Editor, Experienced Forum User, Judge, Published Author, Expert player
(2254)
Joined: 8/21/2016
Posts: 1102
Location: US
nymx wrote:
Greetings Walgrey. As you have stated, this run is in fact slower than the WR....which can be found here: https://youtu.be/k4VwTVoWFlc.
Since this run is so short, I'm extending the opportunity for you to further experiment and see if a faster result can be found. Because the WR times it from the start of the race...we may be looking at a rare situation here that needs to be handled differently. But first...please see if you can find a situation that can be accept without community disagreements.
I'm placing this submission on Delayed, pending your response and/or further optimization.
Who knows how many resets are necessary (and when they are necessary) to get to that particular maze layout. In my opinion, this is a situation where we shouldn't hold a TASer to beat a human WR when they have different timing procedures. If the human run was timed from power-on instead of race start and had to include however many resets/time delay was necessary to produce that maze, it would likely be slower than this submission.
Editor, Experienced Forum User, Judge, Published Author, Expert player
(2254)
Joined: 8/21/2016
Posts: 1102
Location: US
KusogeMan wrote:
i know it's mostly player choice:
naruto clash of ninja a fighting game for GC has 3 difficulties and a 4th unlockable difficulty, should a story mode TAS be done on diffiulty 3? i really wanna do it on 4th the real hardest because enemies counter attack more and showcases more of the game interactions not just the best combo or strat, but more adaptation!
The 4th difficulty is probably fine. Depending on how it’s unlocked would likely determine how it’s published/categorized.
In my opinion:
If it’s unlocked with a code, it’s its own valid power-on based branch separate from the other difficulty branches.
If it’s unlocked via a prior playthrough, it’d be an SRAM start based run and should still be valid.
Editor, Experienced Forum User, Judge, Published Author, Expert player
(2254)
Joined: 8/21/2016
Posts: 1102
Location: US
Mikewillplays wrote:
WarioWare Gold. The final input of the final boss is a blowing input, which isn't currently supported, rendering the completion of the game's campaign mode impossible
Are you using BizHawk? If so, it supports mic-volume as one of the inputs. Wouldn't blowing into the DS be activating the microphone? Or is there some other sensor blowing impacted?
Editor, Experienced Forum User, Judge, Published Author, Expert player
(2254)
Joined: 8/21/2016
Posts: 1102
Location: US
dekutony wrote:
From what I was able to understand, Mario stops on a dime. I never really gave acceleration much of a consideration. When you stop holding left or right, Mario stops moving horizontally seemingly instantaneously. Every time I hugged a wall, Mario stopped moving seemingly instantly. When I stopped hugging the wall, Mario continued moving forward at seemingly the same speed he normally goes forward every time. To me, personally, I didn't notice a difference in movement speed. I don't even think this game has an in depth movement system like in the official games (although I could be very wrong about that).
This makes it sound like acceleration is not a factor for this game, so wall hugging shouldn be fine.
Editor, Experienced Forum User, Judge, Published Author, Expert player
(2254)
Joined: 8/21/2016
Posts: 1102
Location: US
JD wrote:
As of now, there are 60 submissions marked as Playground. None of them have been given their own dedicated "Playground" page on the site, and there hasn't been a new entry in this list since September 21, 8 days before the submission acceptance threshold was loosened as per Post #532024. I would suggest going through all the Playground submissions and changing them to either accepted or rejected, but what do you guys think?
This thread is not for playground runs as they aren't runs that have been rejected. How the site deals with those runs is not pertinent to this thread.
Also, I'd ask that people not use this thread to suggest for us to go through generalized groups of runs (gruefood delight, playground, etc). The focus with this thread is more to review specific runs people believe need rejudged as the reasons for their rejection may no longer be valid due to rule changes. If anyone is suggesting a run here, please link the specific submission(s) you feel needs revisited and list the reasons why you think that particular run needs rejudged.
