Post subject: Chelsea and the 7Devils: Bunny Must Die
Joined: 5/22/2009
Posts: 26
Having completed a 100% clear and an NGDJ run in realtime, and failing horribly at making one lowp+speedboots speedrun, I'm interested in TASing this game. (warning - some moderate spoilers below are untagged) However, I wonder what modes of this game would be good choices for TASing, though. I'm most certain that any% and 100% are good choices, but what about low%? There's an achievement for completing the game with under 15% items. Since each item in the game weights 2%, you can take 7 items. (Or, due to a bug, if you complete the game without ever saving, the game considers you finished with 0% items...). Now, you're only required to take 6 items - 3 Keys, 2 Time powerups (for the 1sec time door in Fool's Trash Dump), and your choice between the 4th key or the wallkick boots (to access the final boss) -- note the lack of the gears (the item that lets you turn around left/right). A lowest% would only take these 6 items, and I REALLY doubt any of these are skippable, since if by any means you clip through a wall, the game simply kills you. But if we define low% as sub 15%, then we can take one extra item - namely the dashboots, which would possibly make the run much more enjoying, specially since we're skipping the gears, which means we can only move fast backwards to where Bunny the Honeywhite is facing... since we can't backdash forward. (This would also be the first "low%-entertainment tradeoff" lol). The other thing is about the NGDJ challenge. This was a run published by DrGodPants on Youtube, where you skip the key movement items (Gears, Dashboots and Walljump booots), but collect all the other items you can reach. This includes exactly enough time powerups to get the "Alternative" time power, and we'll probably need a verified save with it. Although the 100% run could provide it, this could be quicker. It includes some points of interest, for example the fact that it skips the walljump boots (as opposed to the lowest% which gets it) means we get to see the Septentorium fully navigated in a low% scenario. We also get to see that knightmare of a room in the Evil King's Lair in its full difficulty (with the dashboots you can just jump across the islands normally, with the walljump boots you can just guard-block the spikes and climb the last wall. Without neither your only way of crossing the chasms is by manipulating the enemies' homing shots as stepping stones - in my NGDJ realtime run this is where 3/4 of my "reload" counts were spent). The problem of this is that it's an user-made goal, and would require an exception to the rule that prohibits them. So, what are your thoughts on all these routes?
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Note that someone has made a test TAS of an any% route which you can see here: (parts 1 2 3). I thought the third part was especially good. Any%, 100%, and low% all sound interesting to me, in roughly that order. For low% I think 4 keys + 2 time powerups (which means no dash boots and no wallkick, if I read correctly) feels like the "lowest"% run you could do, which I would go with simply to make it as different as possible from the any%.
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I was surprised that anybody here besides myself (and nitsuja) has heard of Bunny must die. Except that now I remember telling people here about it while I was working on the translation patch. Possibly worth noting, the english translation patch has significantly more boxes of text than the original Japanese version, because english sentences don't fit nearly as well in such limited spaces. I like the idea of the no-mobility-items run more than a true low%, so long as it has low% as a secondary goal. Any% and 100% runs for both characters, of course would also be absolutely worth watching.
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Joined: 5/22/2009
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Whoa, that was fast =P. Apparently he did the exact 3 keys / 2 time / wallkicks / speedboots route. However, I think that getting the stomp boots pays off in the long run, there are numerous times where he does two guardblocks to get the height, where a single stomp would be enough, also the added damage helps to take out bosses faster when you use the spike shooter. I'm sure that the lightsword deals more dps than the spike shooter, but I'm unsure about how the lightsword compares to spike shooter + stomp. You're also forced to visit the room before the room with the stomps to set a flag anyway (destroys the door that requires the 2 time powerups - you need it to leave the forest with the purple key). Also, Bunny runs so fast that damage boosts don't seem to be worth even the time to collect a single health pickup =P. And if 2 time powerups is enough to skip Lord Pumpquiche (I was very surprised by this o_O) in this case we may not need a lowest% run. Sure, a run without the wallkick boots would be very different, but also much slower. I had the impression that he could've used the walldash more often to get the speed, though..
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Someone watching Summer Games Done Quick 2013 asked if there were any Bunny Must Die! speedrunners. I thought this would be a good opportunity to bump this topic and remind people that this would be a great game to speedrun/TAS/see TASes of indeed! ^^ (Maybe the nico TAS needs to be mirrored on youtube?)
