screens are bigger, and are quicker to complete discless. Heavy Coily manipulation is used to have him follow Q*Bert around the board.

Level 12 (Paint scheme 1>2>1>2)

This level shows that the fastest way to get past the Top Hat is to wait. It has a set pattern and speed for jumping, and can be faster to wait for it to move, rather than take extra jumps and changing paint in the process.

Level 13 (Paint scheme 1>2>3>2>3)

This level is straight forward using previous techniques.

Level 14 (Paint scheme 1>2>3>1>2>3)

The complex paint scheme returns in this level. Sam/Slick polarity change is used more frequent in this level, and show it can be slower. However enemy spawn manipulation is used to ensure that the Sam/Slick spawns in the correct order. This can be done by changing when Coily is killed.

Level 15 (Paint scheme 1>2)

Another quick one paint level.

Level 16 (Paint scheme 1>2>3)

This level shows off very heavy Coily and Frogg manipulation. Their paths can be changed by the timing that Q*Bert jumps onto the adjacent block, and can be used if frame perfect to actually chase Coily around a circle.

Level 17 (Paint scheme 1>2>1>2)

This level shows more of the minimizing jumps to complete a screen.

Level 18 (Paint scheme 1>2>3>2>3)

Another level using previous techniques, and showing off how complex board layout can get.

Level 19 (Paint scheme 1>2>3>1>2>3)

This level shows how changing speed can affect Q*Bert after getting used to faster speed, this level changes speed to very slow which can throw off rhythm.

Level 20 (Paint scheme 1>2>3>1>2>3)

The final and most difficult level. All previous techniques are used to clear this level, with very heavy Coily and Frogg manipulation to maintain the run deathless.

Other comments

Coily and Frogg manipulation

As long as Q*Bert is onscreen with Coily and Frogg they will chase him. When Q*Bert jumps to an adjacent space and is more than 4 frames from jumping into the block that Coily is on before jumping to the next space, Coily will continue to jump forward and not turn around to chase Q*Bert. The same is true for Frogg. This can be abused to do frame perfect jumps to control Coily/Frogg in them continuing their path or turning around to jump into Q*Bert. This is used very heavily in the run to control their path and dodge them.

Enemy/item spawn manipulation

This is done to control which enemy spawn and to control when and where a Sam/Slick will spawn. The spawn order are in a set pattern, however it can be affected. The way enemy spawns works is this: The spawn order is a set order, and the blocks that enemies drop onto is set. So if the order is 1-Red Ball on the left, 2-Sam on the right, 3-Red Ball on the left, 4-Freezeball on the right, 5-X enemy on the left. I can affect this by killing Coily between spawn 1 and 2. Coily regenerating takes priority over all spawn order. So if 1-Red ball spawns and Coily is immediately killed. His respawn is given priority in the order but the order of the blocks remains the same. So the spawn order becomes: 1-Red Ball on the left, Coily is killed. 2-Coily spawns on the right, 3-Sam spawns on the left, and 4-Red Ball on the right, 5-Freezeball on the left. So if we made Coily jump off the board on the left, we have set ourselves up for Coily to spawn on the right, and a Sam and Freezeball to spawn on the left, making those easier to catch.

Polarity

As described, polarity affects any 1>2>3>1>2>3 paint scheme. There are a few ways to change polarity, with Sam/Slick and Disc being used in this run. Deathwarp can be used the easiest as the only #2 paint square can be set to an even number row (preferrably row 2), and jumping off the board, then when Q*Bert is reset at the board starting square, all he has to do is take one jump and paint the last square. Disc polarity only works if it is an odd number of squares away, because polarity is thought of in 2 block pairs. Bouncing back and forth between two block cycles them through the paint colors on the same phase. To change phase an odd number has to be introduced, done by even number disc warp (because you land on the odd square where the disc drops you off), or an odd number Sam/Slick as they only change one, three, five, etc odd number blocks.
This movie can be improved by using deathwarps on 1>2>3>1>2>3 screens as that is faster than waiting for the Sam/Slick, plus a death also resets the timer for enemy spawning. A few screens can probably be completed faster by waiting for Derby/Top Hat, or possibly by killing them. A death only takes approximately 3 seconds to reset Q*Bert, and also affects enemy spawns.
Thanks goes to a few players that helped with some routing: Yogidamonk and Absnerdity. They also played through this game, and i studied their videos and saw some better routing and tweaked what they had made to make an even more optimal path. Thanks also to the help I received in the forums, and all the new people i have interested in this game.
Screenshot at frame 174794 shows how Frogg and Coily are looking the way I just jumped from and they follow my path as i am behind them chasing them, instead of those two chasing Q*Bert for a change.

