Submission Text Full Submission Page
About the game:
Once upon a time, there was a game called Hardcore.
It was developed by Digital Illusions (nowdays DICE) for the Amiga platform. DI wanted to prove that they could compete with a technical marvel like Turrican by creating a similar game. However, halfway through development they decided to cancel the game for the already dying Amiga and port it over to the more thriving Mega Drive.
Unfortunately when the game was 95% finished Psygnosis, the publisher (which was bought by Sony and turned into Sony Europe) decided to get out of the 16bit consoles and cancelled it, as they wanted to concentrate more on the upcoming CD based systems like PlayStation and Saturn.
Fast forward to 2018 when Strictly Limited Games managed to get the rights to the title and released it as Ultracore, (Hardcore was already taken) first for the Mega-SG as a pack-in game and later as a standalone release for Mega Drive, PS4 and Switch. Ultracore is the final bugfixed and upgraded release of Hardcore featuring better controls and various other improvements.
Background info:
I was involved in the process of getting this game released and helped in terms of testing and design, so currently there is no other person in the world that knows this game better.
This is also the reason why I picked the PAL version for this run. While there is an US/JP release that runs at 60fps, those are basically "bad" ports, making the game run too fast and cutting off parts of the screen that are crucial!
Becasue of that, the PAL version is the only one that should be used for speedruns!
Game Objectives:
The game is a typical 90s Jump'n'Shoot where the only goal is to get through the levels by killing anything on sight. However, unlike Turrican, there is a few elements that make this game abit more complicated. For one there is doorcards that the player needs to pick up to unlock specific doors. Those doors can also be unlocked via computer terminals that can be found in almost all levels. In two instances you have to enter terminal codes that you find during a level.
For a full 100% walkthrough showing everything the game has to offer, check out my longplay here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GER6szPPp6A
It should be useful to anyone that is interested in running this game!
Run Info:
The run was done with Bizhawk 2.40 GIT #16f5da9
The objective was to get through the game as fast as possible.
This run doesnt use any glitches, as currently there arent any known!
One thing you want to avoid in this game is dying - as that takes quite abit of time!
Watch the speedrun here: https://youtu.be/gNQWSR_TN10
Here are some explanations about this run:
00:02:43:50 - Getting the weapon from the weapon box here might be worth it due to higher damage output.
00:03:06:20 - Here I do a tiny backtour to get the weapon upgrade for the main weapon as that helps killing enemies faster
00:03:22:80 - I could have landed on the ledges there to fall down without taking damage. However due to the walker enemy at the bottom I thought falling down all the way and taking the stun damage (in return for temp invincibility) is faster than doing it without damage and getting hit by the walker afterwards.
00:03:31:00 - Maybe there is a faster way here to get the security card without taking the long way around?
00:05:20:50 - If you drop down here, there is another weapon upgrade, I did not try and see if its worth the backtour that might help beating the game faster due to higher damage to later bosses and enemies.
00:05:45:60 - To the right here you see a little gap in the floor. This is the earliest instance where one can acquire the rocket launcher, the strongest weapon in the game. I did not test if a backtour here would save more time in the long run. Maybe getting it together with the weapon upgrade mentioned above could be worth it!
00:05:52:50 - Maybe using the platforms is actually faster than using the enemy here?
00:07:05:00 - Once you touch the door, the game takes over and walks you back automatically. You cant control that.
00:09:55:00 - Jumping here I think is faster than taking damage. But I did not measure it!
00:11:25:00 - The laser-cannons can hit each other for lots of damage. Getting the rocket launcher earlier in the game will beat this boss alot faster.
00:15:51:20 - A backtrack here to make the boss jump, as getting them squashed is by far the fastest way to beat them. If you go near them too fast, there is a good chance they jump out again!
00:18:02:00 - Getting the rocket launcher earlier in the game will probably beat this boss alot faster.
00:22:45:00 - The screen stops scrolling until you destroyed this cannon.
00:23:09:40 - Landing on top of an enemy after a long fall prevents fall-stun and damage
00:24:15:60 - If you dont wait here, you will get squashed, but maybe dying and respawning resets the trap and you can run through faster?
00:24:49:00 - If you dont wait here, you will get squashed, but maybe dying and respawning resets the trap and you can run through faster?
