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Exactly what Tub said. Redesign offers countless mindbreaking possibilities in both, route and speed-tricks, which will make a awesome TAS with very much variety like in no other hack.
One good example you can already see in this update!
http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/3949/Saturn_-_SMR_TAS_-_till%20Norfair.smv
It shows a absolutely unexpected and crazy way how to get the High Jump Boots early and abuse the Spring Ball to its fullest to increase the speed through some rooms extremely badly. Also perfect use of the Charge Beam to save Missiles, and hopefully a optimal ammo management in general.
I recomment to use the latest Redesign v2.1 version to not risk desyncs.
Enjoy!
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Amazing!
Though the entertainment factor is sacrificed for a faster time again. But it still has 2 long boost laps, so it's not that bad and makes even more variety that way.
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Tonski wrote:
Saturn is a better TASer than JXQ.
This is not true at all. JXQ is a excellent and very fast TASer. It's just that I took much more effort and time to optimize the moves in my vids, where JXQ aimed for a faster completion of his TAS. And as moozooh said, in the very first RBO teaser, there are some rooms that are even slower than JXQs 100% v1 run (for example the Torizo fight).
Regarding unknown tricks, yeah, I'm very glad I discovered them all in time, so there aren't any major errors because of missing tricks there at all.
moozooh wrote:
Tonski wrote:
There wasn't that many mistakes, but for example shinesparking up that place where there's Etecoons, or getting the Spore Spawn super missiles without the Crystal Flash, and other small things like that. I assume those weren't known at that time? (at least the SS missiles)
Right, both weren't known back then, and JXQ will use these tricks in v2.
I discovered and knew both of them by that time. I just kept them for myself in the (by now failed) hope to show some new and surprising tricks in the RBO run, when it would be done.
Regarding the any%, I'm right before Draygon by now. Though I didn't continue this run for a while because I work on the Super Metroid Redesign TAS currently. I will eventually continue the any% pretty soon again.
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BoltR wrote:
Oh man, why would you save that for the last lap and not just use it as much as possible? It's glorious!
I think you lose more time if doing it in every other lap, because when Lakitu puts you back on track you lose much time during this animation, and the need to accelerate from 0 till top speed (which Bowser is the slowest in) after that costs also much time.
comicalflop wrote:
It's a two lap skip right? use it twice then. First time it makes you skip the lap 3, 2nd time it makes you skip to lap 5.
the 2nd time you do it, that will end the race right there. (right?)
No. You only gain 1 lap with that (Huffers got 3rd instead of 2nd lap in his nice demo-smv).
DK64:
I think your suggestion would be slower in the end, because you just lose too much time on backtracking that way, and the time gain wouldn't make up for that.
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hopper:
My Torizo fight in the RBO run may look cooler, but it's slower than heros one actually. I used many normal beam shots before Missiles, which however slowed down the Torizo to throw his refill-skulls because of lag that is caused by shooting him. Hero got the refills earlier and used more Missiles on him instead, which in the end is slightly faster than what I did in RBO. To that time I didn't know the normal beam would do so much less damage than Missiles do, which makes the normal beam almost worthless in comparison.
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comicalflop wrote:
we both tried doing an extended boost in lap two from different angles and stuff. we even went back and tried not getting 10 coins. none of it worked. we're still not sure why.
In order to make the gap Huffers simply did an infi-boost instead.
Hmmm, maybe it's worth to ask a Super Mario Kart expert from the realtime record site? I think they could give a hint to this.
comicalflop wrote:
Next course should also offer lots of nice shortcuts.
Great, can't wait to see the next course. :-)
Shinryuu:
It is definitely slower. To make a driver small you have to press Y and A in the same time before selecting the driver with B. Not only you lose time in the selection menu, a small driver is also much slower in the Races...
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Looks great! Though you should probably analyze the reasons why the arrow long boost works sometimes, and why not. I think there is for sure a reason that could be manipulated to make it work everytime. Maybe I'm wrong though. GV1 is still the best one so far, but it also offered many more possibilities for crazy and unexpected shortcuts.
Great work, hopefully the next tracks will also offer this nice shortcut-possibilities!
