I'm sure any kind of run for Super Mario 64 if performed by an author with lots of experience and skill at TAS'ing Mario could be entertaining.
With this in mind, we don't want to have several different kinds of TAS runs. There should be the bare minimum (0 stars) and the full completion. (120 stars)
The whole point of the 70 star run would be so people get a run that doesn't just abuse the BLJ to get every single star. The category would be fastest completion without BLJ. Yes, technically a 120 star run would probably be better, but is anyone likely going to make a BLJless 120 star run? I wish they did, but I doubt it. You also realize the same argument that was used against it could be used against the 16 star run right?
You have to realize that many people are going to find a 100% run with BLJ pretty boring. It's entertaining in the old run and the 0% run because it was a novelty that wasn't used very often. After you guys are done figuring out all the different ways to initiate the trick, 100 of the 120 stars are going to just be: 'Jump in level. Run to BLJ start location. Visually teleport to a star. Repeat.' That would be EXTREMELY boring. Even if the novelty hasn't worn off for you from the current TASes it will by the end of that. Most of the entertainment in this game came from the VARIETY of the levels, and the different crazy jumping to get to places I didn't think possible; BLJ was cool once and then it's all the same.
As for a 16 star run, you do realize that it is still available on the site right? Linked to in the 0 star run description no less. Making a new 16 star run at this point is probably the most arbitrary thing you can do in this game(short of just screwing around or collecting some random amount of stars; even my really old joke crawl-o-thon is less arbitrary). As I said earlier in the thread, if you are going to use the glitch, go all out with it don't arbitrarily not use it some times. Also, saying "It's the current console maximum" is a joke, and not a very funny one.
Technically speaking, the only categories that should be considered for this site are:
-Quickest completion (0 star)
-Quickest 100% (120 stars)
-Quickest completion without gamebreaking glitch (70 stars, no BLJ AT ALL.)
-100% without gamebreaking glitch (120 stars, no BLJ AT ALL)
Are they all needed? Likely not. a 70 star run would be largely a repeat of the 120. The others will encompass everything else you would want to see though.
Not happy with that and still want to make your random collect x stars with x conditions run? The internet has a nice service called YouTube, it is for hosting your own personal videos!
Edit: Just a clarification as I didn't make it clear, I didn't really mean that 120 stars with NO BLJ was needed right now. Just that in the future as more and more of the 120 are obtained using BLJ the need for such a run would grow.
BoltR and mmbossman:
don't worry about that, only a few of the 120 stars use BLJ's. it's mostly used in the castle. without BLJ's, there would be 10 more minutes of walking around in the castle in the 120 star run.
After you guys are done figuring out all the different ways to initiate the trick, 100 of the 120 stars are going to just be: 'Jump in level. Run to BLJ start location. Visually teleport to a star. Repeat.'
Edit: Just a clarification as I didn't make it clear, I didn't really mean that 120 stars with NO BLJ was needed right now. Just that in the future as more and more of the 120 are obtained using BLJ the need for such a run would grow.
I'm starting to think I DID make it clear, and people just didn't read what I wrote.
After you guys are done figuring out all the different ways to initiate the trick, 100 of the 120 stars are going to just be: 'Jump in level. Run to BLJ start location. Visually teleport to a star. Repeat.'
Seriously now...
IT IS NOT LIKE THAT NOW, IN THE FUTURE. AS I SAID.
Joined: 11/18/2006
Posts: 2426
Location: Back where I belong
z0MG wrote:
BoltR and mmbossman:
don't worry about that, only a few of the 120 stars use BLJ's. it's mostly used in the castle. without BLJ's, there would be 10 more minutes of walking around in the castle in the 120 star run.
I've never said a 120 star BLJ-less run would be better. I'm still of the belief that a 70 star run without BLJs is both a nice middleman between the 0 and 120 (imagine virtually no swimming levels!), and would have a distinct, if a tiny bit arbitrary, restriction. I would gladly pay the price of a little more time in the castle (I call bullshit on the 10 minute mark, it'd be more like 2 or 3 max), in exchange for some new and interesting routes that don't just zoom by everything. Can you see how having no BLJs can be entertaining to someone other than yourself now?
Seriously now...
IT IS NOT LIKE THAT NOW, IN THE FUTURE. AS I SAID.
calm down.. I read what you wrote, and I assure you, no, more and more of the stars won't be obtained using BLJ's.
actually, the only star in the game that uses a BLJ to warp right to the star is behind chain chomp's gate. BLJ's are used for most stars in JRB (Jolly Roger Bay), but only to skip a minute of swimming.