00:25:22:00 - I take a little detour here to get the Rocket Launcher, it might have been better to get it earlier in the game.
00:25:50:40 - Waiting here for a few frames to get the ideal bullet pattern to drop down from ledge to ledge. This seems to be faster than just dropping down and being stunned for a while.
00:26:49:40 - jumping backwards here to catch the plattform to use at as a launcher for jumping momentum
00:27:34:00 - For this boss there doesnt seem to be any way to speed it up.
00:30:54:00 - In the NTSC version the trash floating above the boss is not visible and outside of the screen!
00:33:35:00 - Shooting the boss here is pointless, it doesnt do anything!
Last Words:
This run is probably not perfect, but hey someone needs to start somewhere!
I'm pretty sure with some of the optimizations and suggestions I gave above, it can be pushed to under 30 minutes!
While I wont have the time to do this myself, I´m sure someone else will step up to the challenge :)
Memory: Judging
Memory: Hello ScHlAuChi and welcome to TASVideos. Here on TASVideos we aim for perfect movies... or at the very least as close as one can get. Your movie has some decently noticeable flaws in it that lead me to believe you mostly played this in real time with save states rather then using frame advance or some tool like TAStudio. Without looking at the input file I was able to notice missed shots against bosses when really you should be making every shot count. With emulation tools people have been able to find much more mistakes such as sloppy menus etc. While the attempt is appreciated, this isn't an acceptable level of play for a publication for TASVideos. In the future I would recommend taking advantage of our forums and our userfiles hosting for uploading wips.
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Posted: 7/27/2020 8:03 PM
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TASVideoAgent
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This topic is for the purpose of discussing #6824: ScHlAuChi's Genesis Ultracore in 35:13.36
Posted: 7/27/2020 11:35 PM
Post subject: Re: #6824: ScHlAuChi's Genesis Ultracore in 35:13.36
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Samsara
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Homebrew TAS of 2023 Exotic platforms TAS of 2020 Sega TAS of 2016
Oh, sick, Longplay/TAS crossover! So this is what it's like when worlds collide! I'm watching the run right now and seeing a few immediate, though relatively minor issues. The TAS feels more like a really good RTA run as opposed to something clearly tool-assisted, which gives me some doubts about the overall optimization of the run. The submission notes don't really help either, with most of it being variations of "This could be faster, but I didn't try it". The movement looks good, but I'd have to look closer at the actual game to be able to tell for sure, and good movement doesn't mean optimized if there are routing improvements like the submission text seems to be suggesting. There's already a 9 frame faster WIP that's been posted on Discord. Of course, that's a matter of a handful of frames. Now, as I understand it, this submission is meant to expose people to the game and attract people to TASing it, rather than actually providing an optimized run. I do appreciate that in a way, submissions tend to get a lot more notice than anything else on the site, but there are other methods of exposure without needing to submit: You can make a thread on the forums for the game, and upload WIPs, test runs, or even full game runs like this to the site's userfiles system to show people. My main point of concern is this, though (emphasis mine):
TASVideoAgent wrote:
This is also the reason why I picked the PAL version for this run. While there is an US/JP release that runs at 60fps, those are basically "bad" ports, making the game run too fast and cutting off parts of the screen that are crucial! Becasue of that, the PAL version is the only one that should be used for speedruns!
Could you explain this further? Our rules state that NTSC is almost always preferred unless PAL runs at 60fps (which isn't the case here), has version-exclusive glitches that allow for a much different looking run (which I don't know about with this game), or if it's the only released version of the game (which also doesn't seem too be the case here). If I'm reading that line about "cutting off parts of the screen" correctly, not being able to see as much of the screen doesn't matter at all for a TAS, and isn't enough of a difference to justify using PAL, but since I've never heard of this game until the submission, perhaps there are more specific differences that you know about that could warrant it.
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warmCabin wrote:
You shouldn't need a degree in computer science to get into this hobby.
Posted: 7/28/2020 1:06 AM
(Edited: 7/28/2020 10:56 AM)
Post subject: Re: #6824: ScHlAuChi's Genesis Ultracore in 35:13.36
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ScHlAuChi
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Samsara wrote:
Oh, sick, Longplay/TAS crossover! So this is what it's like when worlds collide!