It's not that we don't care about the large general groups, we can plan to go through those once we've made it through the specific runs requested in this thread first; but we don't need recommendations to look through these kind of general groups.
Editor, Experienced Forum User, Judge, Published Author, Expert player
(2254)
Joined: 8/21/2016
Posts: 1102
Location: US
dekutony wrote:
In this game (as well as the prequel) Mario has a fixed altitude when he jumps. More importantly, it doesn't matter how long I press the jump key, it could be 1 frame or a whole 60 frames, my altitude will always be the same every time.
Say for instance I jump from one platform to the other and they're close to each other. I have to wait to land onto the next platform despite the rather short distance. After this platform, there's a higher floor I have to jump on again and the same rules apply.
I hug the walls from time to time because I have no other choice but to wait to land on the ground.
I hope this answers your question.
Unfortunately it doesn't. Even with fixed altitude jumps, it appears you can control horizontal movement during the duration of a jump. What I don't know and can't easily see from the encodes is how horizontal acceleration works in the game. If there is acceleration and not instantaneous increase to max horizontal speed, then hugging the wall may delay such acceleration.
For a theoretical example:
If Mario instantly increases to max horizontal speed once he is allowed to move horizontally after clearing a ledge vertically, then how far he moves in X frames will always be equal so long as his horizontal position is right at the corner of the wall when he clears the ledge vertically. With this style of movement, hugging the wall is not a problem.
However, if acceleration is a component of movement and Mario is only allowed to begin accelerating horizontally after clearing the ledge vertically, then hugging the wall means that the horizontal acceleration can't start until after he clears the ledge. Thus, jumping right against the wall will have a slower initial horizontal speed upon clearing the ledge vertically which will take time to build to max speed. This will limit how far he can travel horizontally in a given number of frames. By jumping from farther away from the wall, the acceleration can be exploited to have Mario's horizontal speed be already maxed out at the moment he clears the ledge vertically; this should yield a farther horizontal travel in the same number of frames than a jump that hugged the wall could, due to Mario's horizontal speed already being maxed out when he clears the ledge vertically.
Editor, Experienced Forum User, Judge, Published Author, Expert player
(2254)
Joined: 8/21/2016
Posts: 1102
Location: US
Regarding optimization. I noticed a few places through the run, where Mario jumps to a new platform while right against a wall or ledge before progressing over the corner onto a new platform; for example around 12 seconds into the embeded encode. I know that in many games this method of jumping to a new platform can actually be slower than the common TAS strategy of jumping further away from the wall due to the advantage of horizontal acceleration.
As I'm not set up to use linux/libTAS, I am unable to test this particular game. Was there any testing done to confirm that the method used isn't slower than jumping further away from the wall?
Editor, Experienced Forum User, Judge, Published Author, Expert player
(2254)
Joined: 8/21/2016
Posts: 1102
Location: US
Good to see you diving into this game. After doing the judgement for the original submission, I was hoping someone would pick it up eventually. I knew there would be further room for improvement, and it sounds like you're definitely finiding it!
Editor, Experienced Forum User, Judge, Published Author, Expert player
(2254)
Joined: 8/21/2016
Posts: 1102
Location: US
Thornstrom wrote:
I'm new to attempting to play C64 games in Bizhawk, and got stuck immediately. I tried to load a .T64 game, and arrived at the READY-prompt. When a game doesn't load automatically, I read that I should type either "RUN" or "LOAD" or something like that. But how do I type? Keys are assigned to different hotkeys, and there's no input when typing anyway. Should I change input settings first somehow, or how do I use the keyboard in Bizhawk?
Firstly, BizHawk doesn't support .t64 files.
This guide should get you started with TASing/playing C64 games in BizHawk.
https://tasvideos.org/Bizhawk/C64
You can use the virtual pad to visualize/use the C64 keyboard. Its in the menu under Tools>Virtual Pad.
You can define keymapping in the menu also Config>Controllers, then in the "console" tab.