There aren't many in-level BLJ spots that are actually useful. BLJ's only adds more speed to the run and skips some boring parts like minutes of swimming and walking around in the castle.
There will never be a need for a BLJ-less run, because few people actually care about it, and I doubt any TAS'er will take the time to make one. End of discussion.
Joined: 11/18/2006
Posts: 2426
Location: Back where I belong
z0MG wrote:
There will never be a need for a BLJ-less run, because few people actually care about it, and I doubt any TAS'er will take the time to make one. End of discussion.
You can continue to live in your own little world, where only your opinions matter, but just because you don't think a concept is exciting doesn't mean no one else does.
I wish you could start reading my posts.. I said FEW PEOPLE, not no one, and I am right. Are there more people here except you and BoltR that want a BLJ-less run?
A BLJ-less 120 star run wouldn't make much sense now. Fastest time with BLJs should be attempted first and the current run is kind of out-dated. So why don't we, until then, just not argue about it?
A BLJ-less 120 star run wouldn't make much sense now. Fastest time with BLJs should be attempted first and the current run is kind of out-dated. So why don't we, until then, just not argue about it?
Joined: 11/18/2006
Posts: 2426
Location: Back where I belong
z0MG wrote:
Kuwaga wrote:
A BLJ-less 120 star run wouldn't make much sense now. Fastest time with BLJs should be attempted first and the current run is kind of out-dated. So why don't we, until then, just not argue about it?
a playaround doing whatever the hell you want, and getting however many stars you want. Pick the best ones, show off some fun stuff, skip all the boring ass swimming, and end it in under 20 minutes.
there's many of these freeruns that show off fun stuff and randomness at YouTube. remember, this site is for speedruns.
Joined: 11/18/2006
Posts: 2426
Location: Back where I belong
z0MG wrote:
mmbossman wrote:
a playaround doing whatever the hell you want, and getting however many stars you want. Pick the best ones, show off some fun stuff, skip all the boring ass swimming, and end it in under 20 minutes.
I wouldn't mind a BLJ-less run (ie, 70 stars). 120 stars BLJ-less I could do without, though. Swimming stars are required there, whereas only 1 is for a BLJ-less 70 star run.
But I most want to see the 120-star run improved.
You know, how about we ask mr_robert_z how many stars could be achieved by mostly BLJing. I personally doubt that many exist (surely not the majority), but he's doing the 120 star run right now so he would be the person to ask. Without his knowledge, the main base of this argument has no concrete foundation...
<ccfreak2k> There is no 'ctrl' button on DeHackEd's computer. DeHackEd is always in control.
Bkdj, that was the best quality I've seen encoded
I downloaded the one at 60 fps about 208 MB
I think that was the highest-res one, it's cool, I could see a huge difference mostly at the terrain (compared to the m64 ones on mupen)
You know, how about we ask mr_robert_z how many stars could be achieved by mostly BLJing. I personally doubt that many exist (surely not the majority), but he's doing the 120 star run right now so he would be the person to ask. Without his knowledge, the main base of this argument has no concrete foundation...
Like I already said, few stars use BLJ's. Trust me. :( Go watch rikku's run, except for more lobby BLJ's to skip walking around in the castle, and BLJ's on the cannon slope at the start of JRB, only used to skip a lot of swimming, nothing has changed.
BrianRuleZ wrote:
Bkdj, that was the best quality I've seen encoded
I downloaded the one at 60 fps about 208 MB
I think that was the highest-res one, it's cool, I could see a huge difference mostly at the terrain (compared to the m64 ones on mupen)
You know, how about we ask mr_robert_z how many stars could be achieved by mostly BLJing. I personally doubt that many exist (surely not the majority), but he's doing the 120 star run right now so he would be the person to ask. Without his knowledge, the main base of this argument has no concrete foundation...
Like I already said, few stars use BLJ's. Trust me. :( Go watch rikku's run, except for more lobby BLJ's to skip walking around in the castle, and BLJ's on the cannon slope at the start of JRB, only used to skip a lot of swimming, nothing has changed.
Care to elaborate? In case you got me wrong, I meant that more stars aren't obtained using BLJ's. maybe just a few, but my point was that BLJ's will never be dominating for getting stars.
More than just a few. You've already seen JRB, which is completely dominated by them.
Obviously not every star will feature BLJs, but the run will be very BLJ heavy.
I don't know why zOMG is so against a blj-less any% run (THAT being the condition, 70 stars being the result)... I've said it before, but I think it would be a great addition to the site.