Not really collide, as we are on the same side, just different goals ;)
I'm watching the run right now and seeing a few immediate, though relatively minor issues. The TAS feels more like a really good RTA run as opposed to something clearly tool-assisted, which gives me some doubts about the overall optimization of the run.
Yeah it isnt really perfect, it is meant to be a start for others to optimize!
The submission notes don't really help either, with most of it being variations of "This could be faster, but I didn't try it". The movement looks good, but I'd have to look closer at the actual game to be able to tell for sure, and good movement doesn't mean optimized if there are routing improvements like the submission text seems to be suggesting.
Well to be fair, I could have just left out any of those potential improvement suggestions and let people figure out the game themselves. But I think it would be counter productive to hide those suggestions when it can help another runner to do something better!
There's already a 9 frame faster WIP that's been posted on Discord. Of course, that's a matter of a handful of frames.
Thats exactly what I was hoping for, other people improving on it! 9 frames are 9 frames! ;)
Now, as I understand it, this submission is meant to expose people to the game and attract people to TASing it, rather than actually providing an optimized run. I do appreciate that in a way, submissions tend to get a lot more notice than anything else on the site.
That was the idea!
My main point of concern is this, though (emphasis mine): Could you explain this further? Our rules state that NTSC is almost always preferred unless PAL runs at 60fps
It means the game was never made for NTSC to begin with. Being developed originally for the Amiga - a 50Hz PAL computer - it was only created for that, before it was ported over to the Mega Drive. The US/JP ROMS are basically just quick hacks to make them work on those systems. But not only do they run faster than the developers intended it, they also render less of the map, which means some of the gameplay elements disappear. Before the final boss, you use a lever to drop pieces of metal on a walking robot, in the NTSC version those pieces are invisible. It makes following the gameplay really hard - there is a few other small instances of this problem. Here is a video of the NTSC version: https://youtu.be/niqNranTs5U So the only "true" official version is the PAL release, and its quite likely the game would have only released in Europe if it didnt get cancelled back then. But maybe that doesnt matter for TAS`es? Are PAL only releases that were hacked to NTSC allowed as runs - like say something like Probotector?
Posted: 7/28/2020 1:15 AM
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CoolHandMike
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Posted: 7/28/2020 2:04 AM
Post subject: Re: #6824: ScHlAuChi's Genesis Ultracore in 35:13.36
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Samsara
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ScHlAuChi wrote:
So the only "true" official version is the PAL release, and its quite likely the game would have only released in Europe if it didnt get cancelled back then. But maybe that doesnt matter for TAS`es? Are PAL only releases that were hacked to NTSC allowed as runs - like say something like Probotector?
The case of a PAL only game being ROMhacked to run at 60fps would not be allowed. In that case, we would just take the original PAL game at 50fps. The issue here comes from the fact that the NTSC ports were officially released, and judging from your explanation (thank you for that, by the way!), it's actually a less cut-and-dry issue than I anticipated. Our version rules are here, but there isn't a specific case for games that were made for PAL that got ported to an NTSC region. The technical issues and the official releases make it a tricky case to judge. PAL's obviously the intended, superior version, but NTSC doesn't appear to be inferior enough to warrant convincing people out of using... Plus, there's the whole thing about Ufouria being on the (E) version despite a 60fps (J) version existing, without any other noticeable differences... I'm still leaning towards NTSC being preferred, here, but I can see it going either way. Hackjob or not, NTSC is still an official release. It could lead to a more entertaining run: I always preferred TASes that were harder to follow, personally, so those technical mishaps might lead in to that.
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warmCabin wrote:
You shouldn't need a degree in computer science to get into this hobby.
Posted: 7/28/2020 2:37 PM
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KennyMan666
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I feel like some of the issue is that the rule was probably more or less written under the assumption that the NTSC version is always the original version. Which is usually the case - the NTSC version is the original version running at intended speed, while the PAL version is a conversion running at incorrect speed. In this case it's the opposite, the PAL version is the original version running at intended speed, while the NTSC version is a conversion running at incorrect speed. I would say that the rules page itself supports this choice with its three listed aspects for choosing which version to use:
The first dictates that the original (chronologically first to be released) version should be preferred.
As far as I can tell, all versions were released simultaneously. But the operative phrase here should be original version, and as this game was developed for a PAL-only system, it's indisputable that the PAL version is the original.