Nach: Judging.
Nach: Replaced movie file, as discussed in thread.

Nach: Unfortunately this movie has not seen much scrutiny from the viewers. My feeling is that some level strategies can be improved further, but nothing jumps out at me at being highly noticeable that should prevent publication. Lukewarm audience response (if any), accepting to vault.

feos: Processing...

TASVideoAgent
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This topic is for the purpose of discussing #4548: JoshButro's SNES Q*bert 3 in 1:02:59.19
Spikestuff
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v2temp coming out... Link to video Edit: I should've looked at your TAS while it was in progress. Okay there's going to be a lot of areas which need improvement a total of 22 infact. 1) "1 Player Start" Optimal: 851 You: 855 2) "Level 1" Optimal: 963 (112 later) You: 970 (115 later) 3 - 21) "Level X" Yea, I'm not going through that in detail. 22) Ending Input. Optimal: Pre-227150 You: 228180 Note: I'm going through it properly trying to get it as low as I can get it without getting screwed by the possible chance of RNG. Edit 2: Right, Found the RNG. RNG Happens at Level 10 (37th Stage) So this minor fix in between the level parts well, I guess I cannot do them now due to 10. Edit 3: I'm not providing a Spiked version. That was a lie.
WebNations/Sabih wrote:
+fsvgm777 never censoring anything.
Disables Comments and Ratings for the YouTube account. These colours are pretty neato, and also these.
JoshButro
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I really appreciate you taking a look at my TAS. I didnt know how to encode, so I thank you for that. The inbetween level parts, I'm trying to see how to further optimize those. I pressed start on every frame before the animation, and it would shows a few frames of animation then get bright as start was accepted, then fade out. I can also submit a movie that ends on the last jump. I wasn't sure when to end the movie, but the last input is jumping onto the last block in 20-4, so if i need to resubmit with that, I can, i believe, that would show up as ~15 seconds shorter. It shouldnt affect the temp encode, so if the process can be to submit that movie ending at 227150 (instead of 228180), let me know the best way to do that. I really appreciate your help Spike, RNG is fun in this game.
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How do you know so fast all levels are suboptiomal? Is there a optimal path (i.e. shortest path, optimal solution, etc.) he didn't follow, or just opimisation mistakes?
JoshButro
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He was referring to the level cutscenes, and not have optimal input to skip it. My input is about 3 frames slower than optimal, so on 21 cutscenes, i lost 63 frames (1.05 seconds) over the whole run. Is 65 frames over an hour long run huge in TASing, so just something that can be improved upon in a following TAS?
current TAS: Q*Bert 3 any% v2TAS<br> next TAS: Q*Bert 3 X*Bert levels
Spikestuff
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That math is incorrect. From Level 7 onwards (note: stopped at 10 so I didn't fully check this.) you actually held down the start button and were lucky enough to skip the level info at the right frame while holding it down for much earlier.
WebNations/Sabih wrote:
+fsvgm777 never censoring anything.
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JoshButro
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6 Levels and the game start, means i lost about 21 frames for cutscenes. That doesn't sound too bad.
current TAS: Q*Bert 3 any% v2TAS<br> next TAS: Q*Bert 3 X*Bert levels
Spikestuff
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Josh's Input (in other words ignoring "player 1 start"): Left Level 1 Skipping, Right Level 7 Skipping Level 1 Presses start late when it should be frame 967 Level 7 Presses start waaaaay before it should've been pressed (63578) Don't assume that holding it down gives you justice from 7 onwards just in-case you missed somewhere down the line.
WebNations/Sabih wrote:
+fsvgm777 never censoring anything.
Disables Comments and Ratings for the YouTube account. These colours are pretty neato, and also these.
JoshButro
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Ok, i see about the cutscene skips. I don't know how to fix it at this point, without having to redo the entire TAS. I guess for now I'll have to take the cutscene skips as suboptimal. I looked at the end of the movie and stopped it after the last input on frame 227145, which will make the movie 1:03:05.75, so should I resubmit or how should that be handled, because it shows the movie as 11seconds longer than it should be.