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Haha JXQ, awesome nose dive into the pit! :-P
I really must say, you have along with moozooh, such a big potential to make extremely funny movies for some reason. I would wish to see a complete Super Metroid playthrough of you some day. Maybe you can break moozoohs record for the most entertaining run there. :-)
As for me, after a very long time I tried my first Super Battle playthrough in Super Street Fighter 2 on max. difficulty (8 Stars) again.
Even though skill is terribly rusty, I managed to play through the entire Battle (12 Fights) with only 2 losses. Used 3 different characters in total to make some variety in the run. Only sucker FeiLong (maybe it's my fault :-P) lost very early, Balrog managed to win a good ammount of fights before his loss, and King Zangief stayed undefeated till the end!
Even though you can't match the CPU's reactions in such fights in realtime, I used smart tricks all the time to confuse them and abuse their weak-points in the fights.
Enjoy!
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Drewseph wrote:
I swear on my life I fixed the last of the most annoying bugs and will no longer update any more!@
Drew, honestly, you don't have to swear to that extreme about that. It's your hack, and if you see a graphical glitch or any other error it's always good to fix that (at least as long our incomplete movies won't desync after it). Your v2.1 update was a good decision in any case, and I'm glad I can continue my run on it.
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Same here. Unmorphing at the last possible frame before losing blue suit when touching the ground will let you keep it and the momentum a bit longer during the unmorph animation. Nevertheless, a nice discovery catnap!
Tub wrote:
Saturn, good job on the subtitle placement btw.
Thanks Tub! I did my best to add it on a important place hard to cut out, and simultaneously not to disturb the watcher as much as possible.
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moozooh wrote:
I also have a feeling that the three-tube room with the loose wall on the way to Spore Spawn can be done faster since you can skip unmorphing until immediately before the knockback, as I demonstrated on my progress blog.
IRC wrote:
[12:18] <Saturn_> I don't understand exactly what you ment there
[12:19] <moozooh> http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/3725/brinstar-3rdtubeskiptest.smv -- starting from realtime frame 415.
[12:19] <Saturn_> thanks gonna check
[12:19] <moozooh> i'm quite sure it's faster than running on that ledge.
[12:22] <Saturn_> hmmm
[12:22] <Saturn_> I'm not sure
[12:22] <Saturn_> because starting a ground-contacting mockball slows you down a bit at the beginning
[12:22] <Saturn_> and you also slow down by unmorphing before the bug
[12:23] <Saturn_> alot
[12:23] <Saturn_> the arm pumps at that ledge would catch up the mockball most likely, and the direct falling would catch up the rest
[12:23] <Saturn_> I think
[12:23] <Saturn_> unmorphing cancells a very important falling speed gain
[12:24] <Saturn_> which wastes alot of frames, I tested this many times in other places
[12:24] <moozooh> well, it was only ~13 frames slower overall than doing that part the usual way (skipping the left tube), so i figured the bulk of the loss was on the first tube.
[12:24] <Saturn_> possibly
And thanks for the great idea! I will check that webhost out sometime.
creaothceann:
Nope, it's http://youtube.com/profile?user=1234asd12341234 (wrong nickspelling)
Kyrsimys:
Not at all. I just think that a AVI is much more simple and handy to watch than a smv. But ok, if you all really want the smv that much, here it is:
http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/3771/Saturn_-_SMR_TAS_-_almost_at_HJ-Boots.smv
Tub:
I know. I just get bored from one run, then start switching to the other. Though this is definitely the last run I will add in my current project list. RBO is currently on hold for almost a half year by now, because it got too tedious in Maridia. Then I started a any% run which is currently at Draygon (or to ~50% finished). Most lately I also got much interest in Redesign again, so I picked my old WIP up, and continue it in this days. Depending of the mood I will switch between any% in original and Redesign for this moment. RBO will most likely be continued after this 2, because it's just too complicated for me for now. Sorry if you all waited for it :-(, I just want to have some fun in TASing, which isn't the case in RBO anymore (in Maridia).
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moozooh wrote:
Wow, and it's still improvable by a lot of frames. :D
Giving a example would probably be a more helpful option. :-)
moozooh wrote:
4. No free resize (I'm not watching emulator videos in their original resolution, ever).
You can actually make it fullscreen or change to any desirable size with this button:
Everybody:
Ok, I will look if I can upload the original AVI somewhere, so you can watch it with a clean 60fps and save on HDD if needed.
