This topic is for the purpose of discussing #650: Saturn's SNES F-Zero "first track" in 02:22.03

Dunno what to really think about that movie. I know it was a huge work, but it isn't that impressive when you watch it :) Anyway, I vote yes, because of the work made, and the beaten WR !

The real shock value comes from comparing the video to your own records and saying, "Holy shit, it beats me by 10 whole seconds?" But some of the harder tracks would probably be really impressive to watch.

I think the rival car behind you beat the world record too... even though the top speed of that car means it wouldn't have been able to have been that close. Stupid f-zero AI.

Whoa! Surprising driving lines you took there, especially the last turn where you drove over the sand area without a boost? Is it really that much faster? Never would've thought of it myself! I guess the speed meter is just for show and the actual speed doesn't drop that much, or at all? And also the shocking doesn't slow you down? I thought about it too, but i was staring at the speed meter again :| Excellent job here! Sure people who haven't played the game (or tried to timeattack it ;)) might not be so "excited" about it as it might look dull and easy (probably because of the empty track in practice mode), but it's still a very fast paced game which requires a lot of skill. Yes definetly from me :)

This is for me an obvious YES vote. :) Very nicley done and I know how much work you've put down in this video.

Just amazing, but when will the full run be published, if someone is working on it yet? Love the music in the Big Blue level :>

Whoa! Surprising driving lines you took there, especially the last turn where you drove over the sand area without a boost? Is it really that much faster? Never would've thought of it myself! I guess the speed meter is just for show and the actual speed doesn't drop that much, or at all? And also the shocking doesn't slow you down? I thought about it too, but i was staring at the speed meter again :|

The last corner is about 0,01-0,02 sec faster than a perfect normal turn and only if you can drive exactly between the rail and the sand (there is a small free area which doesn't slows you down) but the speed that you have to gain costs some time for the next lap which can be cuted by the last corner again. Also the shocking rails take about 5 km/h speed per circle but in some points it was still worth to touch them since I could get a much better line then, even by speed-lose. And no, the speed meter is not only for show. I did different lap times mainly because of the different speed I had after the last corner (read the comments of the movie). It's just because a perfect line is mostly more worth than the little speed lose especially during the boost, that's why I cuted the rails sometimes. I tested different lines with and without touching the rails and in most cases (not all) touching was the better choice.

Meh vote. It's well-done, but it's just not that entertaining to watch. The path is mostly straight lines, and there's really nothing to break the "monotony." Also, I really don't think it was worth the amount of work it must've taken to beat the world record by half a second. But that's just me.

I can appreciate how much work went into this. I used to spend hours in front of my SNES perfecting my runs of Mute City I, using exactly that technique against the Golden Fox, and getting unbelievable times in Death Wind. My friends and I tried to set unbreakable records in this game. It's impressive as a Practice, but as a movie...

Just amazing, but when will the full run be published, if someone is working on it yet? Love the music in the Big Blue level :>

This is the reason I'm voting No. Obviously I always prefer a complete run of a game, but I'll vote Yes to a single lap/race if it's impressive enough (like the old Excitebike movie), hoping that the author, or someone, will use it to create a full run someday (like the new Excitebike movie). This movie isn't the first step in an eventual full run because it's not the first race of a Knight League run, it's a Practice run. Not only is it not the first step in creating a full run, but it's a pretty boring race because there are no other cars. If it were just Mute City I from Knight League at Expert (can't do Master without a save state), then I would vote Yes. As a full run, or race 1 of a partial run, it's a Yes. As a practice, it's a No. The "dummy" cars in an actual race appear at predictable locations and intervals, and are generally in the exact center of the lane, so they probably wouldn't hinder you too much if you did this exact race in Knight League. The presence of the cars would make the race so much more interesting, and it could later be used to complete the other races. Any chance you would give that a try?

hopper: Maybe I will do a Grand Prix in some years, but now I have other projects to complete (Secret of Evermore). There are 2 reasons why I used the pratise mode: Main reason because I get a much better start of the golden fox instead of the other machines (can't reach a double bump on the golden fox in Grand Prix mode in any case) so I lose many acceleration here. 2nd because the other machines would embarrass the perfect driving line of me so to pass them would cost me some milliseconds later. In any case, I can't reach the time of 1'58"41 in grand prix mode but as I said before: my goal was to make a new World Record because I was fascinated to see this time, so I had to choose practise. And for continueing the record breaking (which is only possible in practise mode) people can use this movie further since grand prix is impossible for new records.