current TAS: Q*Bert 3 any% v2TAS<br> next TAS: Q*Bert 3 X*Bert levels
adelikat
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Just post a fixed movie file, and a judge or admin can replace the submission file for you. P.S. do we have anything other than meaningless non-gameplay events to talk about?
It's hard to look this good. My TAS projects
Spikestuff
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adelikat wrote:
Just post a fixed movie file, and a judge or admin can replace the submission file for you.
Like So: User movie #20153994006633100
WebNations/Sabih wrote:
+fsvgm777 never censoring anything.
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JoshButro wrote:
Ok, i see about the cutscene skips. I don't know how to fix it at this point, without having to redo the entire TAS. I guess for now I'll have to take the cutscene skips as suboptimal.
Hi Josh; congratulations on your first completed run! It may be worth you looking at TAS Movie Editor; it may help you to splice together and alter some of your input. Unfortunately I'm not really qualified to help with usage, but I'm sure some people on the forums would be very happy to assist you. I intend to watch this run later today, so will not vote yet. Good luck!
<adelikat> I am annoyed at my irc statements ending up in forums & sigs
JoshButro
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Thanks, first completed TAS, so it was a learning experience, and i can carry Lessons Learned forward to future TASes. I will have to look at TAS Video Editor, the only thing i see at the moment, is the long downtime between levels, and trying to maintain that per how the game is played. I don't want to remove any blank screens to make the game shorter when an RTA play through has you wait several seconds between cutscenes and levels, and just one board to the next. I plan on doing future TASes on Bizhawk 1.9.1, so that should take care of that issue. I see the encode is uploading, so im excited too, even though i've seen the movie more times than i can count.
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For anyone voting NO, any feedback is appreciated so I know whether to look at this TAS again, so if there is not enough interest or anything gameplay related can be improved. Thanks
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ars4326
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I've been following up on the WIPs Josh was posting in the forum, and believe this is a worthy run for publication. After reading the submission comments, I was surprised at the amount of technical challenges this game provided in the later levels; in dealing with polarity management, enemy RNG manipulation, and adjusting to Q-bert's increasing speed. Impressive work! Also Josh, have you checked out the "X-pert" mode that unlocks once you finish all of the levels?
JoshButro wrote:
...even though i've seen the movie more times than i can count.
Welcome to TASing ;)
"But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him." - 1 Corinthians 2:9
JoshButro
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ars4326 wrote:
Also Josh, have you checked out the "X-pert" mode that unlocks once you finish all of the levels?
I have. Those levels can be insanely difficult as a normal playthrough. You get 5 lives to start to get through 20 screens with NO level checkpoints, more enemies that spawn faster, and the paint is ALL 1>2>3>1>2>3. I have a difficult time beating that mode. That was going to be the next TAS based on the reception of this one. I would just need to lay out details like, its takes an options screen code to start from there. I think a TAS of X*Bert would be interesting. Thanks for your feedback ars.
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Spikestuff
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18 frames saved from my previous usermovie (which I removed): User movie #20219996651200830 This one fixes the places where you can hit start earlier, except for the start, 5 and 14 as they desync in input somewhere else down the line.
WebNations/Sabih wrote:
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Disables Comments and Ratings for the YouTube account. These colours are pretty neato, and also these.
JoshButro
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Thanks, 18 frames is 18 frames. I would hold off on anything until the voting is finished. I can probably tell you where the input desyncs on level 5 or later and level 14 and later. There are some very specific frame inputs for jumps to manipulate enemies and most of them are frame perfect. Consecutive frame perfects jumps. That's where I imagine the desync happens.
current TAS: Q*Bert 3 any% v2TAS<br> next TAS: Q*Bert 3 X*Bert levels
JoshButro
