(Link to video)
Mario & Luigi Bowser's Inside story is the third game in the series. Fawful is back and he wants to take over the mushroom kingdom. He gives a lucky? shroom to Bowser which gives him the ability to vacuum. Bowser then swallows everyone at the castle. Mario & Luigi must then team-up with Bowser to prevent Fawful from reaching his goal.

Game objectives

Version

Text is the same speed between japanese and english. It turns out that fire attacks in giant battles are a few seconds faster in the japanese version, but I still went with the english version.

RNG manipulation

A big part of the run is RNG manipulation. The formula is RNG(x) = floor(20.5x)&0x7fff + (x%2)*0x8000. RNG only changes when necessary in battle which means that I have to manipulate before the battle. The initial seed depends of the frame you enter the frame so I just wait until I get a good seed.

Battle comments

Bowser

The figth ends when you deal 20 damage after Toadsworth is gone.

Goombule

I delay the kill to prevent another one from spawning.

Goombule x2

Same thing for this fight.

Elite Goombule x2

This fight is pretty straightforward. Just use green shell.

Spike Blob x2

Again, I want to delay the kill.

Midbus

Another really straightforward fight.

Broque monsieur

I manipulate his attack and a lucky hit.

Sea pipe statue

Here, I manipulate 2 lucky hits. I also want three attacks both time and I want stone blooper to only spin once.

Scutlet

It is faster to jump than using green shell

Broggy

Just alternate between fire and punch.

Treevil

Using fire is faster for this fight

Wiggler

I manipulate 2 lucky hits and I avoid the turnip.

Durmite

Jumping is still faster. I want to avoid the straw as much as possible.

Bowser's castle

This is a straightforward fight

Midbus

I get hit to get a drumstick which gives a power boost. Shy guy squad is faster than punching. I also only get great to avoid cheering

Tenderling x2

Another straightforward fight

Kretin

I need a lucky hit to avoid kretin reforming.

Fawflant x2

Another straightforward fight.

Bowser

I use jump helmet for this fight.

Yikk tower

It's faster to use fire at the start and to let the tower repair.

Wisdurm

I get 2 lucky hits at the start to make the fight a lot faster.

Fawful express

This is another straightforward fight.

M&L memory

I target luigi first until he leaves, then I kill mario.

Sockop x4

I use Yoo-who cannon for a quick fight.

Chackron

Snack basket is required to finish this fight.

Junker

This is a quick fight. I also get special gloves.

Blizzard Midbus

I get fury to make this fight faster.

Dark Star

I get a lucky hit to make this fight a lot faster. I also get D-Star wear to help on damage.

Super peach's castle

Another straightforward fight.

Dark Fawful

I get 2 lucky hits on the helmet to kill it quickly. Then I use magikoopa mob to finish fawful off.

Dark Bowser / Dark Star Core

I use magikoopa for Dark Bowser and jump helmet for Dark Star. I get a lucky to end the fight quickly.

Tricks

Ledge clip

Similarly to Partners in Time, if Mario and Luigi stack under a low ceiling, they warp upwards. The only use in the run is to skip the air balloon tutorial.

Ledge boost

Mario can get a boost when walking off a ledge. The size of the boost depends on the angle of movement relative to the angle of the ledge and the distance to the ledge the frame before walking off it.

Toad boost

When entering an NPC's hitbox from above, Mario is boosted out of its hitbox.

Special thanks

Thanks to Hibari for getting a great WR. This was a good base for my routing.
Thanks to the M&L community for the support everytime I released a WIP.