I thought it was entertaining, because of the amount of perfection in the run. I never knew turns could be made like that. I voted yes because there has yet to be a time attack of any of the popular mode-7 effect racers on the snes, mainly f-zero or mario kart, because of the level of difficulty to make these types of movies. Not to mention any world record run of these games. My only gripe is, with this movie, a more entertaining stage with turns and crazy shortcut jumps would be more suited for time attack. This is one aspect the Top Gear movie uses, a hard track. I also agree, a grand prix may not be a world record, but it would be a world record for the grand prix, and more exciting. Another concern would be that multiple world record movies could just pile up, and if bunched into one movie it would be a movie with many authors. That would be kinda confusing I guess.

wtf, I attempted timeattack on this game :]

I voted Meh as there is just Skill in this movie, but no real entertainment. It _is_ impressive, but Timeattacks also need to be entertaining in my eyes. Hope to see an update of your SoE run soon. cu Fabian

It's awesome and I'm glad you made it, but I have to go with the others who say it's not all that interesting. When I watch these movies, I want to see crazy shortcuts, mind-bending bug abuse, and frame-perfect gameplay. Your movie does the third one as well as possible, but seeing as how it lacks the first two it doesn't really inspire me. Part of my vote may be because I was never really into the game. I played it as a kid, but I never tried for fastest times or anything.

I don't know...the speed boosts last much longer if you don't sacrifice then going over sand. You did wonderful on the first lap, I loved it! but then it started to get sloppy...i think it could have been faster if you avoided bumping into walls at all, and avoided sand area to increase the distance you get on speed boosts. isn't there more then one level? I vote no...i just don't think it's very entertaining as it is right now.

i think it could have been faster if you avoided bumping into walls at all, and avoided sand area to increase the distance you get on speed boosts

Wrong. Believe me I haven't done 13000 rerecords without reason. Bumping into walls costs only a little speed which you regain very fast again, but the shortcut you take will save you more time. I tested really every possible combination doing a savestate on a specific frame, then trying to do another corner move and doing another savestate in the same frame and compare this 2 states to see exactly on which corner move the car is more ahead at this savestate. Taking the shortcut through sand with boost is definitely the best choice, I tried every possible variation. You don't lose any speed during the boost on sand and win much more time than the little shorter boost-duration I get there. After all it's a World Record time so I couldn't just do such mistakes you point out. I agree this movie is not really entertaining because I just did 1 course. But it could be if we could do WR times on other courses. Maybe someone will continue this one on Big Blue someday... I don't know

In my opinion, it doesn't make a very interesting movie. The plain number (race time) might be interesting for F-Zero experts, but the movie is boring to watch. Nothing unexpected happens. Compare to Excitebike. It has the same goal ― complete the race as fast as possible ― but it is interesting to watch and does unexpected maneuvers. My vote for this movie is "no".

I'm going to have to agree with bisqwit. I thought that since it was so short it wouldn't be that boring , but I was wrong. The problem is that it is just one long repeitive race and then it is over, nothing interesting happened.

Unexpected? Rewatch lap 1 again people. I found out his trick maneuvering around the tiny gap between the sand and the wall that doesn't sacrifice speed unexpected.

Unexpected? Rewatch lap 1 again people. I found out his trick maneuvering around the tiny gap between the sand and the wall that doesn't sacrifice speed unexpected.

How many people do you think will notice it?

Unexpected? Rewatch lap 1 again people. I found out his trick maneuvering around the tiny gap between the sand and the wall that doesn't sacrifice speed unexpected.

How many people do you think will notice it?

I don't think it makes any difference as opposed to going through the sand, expcet on the first lap. If he is using the Nitro boost (2nd lap and so on) he can go through the sand without losing speed (apparently?). The thing is there is nothing new compared to the speedrun.

It's not unexpected; it works on FZ: MV too (first FZ game for me), and I tested and found out it worked on the original too, so I already know about it. Bleh. Would vote no based on it only being one race, but not voting because I have not watched it yet (and will not)... sorry.

I've attempted some F-Zero TAS myself, and I have to say, this video is amazing. It is very difficult to get a lap below 23.23 even with hundreds of rerecords. A few pixels deviation from the correct racing line can cost a frame, and one frame is .01 or .02 seconds. However, I think the flaw with this video is that it plays in practice mode, rather than the grand prix. This video only shows what a theoretical best time is on MC1. Already, the Mr.Fixit F-Zero site has a video of this up to show its players what is possible. So I think publishing it here would be redundant. I think a grand prix TAS would be worthwhile. At least there are other cars, and there are multiple races. The 1st lap time can't be quite as high, but most of the other laps will be equal to the practice mode times. This game has a few potential places for interesting surprises. Using other cars to bump you, or even landmines, can change your direction, which could potentially be helpful in the right places. More difficult races, like Silence in the Knight League and many King League races, would involve a lot of bouncing off walls. These things could be optimized in a TAS much better than on a console. So I'd love to see a grand prix video, but I understand that would be a tremendous undertaking...