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Fortranm
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feos wrote:
First and foremost, I'm not convinced this branch meets the Moons requirements yet. The original thread has 8 Yes votes and no No votes, but only a single post about voting Yes, and one post about being unsure what to vote, thought "it was still enjoyable to watch". This thread is 7 Yes against 0 No votes, and also two posts about entertainment.
What intrigues me the most from all of this is actually the implication that the existing feedback does not suffice for the entertainment criterion. In fact, there have been a couple of times over the years where I found decisions on publishing a movie to Vault vs Moon (before the tier revamp) to be somewhat arbitrary, namely not considering a movie qualified for Moon despite the poll result showing significantly more Yes votes than the other options. It might be better if there is a clearer stated threshold that a Standard-ineligible submission needs to meet in order to be qualified for Moon.
feos wrote:
The fact that you can mostly replicate this run by starting from a post-completion save, which we absolutely do accept for Moons, probably can play a role in how exactly we treat this particular cheat code, but still it's not about unlocking new content.
Composer wrote:
Yeah both using the cheat, or starting from a full completion file are just as arbitrary as one another.
I agree that the use of built-in codes shouldn't be much of a limiting factor for Moon. It's a mechanism provided by the game itself after all.
Fortranm
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The poll has been open for some time. Would it be reasonable for a decision to be made at this point? From what I heard, there are changes being made to the way a publication is linked to a system, but as long as the title display format is kept the same for the time being, a decision on this would still be relevant IMO.
Fortranm
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It has been almost 3 months. Would it be reasonable for a decision to be made at this point?
Fortranm
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feos wrote:
the rest is too similar to the any% movie IMO.
I wonder, are they identical to the point of it's possible to copy paste inputs from each other and still be optimal?
Fortranm
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[1651] SNES Super Metroid: MockingBird Station by Hoandjzj in 31:00.42
mmbossman wrote:
While I'm in no particular hurry to have a Super Metroid hack published, enough people seem to find this one entertaining to warrant acceptance. However, both Nach and I were less than impressed with the overall level design and "polish" of the hack, so I would suggest that a future run of a more impressive hack should probably obsolete this run. Anyway, congrats to the author for the first accepted Super Metroid hack on TASvideos
This should be un-obsoleted if different hacks are no longer supposed to obsolete each other. I kinda wonder whether this hack in particular would meet the technical requirements for Standard and whether the movie would still be considered entertaining enough for Moon if it were submitted today, but what’s published is published I guess.
Fortranm
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A movie that goes to Playground:
Wiki: MovieRules#UseTheCorrectVersionOfAGame
Using a PAL version of the game is allowed in some situations:
  • There are version exclusive changes to a PAL release that warrant its usage
  • Games for handheld consoles (like GameBoy)
  • Games that run in PAL60 mode (like on GameCube)
  • The original hardware allows it (see the above section on hardware accuracy)
Is this submission moved to Playground because it uses PAL without being qualified as one of the acceptable cases?
Fortranm
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Nice and technically impressive movie. Yes vote for entertainment. Sorry if this has been answered somewhere, but why do you take this path instead of going New Bark -> Route 27 -> Route 26 -> League Reception Gate -> Route 28 -> Mt. Silver? Is this actually slower than heading to the Magnet Train?
Fortranm
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Out of curiosity, how much does this movie overlap with [2820] N64 Super Mario 74 "all 151 stars" by homerfunky in 1:49:44.52, if at all?
Fortranm
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But, are there actual gameplay improvements beside emulation differences? :P
Fortranm
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It's nice to see you guys prefer the fights that don't involve the 9999 damage punches in general. I was actually going to ask if it would have been better for this to be done on a clean NG+ save file so that it's possible to go for Apocalypse Arm (the weapon that allows 9999 damage punches) without reaching an ending first. In that case, the grinding after getting Magus could be avoided and in fact, it won't be necessary to get him at all and I would fight him in North Cape right away as Inner Lavos can be fought after Black Omen or at some other point instead; on the other hand, the Inner Lavos fights would also end with around 5 punches in total, and the 3 fights in Ozzie's Fort could each end with one single punch as well. I guess it's better the way it currently is after all. :D
Fortranm
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Any plan on doing this next? :D Link to video
Fortranm
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Is there any reason for the detour around the 6:54 mark? Is that a forced movement?
Fortranm
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https://github.com/TASVideos/tasvideos/pull/1125 There was recently an attempt to implement code changes on the site that would parse all future SGB submissions to have the label GB instead. It was merged at one point but reverted because a formal consensus on the matter hasn't been reached. Regarding this change itself, there are two questions that need to be answered IMO: 1. Are all currently published SGB movies better label as GB instead of SGB? The exact line before GB and SGB labels can be up to debate later but all of those VBA ones literally couldn't have access to SNES functionality. 2. Is it still necessary to actively discourage people from doing GB movies in SGB mode even if it’s on the latest cores on Bizhawk? The initial reason from a decade ago, if I understood correctly, was that VBA was trash on this regard and BizHawk didn't have up-to-standard SGB emulation either. The latter is no longer true. If your answer to 1 is Yes and to 2 is No, then that commit most likely makes things better based on your stance. Also keep in mind that even if we decide to automatically parse everything SGB related as SGB, there will still need to be site code changes because BizHawk bSNES submissions, the ones that actually can utilize SNES hardware in some way, would currently be parsed as SNES.
Fortranm
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Alyosha wrote:
But, the same also goes for most older versions of BizHawk, and lsnes, if accuracy is the main deciding factor.
Isn't lsnes still the only one capable of making subframe inputs for SNES? How is SGB emulation via the bSNESv115 core compared to the composite SGB emulation in lsnes?