Memory: Claiming for judging
Memory: Delaying until we can figure out what to do with the microphone input.
Memory: I think we have the microphone thing settled, now back to judging.
Memory: Updated file to have sample included
Memory: Optimization is for the most part good. There was one timesaver found 9 years ago by me that saved like 15 seconds that was completely forgotten for some reason and one new timesaver that was discovered long after submission but these things are not worth rejecting over in a nearly 5 hour run.
To me, the movie was not extremely entertaining but I feel I am a little biased in that regard due to my personal history with the game. There isn't too much flashy, but there are some clever moments here and there and some good movement when it comes to avoiding encounters. The game is extremely popular and the movie got all but one yes vote, leading me to believe I am the outliar in this case.
There was a code used to skip a section that otherwise consists of waiting for an arbitrary amount of time. This code can be found in game through normal means and was agreed to be considered intended normal play.
A modified release of desmume was created to be able to store microphone samples in movie files. We now request runs using microphone use this release from here on.
Accepting to Moons.
Not Spikestuff: Here lies Spikestuff he died Publishing this.

Memory
She/Her
Site Admin, Skilled player (1522)
Joined: 3/20/2014
Posts: 1762
Location: Dumpster
ais523 wrote:
I think it's reasonable to treat a microphone like a controller; any sound that the microphone is capable of picking up seems like valid input to me (as a user sitting at the console could input it via making the right sounds). In fact, it's considerably more legitimate than things like left+right (which couldn't be input without damage to the console). This is different from, say, expansion port input, as creating your own expansion cards is not part of normal play and not an intended input method.
The problem isn't legitimacy but reproducibility.
[16:36:31] <Mothrayas> I have to say this argument about robot drug usage is a lot more fun than whatever else we have been doing in the past two+ hours
[16:08:10] <BenLubar> a TAS is just the limit of a segmented speedrun as the segment length approaches zero
creaothceann
He/Him
Editor
Joined: 4/7/2005
Posts: 1874
Location: Germany
If the input is recorded, how can it not be reproduced? (And yes, put it into the input file. It's already many MB, a few more won't hurt.)
Site Admin, Skilled player (1236)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11264
Location: RU
As I said, it can be put in the movie only if it's small enough. Another problem is that emulators don't include such data into movies.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Site Admin, Skilled player (1236)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11264
Location: RU
feos wrote:
So we really encourage everyone to ask for help with this everywhere they can, if they care about this submission.
And apparently no one does anymore?
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
vince1919
He/Him
Player (86)
Joined: 10/4/2015
Posts: 76
Location: Quebec, Canada
I just created an empty audio file. I'll see if it syncs, but it did work in the mic test menu. EDIT: I trimmed the file I used and fire attacks still work but now the run desyncs.
Site Admin, Skilled player (1236)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11264
Location: RU
Here's what I got. I trimmed the file in half and the attack happened, but the movie instantly desynced. I extended the sample twice and got the same result. Checked with other desmume sound options and random noise resulted in working attack with wrong duration (and movie desync), and internal desmume sample resulted in no attack. My preliminary conclusion. The author does exactly what the game expects. NDS console has a microphone, the game explicitly tells you to blow into it, then it processes the input somehow and triggers the blow attack, whose duration is apparently dependent on duration of your blow input. Desmume does not put this peripheral input into movies. It doesn't even attach it in any way like other emulators attach save files to movies. Doesn't even flag the movie as something that requires a sound sample. What desmume does: in the menu, you select what sample to use whenever a game asks for sound input. That's all. You can change this on the fly at any time, the movie doesn't care. So what should we do? We should respect gameplay requirements and the author's effort to follow them precisely. Maybe there's some way to trick the game by using unintended things here, but that's up to whoever discovers and abuses this. But how do we handle this, since the movie can't possibly include this data, unless we hack the emulator? There's only one way - we host it on the site separately. Can this set a complicated precedent? Of course it can! If a game requires us to feed it copyrighted audio, we're screwed. So all we can do here is dealing with such cases as exceptions, case-by-case.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Emulator Coder