Editor, Experienced Forum User, Judge, Published Author, Expert player
(2254)
Joined: 8/21/2016
Posts: 1102
Location: US
DJ_Incendration wrote:
I'm glad he returned for a bit, and sad about his latest ban. Even I'm not the most positive at times, I argue about things, but in his last submission's discussion thread, I didn't notice anything bad.
As Samsara mentioned in the judgement notes, Logan’s ban resulted from his actions on discord, not from activity in a submission’s discussion thread.
Editor, Experienced Forum User, Judge, Published Author, Expert player
(2254)
Joined: 8/21/2016
Posts: 1102
Location: US
In verifying sync on this run, I noted that there are some places where Mario swims while there's still air above him (for example, in the second portion of 1-4). Since obtaining and maintaining P-Speed is done through much of the run anyway, I'm curious if it would be faster to do these sections with a flying suit (i.e. racoon) and fly past the water instead of swimming?
While I can see how they are used watching the run, I don't know how critical it is to have both the fire flower and hammer bros. suits throughout the run instead of swapping one of those for a flying suit at times.
Just an observation of something that at a glance made me curious if there was a potential way to get through some areas faster. Though without doing any in-depth testing on my own, I can't be sure that it would save time over the course of the entire run.
Editor, Experienced Forum User, Judge, Published Author, Expert player
(2254)
Joined: 8/21/2016
Posts: 1102
Location: US
web2000 wrote:
Hi DrD2k9,
Letter world should be accessible via this method on original hardware as the game adds a star to your save file when loading the ending music in 8-4 and as long as you have 8 stars on the title screen you are able to access Worlds A-D.
Ok
I did also double check with other staff and we agree that it’s a valid use. If a game stores progress across the reset, it’s probably a valid feature to use.
Editor, Experienced Forum User, Judge, Published Author, Expert player
(2254)
Joined: 8/21/2016
Posts: 1102
Location: US
HappyLee wrote:
Good work. Yes vote.
My only concern is the use of soft-reset after 9-4, because previously it's done by dying in 9-1 with "You are a super player" screen. Is it allowed in this TAS? Personally I'm OK with it.
If the letter stages are validly/equivalently reachable via either method (death or reset), the soft reset should be okay. I will double check with other judges to be sure, but i agree with you.
I’d be surprised if we don’t have other games on the site that use soft resets instead of losing lives to get back to a title screen.
I personally used soft resets in Gameboy Donkey Kong to save time on world transitions.
Editor, Experienced Forum User, Judge, Published Author, Expert player
(2254)
Joined: 8/21/2016
Posts: 1102
Location: US
Mikewillplays wrote:
If a judge isn't being able to sync a movie, despite it being already sync verified, is that a good reason to unclaim the judging?
It could also simply be that a particular judge isn't willing to actively judge a run based off someone else's sync verification. Meaning they don't want to judge a run that they can't personally sync.
Editor, Experienced Forum User, Judge, Published Author, Expert player
(2254)
Joined: 8/21/2016
Posts: 1102
Location: US
sl23 wrote:
- Commodore 64 (CRT and T64 files) - some work, some don't, but all work with Vice. I would prefer to use BizHawk. This is probably a compatibilty thing though so accept that in time this will likely be resolved.
It could also be region compatibility settings. BizHawk can emulate both PAL and NTSC systems. In the C64 menu from the menu bar, there should be a settings option. Try the opposite region and see if the games that aren’t working before work in the opposite region settings.
Editor, Experienced Forum User, Judge, Published Author, Expert player
(2254)
Joined: 8/21/2016
Posts: 1102
Location: US
HappyLee wrote:
TAS is art. Art is somewhat subjective. Our publications should have good taste and value quality, or why having publications at all?
TASVideos isn't omnipotent. It's impossible to make everyone happy. Submissions being rejected doesn't mean they have no value.
It's like if you open an art gallery, naturally you'd want arts with standards, and the best art work with limited space.
