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Good start of the year!
Having extensively played the DOS port, I can tell you that it's pretty much identical to the Genesis original. I don't see how this is worth a separate run unless of course there are substantial glitches that work on one platform but not the other. The only gameplay difference I've seen so far is that DOS gives the player more points for various actions, so that on an ordinary playthrough the score counter will max out at 99990 before the end of the game. Weird.
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In a playaround, I'd like to see weird combos and fun glitches. Not doing a poor throw, then doing an average throw, then doing a good throw. This movie is good for a demo of the game, but not for a TAS.
(edit) I should add that for a playaround, you should probably run the DOS version of this game, which is both the original game and has better art than the NES port.
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Speaking for myself, I wouldn't object to a run of a cracked version iff no other versions are available. Numerous DOS games had hardware-based copy protection, so as you say a cracked version would be the only way to run it in an emulator.
I would not recommend hex-editing the executable to remove the intro.
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zaphod77 wrote:
this version added much more new than most. most if they added anything just an extra jaffar battle before the princess.
Sure, that's my point. It's the same game, only bigger. That doesn't make it groundbreaking or "re-imagined" or other superlatives like that.
For example, what you call "ascent from hell" is simply another level with a different tileset. The "number of additional bosses" are just reskins of existing enemies (other than shiva/jafar). A "potion of death" is the same as the poison potion from the original, only it deals more damage. Once you have a tile-based game engine, it's not exactly hard to add another level; e.g. the Genesis version also has five new levels and extra tilesets, and even a 1994 hack of the PC version adds ten extra levels.
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Odongdong wrote:
Alright, I found my time to write the new description. Feel free to edit if something isn't right.
SNES version of Prince of Persia isn't quite a mere port; it's more of a complete re-imagining that puts itself beyond any other releases at the time. Developed by Arsys Software, this version greatly expands upon Jordan Mechner's classic with brand-new musics, overhauled graphics, new levels, new traps, new boss fights, and more.
Challenger improves the previous attempt with a bunch of more skips and route changes in the run, including various optimizations and an newly found exploit that skips the entire boss fight.
That strikes me as rather hyperbolic :)
I wouldn't call it a "complete re-imagining" or "beyond" anything else. It's fundamentally the exact same game with some extra game elements. The game has been ported to easily twenty different platforms, and most of these offer the classic twelve levels plus a few more, and most of these have improved graphics and music over the original. The main extra appeal is the Shiva fight and the extended Jafar battle; everything else follows the standard combat system.
So it's arguably the best port of POP before the 2010 Ubisoft remake; but that doesn't make it a "re-imagining".
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£e Nécroyeur wrote:
25 m:
The timer expires 508 Frames after the first possible input Frame. A TAS requires 331 Frames to complete the Stage.
It's always awesome if a TAS accomplishes something that's normally known to be impossible. I'd love to see a movie that successfully passes one of the most (in)famous Kill Screens in history.
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adelikat wrote:
I'd be highly interested in a kill screen version, more so than this version. Personally, I'd argue that it is a must for this game, since the game continues to increase in difficulty rather than simply repeat.
I concur. The regular goal for endless games is "when the difficulty stops going up", not "when you see the first level again".
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mklip2001 wrote:
This looks pretty cool; hooray for a 2-player run of Golden Axe. It seems like this is a lot shorter than the Genesis port; is there a harder difficulty in this version with any more stages?
Nope.
The Genesis port (and PC and Amiga ports, really) have much less detailed animation than the Arcade, presumably because of memory constraints. To compensate for that, they added two more levels to the end, so instead of just fighting Death=Adder you fight Death=Adder's son first and then the real one (PC/Amiga) or fight the real Death=Adder followed by his master Death=Bringer (Genesis); in all cases this is a palette swap with more hit points.
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Alyosha wrote:
If still looking for ideas, I think Gunstar Heroes would be a good choice to replace warpless walkathon. Exchanging 25 minutes of walking with 31 minutes of action seems like a good trade to me.
Seconded.
And yes, it would be great to see an edit to the RFN list based on this thread. There does appear to be general agreement here.
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Although I enjoy the run and the mechanic, I really think you should run the full version of this game. Your version has nine levels and no real ending; it feels more like a beta of the actual game. The full version has about 20 levels, a boss battle, and a secret extra-hard ending.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RV659Tg8BoQ
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Seriously? Any halfway-competent programmer can make a game like this in a single afternoon. I should hope this falls well short of our notability requirement for unofficial games. No vote.
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Derakon wrote:
Personally I find the DOOM speedruns to be nigh-incomprehensible. Understanding those runs (and runs of Wolfenstein, etc.) requires too much familiarity with the source material due to the rapid motion, samey-looking levels, and constant strafe-running. Nightfire still has straferunning, of course, but it's a lot easier for a knowlessman to follow, so it gets my vote.
That's a good point. Doom is of historical interest as one of the first games to kickstart the speedrunning community, but that doesn't make it recommended for newcomers.
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feos wrote:
UMK3 is a Nintendo game?
SNES UMK3 is a game on a SNES. Currently more than half of all RFN movies are for the NES or SNES, as compared to none for arcade. Hence my suggestion for an arcade run.
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FWIW I don't think that multiple runs for the same game should get a Star; I'd prefer stars to be a cross section showing many different kinds of game (and genre, and platform). So imho the best Super Metroid run (which may well be this one) should have a Star, and the other should not. $.02
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Hm, this discussion appears to have stalled. Would it help to make a concrete proposal for going forward?
I suggest that on the Recommended For Newcomers list, SMB3 Warps should be replaced with Marvel Vs Capcom (to be clear, that's SMB3 Warps and not SMB3 ACE).
Specifically, [2098] Arcade Marvel vs. Capcom "playaround" by SDR in 25:37.70. First, this is a popular run in Star Tier; and second, its genre (fighting games) and platform (arcade) are not currently represented in the RFN list. Conversely, SMB3 Warps is pointed out by several people in this thread as one of the less interesting runs on RFN. Furthermore, the Mario franchise, platformer genre, and NES console all appear to be over-represented in RFN; there's even two SMB3 runs at the moment.
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Imho,
The four-games-at-the-same-time should definitely be in RTN because of how bizarrely over-the-top it is.
I'm fine with adding Mario Kart because it's really a different genre, but I do feel we should take out all except one of the Mario platformer runs.
Other things I suggest to add,
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Demon Lord wrote:
Shouldn't the newcomer list be more easily accessible from the front page?
It's funny how well-hidden this is. A newcomer would first have to click on the tab controls on the front page, instead of the flashy picture content. Then he gets a screen with six sub-tabs, and will have to divine the difference between "tier", "list", "category", and "special category". Clearly the last of these has the newcomer list he's looking for, amidst a dozen other terms that don't make a lot of sense to newcomers :D
That said, I agree that newcomer runs should be of well-known games, because these have the greatest appeal to people unfamiliar with TASing.
Aside from that, it would help to have a greater diversity:
5 out of 15 recommendations are Mario games, whereas no other franchise has more than one game.
11 out of 15 recommendations are of the platform or Metroidvania genres. Genres like beat-em-up or RTS are absent entirely.
8 out of 15 recommendations are NES and SNES. I can understand not having any A2600 or VirtualBoy games here, but the list should arguably include e.g. Arcade, DOS, Playstation, and Wii.