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Joined: 9/12/2012
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I'll mention this so people know. On the fight with the last pumpkin boss, you can bypass the invulnerability just before it goes into pissed off mode by stopping time and dash kicking it to death. For some reason, dash kicks while time is stopped bypass invulnerability. I would also recommend dash kicking the tank boss and the cat, especially the cat. Dash kicks are a lot more powerful than people think. On Chelsea's final phase, it's possible to get in some early damage by dash kicking her before she "stops time" at the start of that phase. I've also seen a video somewhere where someone stomps on Chelsea's first form under a platform and she basically moves on to phase 2 right away. The official English translated version, which I believe can only be acquired on Desura at the moment, has a few changes from the original. Most are irrelevant, slight graphical changes and such. But there are a some bosses with altered health and patterns. The "first" boss who guards the dash boots, her pattern is slightly different. The Count has increased health. The 2nd Pumpkin boss (the one with the falling pumpkins) has the extra pumpkins appear on his level and take an arc around the room and explode if they hit the ground. And finally, I believe Chelsea's final form has reduced health. They also disabled reversing time in the pumpkin fights. They might have done that for all bosses. Also, in the official English version, Chelsea's ladder actually costs mana to use. This nerfs her abilities greatly. Though she does regen mana, very very slowly. Otherwise, Chelsea's game seems to be the same. I'm basically saying, use the original for a TAS. Even those minor changes make things slightly slower. edit: I redownloaded the game from Desura. I am now able to reverse time against the pumpkin bosses. So either they changed it back at some point, or the game downloaded incorrectly for me.
Joined: 11/9/2012
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I've been looking at this game and I have a question. Has there been any work with a 100% TAS route for Bunny? I was thinking about possibly doing some work on that run but being a massive noob, I am a bit wary. There is a very nice item guide here though. http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=181523692
Patashu
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So, this game just got OoT style wrong warps ^^ (Literally OoT style, each different message box gives a different wrong warp, so there's a crazy interconnectedness of what rooms can bring you where) Reposting stuff from the SDA topic: https://forum.speeddemosarchive.com/post/bunny_must_die_chelsea_and_the_7_devils_30.html#bunny_must_die_chelsea_and_the_7_devils_30
https://www.mediafire.com/view/zbrgv7mr87oi9nq/Bunny_Must_Die_WW.xlsx The glitch that was found was where you select "return to title" a frame before a text box appears. The text boxes can be anything from boss encounters, item acquisitions, signs you read or even the text that appears when you first get a weapon (very relevant). If you do that, you don't end up returning to the title, but you change the value of the starting position of that room to something else. If you then die and use a bunny doll you will wrong warp to another location in the game. Each different text box wrong warps you to a different location. Some warps will put you into a wall and subsequently give you a game over, some will put you in a good position, and some will put you in a good position depending on the tile you initiated the glitch (being an extra tile up, to the left etc. will let you not die in the room you warp to). The excel sheet posted above shows all of the current known wrong warps. It's fairly exhaustive from what I can tell. The most useful wrong warp is funnily enough the sword acquisition text box. The most relevant position to do it in is the first sword you get in a glitchless run, but you have to get it before the sword falls or you'll get stuck after the warp. This warp puts you into the right side of the room of the back door to the final area. As long as you have the cutscenes triggered (first the purple area then the first boss area) you can fight Chelsea (who is the final boss for those of you who haven't played the game).
Link to video
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Patashu
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Here are all the fastest speedrun times I know of currently: Bunny Must Die (J) 100% RTA by Saver Link to video Bunny Must Die (J) any% RTA by Saver Link to video Bunny Must Die (J) any% No Wrong Warp RTA by Saver Link to video Chelsea and the Seven Devils (J) any% (with pre-made save file) RTA by Saver Link to video FYI - This game is proven to be fully TASable in Hourglass! So the gameplay/glitches look interesting in these speedruns, consider looking into TASing this great game! :)
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Nitsuja linked a "test TAS" in the second post of this thread. It's presumably not up to date with the latest techniques, but it's still a fun watch.
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Patashu
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Derakon wrote:
Nitsuja linked a "test TAS" in the second post of this thread. It's presumably not up to date with the latest techniques, but it's still a fun watch.
Yes - combine that with the latest route/tricks for something awesome. BTW, I had the thought that the Chelsea run with pre-made Bunny save file could be done after a Bunny any% TAS (because you could make the save file as Bunny) - for a back to back both characters any%.
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Patashu
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The TAS is made by FrozenMelody/crystalsaver/Saver! Link to video Although he hasn't submitted it yet and I'm not sure why (I waited one week).
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what an awesome TAS.
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Patashu
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Hmm, I wonder if the TAS will ever get submitted (6 months later)...
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Patashu
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Link to video More TAS? I'll take it!
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