Joined: 3/9/2004
Posts: 4588
Location: In his lab studying psychology to find new ways to torture TASers and forumers
If additional input needs to occur, it must be part of the movie file.
Warning: Opinions expressed by Nach or others in this post do not necessarily reflect the views, opinions, or position of Nach himself on the matter(s) being discussed therein.
Memory
She/Her
Site Admin, Skilled player (1522)
Joined: 3/20/2014
Posts: 1762
Location: Dumpster
Nach wrote:
If additional input needs to occur, it must be part of the movie file.
Can't, desmume doesn't support it.
[16:36:31] <Mothrayas> I have to say this argument about robot drug usage is a lot more fun than whatever else we have been doing in the past two+ hours
[16:08:10] <BenLubar> a TAS is just the limit of a segmented speedrun as the segment length approaches zero
Emulator Coder
Joined: 3/9/2004
Posts: 4588
Location: In his lab studying psychology to find new ways to torture TASers and forumers
Memory wrote:
Nach wrote:
If additional input needs to occur, it must be part of the movie file.
Can't, desmume doesn't support it.
Then fix it.
Warning: Opinions expressed by Nach or others in this post do not necessarily reflect the views, opinions, or position of Nach himself on the matter(s) being discussed therein.
Site Admin, Skilled player (1236)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11264
Location: RU
You mean to avoid hosting the sample separately, we prefer to host the patched emulator separately? Because we can't count on this "fix" being released officially (ever), and this movie needs an older desmume version.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Emulator Coder
Joined: 3/9/2004
Posts: 4588
Location: In his lab studying psychology to find new ways to torture TASers and forumers
I don't understand why you're asking any of this. Game input must be in the movie file, if it isn't, it's invalid. If there's a problem with the emulator not recording something, then the emulator needs to be fixed. Excuses do not change the requirements.
Warning: Opinions expressed by Nach or others in this post do not necessarily reflect the views, opinions, or position of Nach himself on the matter(s) being discussed therein.
Memory
She/Her
Site Admin, Skilled player (1522)
Joined: 3/20/2014
Posts: 1762
Location: Dumpster
Nach wrote:
I don't understand why you're asking any of this. Game input must be in the movie file, if it isn't, it's invalid. If there's a problem with the emulator not recording something, then the emulator needs to be fixed. Excuses do not change the requirements.
Desmume does record the input of using an audio sample into the movie file. It merely does not specify which sample in the movie file itself. It is merely considered an emulator setting instead of a unique input.
[16:36:31] <Mothrayas> I have to say this argument about robot drug usage is a lot more fun than whatever else we have been doing in the past two+ hours
[16:08:10] <BenLubar> a TAS is just the limit of a segmented speedrun as the segment length approaches zero
Site Admin, Skilled player (1236)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11264
Location: RU
Nach wrote:
Excuses do not change the requirements.
Where are you seeing excuses?
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Emulator Coder
Joined: 3/9/2004
Posts: 4588
Location: In his lab studying psychology to find new ways to torture TASers and forumers
feos wrote:
Nach wrote:
Excuses do not change the requirements.
Where are you seeing excuses?
Memory wrote:
Nach wrote:
If additional input needs to occur, it must be part of the movie file.
Can't, desmume doesn't support it.
feos wrote:
Because we can't count on this "fix" being released officially (ever), and this movie needs an older desmume version.
Warning: Opinions expressed by Nach or others in this post do not necessarily reflect the views, opinions, or position of Nach himself on the matter(s) being discussed therein.
Site Admin, Skilled player (1236)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11264
Location: RU
If you want a movie rule "Audio samples not contained in movie files for desmume are not allowed", feel free to add it, but I'm not in favor it that, because the judge guidelines say:
Be fair A judge has the greatest control over the content of this website in the long run. All judges must act towards the goal of having an encouraging and rewarding atmosphere for both the players and the audience. You must be fair towards both.
There wasn't such a requirement when this run was made. Rejecting this movie because of an oversight in the emulator design (that's otherwise approved for submissions) would be neither rewarding nor encouraging, because there are no guarantees a fixed desmume is ever released. If you want tasvideos to host an unofficial desmume fork, state so clearly, because it is exactly what I asked. Assuming excuses doesn't help the problem.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Memory
She/Her
Site Admin, Skilled player (1522)
Joined: 3/20/2014
Posts: 1762
Location: Dumpster
While I do not see any rule that all input must be stored in the movie file, I do see this rule:
Any important settings not saved in the movie file must be stated in the submission text
This submission has done as such: the usage of an external sample is treated by desmume as a microphone setting and the author has used this setting as intended. I see 0 rules broken here.
[16:36:31] <Mothrayas> I have to say this argument about robot drug usage is a lot more fun than whatever else we have been doing in the past two+ hours
[16:08:10] <BenLubar> a TAS is just the limit of a segmented speedrun as the segment length approaches zero
Memory
She/Her
Site Admin, Skilled player (1522)
Joined: 3/20/2014
Posts: 1762
Location: Dumpster
While a solution for the audio sample issue is being worked out, I've watched about half the TAS so far. Mind I ask why you used jumps on Wisdurm's tail instead of green shells on the body? I know you can completely drain Wisdurm's meter with two green shells. Would the attacks Durmite perform be slower than the attacks from Wisdurm? Also I'm glad the meat strategy I found for Midbus back in 2010 is still used.
[16:36:31] <Mothrayas> I have to say this argument about robot drug usage is a lot more fun than whatever else we have been doing in the past two+ hours
[16:08:10] <BenLubar> a TAS is just the limit of a segmented speedrun as the segment length approaches zero
vince1919
He/Him
Player (86)
Joined: 10/4/2015
Posts: 76
Location: Quebec, Canada
I based my route off the WR so I didn't think of another strat. I just timed it and it's around 15 seconds faster than the original strat.
Memory
She/Her
Site Admin, Skilled player (1522)
Joined: 3/20/2014
Posts: 1762
Location: Dumpster
vince1919 wrote:
I based my route off the WR so I didn't think of another strat. I just timed it and it's around 15 seconds faster than the original strat.
Wait the shell strat or the jumping strat?
[16:36:31] <Mothrayas> I have to say this argument about robot drug usage is a lot more fun than whatever else we have been doing in the past two+ hours
[16:08:10] <BenLubar> a TAS is just the limit of a segmented speedrun as the segment length approaches zero
vince1919
He/Him
Player (86)
Joined: 10/4/2015
Posts: 76
Location: Quebec, Canada
The shell strat.
Memory
She/Her
Site Admin, Skilled player (1522)
Joined: 3/20/2014
Posts: 1762
Location: Dumpster
It's weird because Anwonu did the shell strat in his runs back in the day, not sure why the wr didn't use it. EDIT: Could it also potentially be faster to get Fury off Wiggler or would that not result in any fewer cycles?
[16:36:31] <Mothrayas> I have to say this argument about robot drug usage is a lot more fun than whatever else we have been doing in the past two+ hours
[16:08:10] <BenLubar> a TAS is just the limit of a segmented speedrun as the segment length approaches zero
vince1919
He/Him
Player (86)
Joined: 10/4/2015
Posts: 76
Location: Quebec, Canada
It would take too long to setup. The only fight where it's worth using is blizzard midbus.
Site Admin, Skilled player (1236)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11264
Location: RU
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Site Admin, Skilled player (1236)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11264
Location: RU
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
EZGames69
He/They
Publisher, Reviewer, Expert player (3965)
Joined: 5/29/2017
Posts: 2707
Location: Michigan
Hurray!
[14:15] <feos> WinDOES what DOSn't 12:33:44 PM <Mothrayas> "I got an oof with my game!" Mothrayas Today at 12:22: <Colin> thank you for supporting noble causes such as my feet MemoryTAS Today at 11:55 AM: you wouldn't know beauty if it slapped you in the face with a giant fish [Today at 4:51 PM] Mothrayas: although if you like your own tweets that's the online equivalent of sniffing your own farts and probably tells a lot about you as a person MemoryTAS Today at 7:01 PM: But I exert big staff energy honestly lol Samsara Today at 1:20 PM: wouldn't ACE in a real life TAS just stand for Actually Cease Existing