If people don't like the word elitism, so what? I'd still visit the best art gallery with the best work, instead of a random gallery that just let every trash in and lay them all on the ground.
TASing can be art, but it is not limited to that. There is a valuable aspect of technical achievement also.
There is value in recognizing the best that can be done in a game using TAS tools even if no one particularly likes that game. There is value in record archival for history’s sake. A lack of artistic value does not negate all value of a TAS.
There is plenty of art that i would appreciate that would never be considered “good enough” for an art gallery; similarly, a lot of stuff that does end up in art galleries, I would consider absolute rubbish. Just because something is in an art gallery doesn’t mean it’s actually good to the majority of viewers. Frankly, the majority of highly valued art has its value more tied to the artist than the art itself. So why should we just cater to a particular “elite” group and effectively say “screw you” to everyone else?
The main issue is that we’re NOT trying to be solely an art gallery anymore. As i already mentioned, that hasn’t been the goal of the site since vault was added years ago.
If you don’t like the stuff you’d consider as trash here, then just ignore it. It being here doesn’t lessen the inherent value of your own accomplishments, nor should it lessen the perceived value of your work by viewers.
It’s not the word “elitism” that people don’t like, it’s the attitude of elitism. And the problem with it, again as I’ve already mentioned, is that it’s more likely to turn people away than it is to be welcoming to them. So for the majority of us who want the site and hobby to grow, taking an elitist approach is counterproductive.
Speaking for myself (not as staff), I’d much rather lose the few “elites” who think they and their work are better than others, than potentially lose a majority of members because we stupidly chose to return to our former elitist ways.
Editor, Experienced Forum User, Judge, Published Author, Expert player
(2254)
Joined: 8/21/2016
Posts: 1102
Location: US
HappyLee wrote:
Memory wrote:
My goal for tasvideos is for people to be able to find the TASes they want to find. It doesn't matter how niche the game is, I want people to be able to find it. I'd prefer to find solutions that don't take us back to when people were rightfully calling tasvideos elitist.
What's wrong being elitist or being called elitist? Since we have the publication system, it's natural to value quality over quantity.
Just setup a new section where people are free to submit anything, apart of the current publication system.
Elitism is inherently unwelcoming.
Elitism also relies on subjectivity, which requires feedback, of which we’re receiving less and less on submissions as time passes.
If we went back to a system of requiring a certain level of feedback/notariety for a run to be published, then TAS authors who have interest in games out of the mainstream are starting at an inherent disadvantage to those authors who stick to TASing only popular franchises. Further, if we wanted to become elitist again, I’d argue that we’d need to remove a crap-ton of runs from the site’s publications and YouTube channel; and i can only see that driving members away, not inviting more.
Why should we prioritize the popular over the niche when both have equivalent value of accomplishment? We’re not a site based on popularity or entertainment anymore and haven’t been since the vault was introduced (which goes way back before i joined around 2015). Publishing only popular runs/franchises to the YouTube channel while accepting everything else in some unpublished area of the site, denigrates the hard work authors put into unpopular games. This is why we’ve actively tried broadening what’s acceptable; in order to invite more interest in the general hobby of TASing and to encourage engagement in the community.
EDIT:I was writing this when CPP posted his response.
Editor, Experienced Forum User, Judge, Published Author, Expert player
(2254)
Joined: 8/21/2016
Posts: 1102
Location: US
Dimon12321 wrote:
After reading the discussion here and Samsara's official post, I think we may conclude that TASVideos is turning more lenient. So, I'd like to bring in one more topic on this regard. I'll call it "Mercy for inevitable imperfection". This was the trigger for me to write this, but let's be fair, the idea has been floating around for a long time already.
I’m posting my reply from that thread here as a way to give my perspective on your “Mercy” concept.
DrD2k9 wrote:
eien86 wrote:
Would a less than ideal RNG roll be acceptable for sub?
As far as I’m concerned, an otherwise visibly optimal run should be acceptable. No run should be rejected only because it’s suspected that better RNG might be possible.