Fortranm
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Btw, the rerecord count is 0 on the submission because I replaced the header file with one from Bizhawk 2.8 since I made the movie on an interim build beforehand. The rerecord count on the original movie file is 6278, if that matters.
Fortranm
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Fortranm
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SmashManiac wrote:
First, it's not clear when this max difficulty threshold actually occur, or if there is one at all. Reading your submission notes, it assumes that it occurs when reaching 990 points like ThunderAxe31's analysis of the Game & Watch 4 version you linked to, but it's not something that can be easily verified.
We can poke the RAM address for the value of score I mentioned in the submission text and set it to, say, 9999, at the start of the game and the difficulty related values will immediately be changed to the ones you get after the ~990 threshold. It is fair to say that is the "final" difficulty of the game as far as we can tell.
Fortranm
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SmashManiac wrote:
The goal choice feels arbitrary to me. I get that saving Donkey Kong can be a legitimate goal, and I also get that achieving a maximum score (999 or 9999 depending if we care about the in-game score of the leaderboards added to the DSiWare version) can also be a legitimate goal. Having a weird combination of both of these goals in a row just makes no sense to me, especially when considering that each stage of freeing Donkey Kong does not change anything other than the number of points awarded. My personal preference is a maximum score goal since gameplay progresses by the same amount regardless of how points have been obtained.
For clarification, the goal choice is simply to beat a loop on the highest difficulty ("ending after a loop ends with the highest difficulty" vs "ending after a full loop is done on the highest difficulty" can be a point of contention, of course). A maximum score is reached because of how difficulty works in this game. It is part of the means, not the ends.
Fortranm
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Natetheman223 wrote:
The only way you could tell cheats were used is by the currency saying "999999999" or whatever, but the effect is the same as having any other number - all the upgrades are purchased already; the number means nothing.
Is it normally possible to have that number for currency in this case?
Natetheman223 wrote:
My proposal is to allow external cheats to be used in verification movies as long as the end result could also be achieved by simply playing the game, and retains no lasting, unintended effects (like if infinite health somehow stayed on even after the code was disabled and the game was restarted, or if you got a debug item that can't be acquired in normal gameplay and it wasn't discarded before the save file was created, etc - those types of things). Think of it as a shortcut.
But how do we know it has no "unintended" effects? What if some codes have unintended effects when it's used on, say, a portion of the game different from when it's meant to be used? If one were to resort to not having a verification movie file for some reason, editing the save file directly with a proof of the data structure would be a much better approach than using cheat codes in a verification movie IMO as the former would actually pin point the values that need to be changed for whatever reason with much lower possibility to unintentionally affect something else. Of course, either of these only seems justifiable in extreme cases. Even the "10 hours" argument seems reasonable only because this is a game emulated by Dolphin, which isn't quite the most sync friendly. If it is some game from older platforms without much emulation syncing issue, the number of hours of required gameplay in a verification movie would need to be much higher for practices like this to be justifiable IMO.
Fortranm
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SmashManiac wrote:
- I'm not sure if allowing an emulator that injects its own user name and message during initial system setup should be allowed.
To be fair, a more glaring issue concerning the technical validity of emulation here would be the fact that a DSiWare like this is present right after the system is formatted. :P
Fortranm
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From what I understand, "70 stars, no BLJ" is effectively just the standard NMG for this game. In fact, the rules on SRC for "70 stars" is just beating the game without using certain glitches. The other ones are just any% at the time, yeah. That's something that has been brought up here: https://tasvideos.org/Forum/Topics/20039?CurrentPage=7&Highlight=510892#510892 Labeling the any% as something else seems to be a common practice for 2D Mario games in general for some reason.
feos wrote:
I started thinking about how we would branch them so 16-star route makes the most sense...
There is this Japanese re-release that has the BLJ patched (and this is the version the Chinese localization by iQue and later ports like Super Mario 3D All-Stars based on). I wonder if "16 stars" would just be any% if done on those versions.
Fortranm
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Editing the links on the current main Movies page seems to be a relatively simple change. It could help to do it for the time being if it's deemed reasonable. Also, I assume the lists per console pages will still be around in some way on the site even after the game based navigation is implemented? Those lists can still be helpful in some cases imo.
Fortranm
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Mizumaririn wrote:
I am concerned about would it be partly judged for leniency. Where it hasn't reached the exciting part, or long unentertaining setup just to setup something cool. Imagine smb3 without whistles. (ignoring DCPM workaround) you have to sit through 6 worlds without new content just to see cool stuff. Why should the other parts affect the viewing experience of the real playground - the main focus the author wants to show off?
Couldn't "start from SRAM" or even "start from now" be used for movies like that?
Fortranm
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feos wrote:
The issue I'm seeing is we can't create the same game entry that would cover several platforms, which may be desired if the versions for different platforms are indeed the same.
If a game only has a published movie on one side and a user wants to find it by platform/system, having both Windows and Linus entries listed on one page would reduce the chances for the person to miss it.
feos wrote:
But DOS feels like it should belong to the IBM PC section too, because separating PC into modern and retro would be subjective.
Including DOS would raise the number of entries on the page to 115 (in contrast to 67 on the DOS-DOOM page and 54 on the proposed Windows-Linux page) as we speak. This is still not an absurdly high number compared to the system pages like NES, SNES, and Genesis so that sounds like a good idea too. https://tasvideos.org/Movies-DOS-Windows-Linux Or is it gonna include DOOM at the top (because of alphabetical order) of the page as well? https://tasvideos.org/Movies-DOS-Windows-Linux-DOOM