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I don't know if it needs to be said, but i thought there would be more interest just based on the feedback I received in the SNES forums while putting this run together. If the run is too long, it's because no game breaking/sequence breaking glitches have been discovered, so this run is all levels. If it's because it is Q*Bert, it is a game most won't even attempt because of the high difficulty level, but i hoped this TAS would attract people to the series. I'm not sure what happens now, since the vote count is lower than all o the other movies posted on similar dates, and the viewing rate for this movie has essentially gone to zero. I had played on TASing the X*Bert levels after this to really show off the game, but i may just for my use, it really depends on how this TAS goes, and it didn't get the reaction i thought it would. I guess i just needed to vent, since i put alot of my time into this TAS to have it go unnoticed. Vent over.
current TAS: Q*Bert 3 any% v2TAS<br> next TAS: Q*Bert 3 X*Bert levels
ars4326
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JoshButro wrote:
I don't know if it needs to be said, but i thought there would be more interest just based on the feedback I received in the SNES forums while putting this run together. If the run is too long, it's because no game breaking/sequence breaking glitches have been discovered, so this run is all levels. If it's because it is Q*Bert, it is a game most won't even attempt because of the high difficulty level, but i hoped this TAS would attract people to the series. I'm not sure what happens now, since the vote count is lower than all o the other movies posted on similar dates, and the viewing rate for this movie has essentially gone to zero. I had played on TASing the X*Bert levels after this to really show off the game, but i may just for my use, it really depends on how this TAS goes, and it didn't get the reaction i thought it would. I guess i just needed to vent, since i put alot of my time into this TAS to have it go unnoticed. Vent over.
Hey Josh, I can relate to your frustration. That's sometimes just how it goes in the Workbench; especially at the moment, with such an unusually high backlog of runs. Back last spring, I did a run for the Sega Genesis that only had two people initially comment. I put a solid month and a half into it, but it was probably so obscure of a game that it just didn't generate a lot of attention. To illustrate further, Aqfaq's current submission didn't have any feedback, as of yesterday. But since she was one of the only two in question who gave feedback for my Traysia run, I especially wanted to return the favor and give it some attention. I believe it's nice for everyone to get a little "time in the sun" once they get a quality project submitted. Anyways, I hope it doesn't discourage you too much. While certain games don't have the name value of a Mario or a Sonic, it's still worth it, IMO, to take the time to do one that you find interesting.
"But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him." - 1 Corinthians 2:9
Samsara
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Only the really popular runners or overhyped games get a lot of feedback. For the most part, you're just going to have to make do with a couple comments from the people who watch every run and the judge weighing in whenever they have the time. It's better than nothing.
ars4326 wrote:
Aqfaq's current submission didn't have any feedback, as of yesterday. But since she
He. Please don't buy into that offensive routine.
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Anybody have any comments or criticism on the gameplay in this run? Do you notice any flaws? Have ideas how to do something faster?
Warning: Opinions expressed by Nach or others in this post do not necessarily reflect the views, opinions, or position of Nach himself on the matter(s) being discussed therein.
JoshButro
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As far as I've seen no one had anything negative to say, and Spike could only save a few frames on Non-gameplay areas. So I haven't seen anyone say that gameplay could be faster.
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* Forgoes time-saving deaths * Contains speed/entertainment tradeoffs
accepting to vault
So are these "time wasting for entertainment in an already boring run" techniques allowed for Vault or not?
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Post subject: Movie published
TASVideoAgent
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This movie has been published. The posts before this message apply to the submission, and posts after this message apply to the published movie. ---- [2782] SNES Q*bert 3 by JoshButro in 1:02:59.19