If there is indeed a better RNG than what you submit, it would likely take a new movie to prove; otherwise the potential improvement is just theoretical and not something we’d reject for. In a case where a better RNG was possible, known, and known how to make happen, we’d obviously want the more optimal option.
Just make sure to mention in your submission notes as to what extent you tested RNG variations. That will both help a judge and other users who may want to try and better the run.
Bottom line; if the run looks optimal to a casual viewer, it’s up to a different author (or yourself) to prove your submission sub-optimal by submitting their own improved version. This is not the judge’s responsibility.
Editor, Experienced Forum User, Judge, Published Author, Expert player
(2254)
Joined: 8/21/2016
Posts: 1102
Location: US
eien86 wrote:
Would a less than ideal RNG roll be acceptable for sub?
As far as I’m concerned, an otherwise visibly optimal run should be acceptable. No run should be rejected only because it’s suspected that better RNG might be possible.
If there is indeed a better RNG than what you submit, it would likely take a new movie to prove; otherwise the potential improvement is just theoretical and not something we’d reject for. In a case where a better RNG was possible, known, and known how to make happen, we’d obviously want the more optimal option.
Just make sure to mention in your submission notes as to what extent you tested RNG variations. That will both help a judge and other users who may want to try and better the run.
Bottom line; if the run looks optimal to a casual viewer, it’s up to a different author (or yourself) to prove your submission sub-optimal by submitting their own improved version. This is not the judge’s responsibility.
Editor, Experienced Forum User, Judge, Published Author, Expert player
(2254)
Joined: 8/21/2016
Posts: 1102
Location: US
MUGG wrote:
I have a question about uninitialized SRAM. Not sure where else to ask.
If there is a better place, please guide me to it.
When booting up Mario & Luigi Superstar Saga (GBA) for the first time, everything in SRAM is 0xFF.
When using the game's delete option and even the "factory reset" that wipes everything, the game will set everything to 0x00.
I'd like to ask if the 0xFF values are legit or is it just "uninitialized data" and the emulator sets it as 0xFF because it's the cleanest way to go about it?
Or does the original SRAM battery in GBA games like that also ship out with everything as 0xFF at first?
Is it safe to create a TAS that utilizes the 0xFF values or will it be considered invalid?
As i understand things, when a game doesn’t initialize RAM itself, the values of the uninitialized (or more technically, even the pre-initialized) RAM can be any value due to the electronics within the console itself. Sometimes values may persist between power cycles, other times they won’t.
Since the pre/uninitialized values of RAM could vary even between two theoretically “identical” systems, there’s no way to code an emulator to perfectly mimic a real system in this aspect. Thus emulator developers have to somehow seed the RAM with some sort of value(s) before the game code does any initialization itself. 0xFF is just what happens to be the value that the devs use to pre-seed the RAM for the emulator you’re using.
It should be fine for TASing. Where it could become an issue would be with console verification. But even then, there are ways to make it potentially work using custom software to pre-seed the RAM on the console.
Editor, Experienced Forum User, Judge, Published Author, Expert player
(2254)
Joined: 8/21/2016
Posts: 1102
Location: US
Thanks for the clarification. Since the credits don’t naturally roll without actually playing the final level, I think it’s the right choice to include the gameplay.
If the credits rolled when using the glitch, I’d suggest it would be the best any% approach of beating the game; but since they don’t, that’s moot.
Editor, Experienced Forum User, Judge, Published Author, Expert player
(2254)
Joined: 8/21/2016
Posts: 1102
Location: US
Submission Notes wrote:
Technically, I could do End Cutscene Storage one more time to skip 4-5 and the game will consider itself completed but that doesn't feel genuine and after seeing the same thing over and over for nearly 4 minutes, it's about time you guys saw something more interesting.
Would doing the glitch to skip 4-5 result in the game playing the final cutscene & credits (or even just the credits)?