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Ladies and gentlemen, from now on I will post further WIPs of my Redesign TAS project on youtube, for which I specially created a account there. It's much handier that way, and users can watch it without needing to have our emulator knowledges. And the vid is stored forever unlike in Rapidshare.
So here we go, from the last smv which ended after Bomb-Torizo, this WIP goes till the room with a energy tank right before the HJ Boots. It's a new and never before used route, that even though getting HJ Boots is a detour, will save much more time in the later parts because of them.
Also a new, never before executed technique in Redesign is used: Midair-Morph IBJ!!
Super Metroid Redesign - Any% TAS-speedrun by Saturn - WIP 1
Further WIPs will be posted there as well.
Enjoy!
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The baby metroid shinespark skip was obvious after the shortest charge got known. I never talked about it though, (was planned to be a surprise tech in RBO) but JXQ already found it out by himself then. Althought it can't be done with catnaps (slightly longer) short charge, I'm pretty sure he also found it after the shortest charge got public.
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Btw. here is a possible screenshot that would characterize this run very well:
The very unexpected Maridia shinespark to Tourian which no other run would have the opportunity to use because of a different route.
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One of the best TASes for sure!
The most surprising thing in that run was the Red Brinstar shaft climb without HJ Boots. You just shot the beam from the ground and manage to keep it onscreen till the top to save some time by avoiding a otherwise needed bomb jump at the end of it. Very clever and amazing discovery, man!
The use of the Shinespark through Mt. Doom on the way to Tourian was also phantastic. Perfect abuse of the low health stop, which indeed makes Space Jump completely useless in this run. And managing to keep and execute the, firstly thought to be impossible, Draygon Shinespark without HJ Boots right after Botwoon was a killer too.
The route itself was extremely well planned, hard and very entertaining (mostly because of something new) to watch.
The only slight mistakes I noticed were:
- In WS, its around 8-10 frames faster to use the last PB right before Phantoons door instead of the area near the 2 Super Missiles. This area can be shot down with a couple of beam shots pretty well. A PB gains some time here, but not as much as in the pre-Phantoon room.
- The first beam shot at Kraid to make him open his mouth was too early and caused some realtime lag. JXQ did the same mistake in his run. You can actually shot it much later and still hit him on the same frame, but with less lag that is caused by the beam on screen.
- Ridleys final grab delay before the KO animation could be shortened a bit by optimizing the grab position.
Other than this tiny errors the run looks excellent, so I give it a very big YES vote with a star! This is a serious and big improvement to the last published run, great and especially fast job hero!
PS: The ingame timer is exactly 25,5 min. To get a 24 min display, you would need to save ~1800 frames, which I highly doubt beeing possible with this route.
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Super Metroid Redesign is a very good example of a evil anti TAS game. :-)
In the fastest possible any% route, if you don't know the exact location of a very important and invisible trigger that would affect the progress massively, you will get stuck after a half hour later and won't have a clue why. This is especially shocking because this little mistake a half hour back in the run will make all the work after it useless and you'll need to restart from there again.
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Being back again and having more freetime, I decided to continue my old Redesign WIP further. It's a bit slower than moozoohs current one, but I just want to finish this run faster and see what time is possible to get. TASing Redesign is very interesting, especially in later parts (can't wait for HJ Boots and Speed Booster).
I did some progress and just got the Bombs.
Here the WIP
Enjoy!
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Huffers wrote:
Ghost valley is done
here is WIP number 3
ghost valley time = 38.31 seconds (non-TAS world record = 48.42)
Damn, even as a experienced SMK player this was the most impressive GV1 race I have ever seen so far. Simply breath-taking!! Keep it on guys, this will be one of the best racing TASes on this site for sure!
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Huffers wrote:
It's a silly glitched track, but here you go.
Hope it doesn't make you dizzy.
Bullshit!! Thats all I can say to this man. :-)
Although it will be much faster that way, the entertainment-factor will be lowered alot compared to real and crazy laps like in the 1st course.
Either way, the WIP looks amazing and I'm glad you both decided to work on this great game. Looking forward for more progress!
Everybody:
Ok, I will look if I can upload the original AVI somewhere, so you can watch it with a clean 60fps and save on HDD if needed.
The very unexpected Maridia shinespark to Tourian which no other run would have the opportunity to use because of a different route.