The second dictates that the more popular (more widely spread and/or recognized among the audience) version should be preferred.
Given that the game is fairly new, the most available version being the digital Switch and PS4 release that came out last month, I don't think there's a concrete answer for this one yet. But retro enthusiasts tend to value accuracy the most, which in this case would support the PAL version.
The third dictates that the superior (such as having expanded content, better graphics or music, more glitches, less lag or shorter loading times) version should be preferred.
The NTSC version runs at incorrect speed and has an incorrect screen size. The PAL version is clearly the superior one here. The idea behind the rule, I'm pretty sure, is that the original and most accurate version is the prefered one. Which, indeed, almost all of the time is the NTSC version. But when the PAL version is the original and also technically superior one of the two, while the NTSC version is a sped up conversion, it shouldn't go against the spirit of the rule at all to choose PAL.
Det man inte har i begåvning får man ta ut i energi. "I think I need to get to Snoop Dogg's level of high to be able to research this post." -Samsara Read my fanfic, One Piece: Pure Corruption
Posted: 7/28/2020 4:18 PM
(Edited: 7/28/2020 4:53 PM)
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ScHlAuChi
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KennyMan666 wrote:
Given that the game is fairly new, the most available version being the digital Switch and PS4 release that came out last month, I don't think there's a concrete answer for this one yet. But retro enthusiasts tend to value accuracy the most, which in this case would support the PAL version.
I can answer this one - both Switch and PS4 versions use the PAL ROM. The Mega-SG uses the NTSC ROM. However, I just checked the NTSC version again, and it wasnt as bad as I remembered: So I think its actually fine to use it if it means faster runs. *Edit* For some reason the screenshots dont show up, but they work...
Posted: 7/28/2020 4:46 PM
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KennyMan666
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Oh, huh. Then NTSC actually was the first released version, so that is an argument in favour of that one. I still think PAL counts as the original version here, though. And if the NTSC version is only available for the Mega SG and the physical Mega Drive release, then the PAL version is absolutely the one most widely available and will be the most known.
Det man inte har i begåvning får man ta ut i energi. "I think I need to get to Snoop Dogg's level of high to be able to research this post." -Samsara Read my fanfic, One Piece: Pure Corruption
Posted: 7/28/2020 5:00 PM
(Edited: 7/28/2020 5:17 PM)
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ScHlAuChi
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KennyMan666 wrote:
Oh, huh. Then NTSC actually was the first released version, so that is an argument in favour of that one. I still think PAL counts as the original version here, though. And if the NTSC version is only available for the Mega SG and the physical Mega Drive release, then the PAL version is absolutely the one most widely available and will be the most known.
The Mega-SG version was released first, but it differs quite abit from the final release: -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- - you can carry only 1 of the special weapons (in the final you can carry and switch between all 6) - weapon upgrades arent permanent (in the final they are as can be seen with the little + signs on the weapon icons) - the timer can overflow (in the final its limited to 999) - some secret areas are missing (they were added to have more rewards for exploration) - slightly different controls (Mega-SG is more Contra style, Final more how it was intended) Only the Mega Drive / Genesis ROM Dumps are final and should be used. So while the NTSC version is probably fine to be used for TAS and might mean faster runs, the PAL is still the original tho.
Posted: 7/28/2020 5:02 PM
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feos
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Example of PAL original: #6358: TommyeAsY's PSX Hogs of War in 52:46.73
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Posted: 7/29/2020 6:44 AM
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CasualPokePlayer
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So I did Level 1 of this game, and was able to improve it by 268 frames. A lot was just optimizing movement, in particular, stopping less to shoot enemies, occasionally with some luck manipulation. I also decided to grab the first door card before flipping the switch (this lets me kill some enemies in the way that I would have to go through anyways to flip the switch, enemies that simply won't die fast enough and would force the player to take damage if they were taken head on, so best soften them up). I believe this can be further improved (in particular, I want to explore the Laser Rifle in the box and see if it warrants the time it takes to pick it up). Also, the menuing in this submission is sloppy as hell (menuing being the keypads and cutscenes mostly). Those parts at the very least should of really been done in TAStudio. encode: https://youtu.be/_0uaoteVRgM bk2: http://tasvideos.org/userfiles/info/65022029841809440 Also, somewhat unrelated, but in making this TAS, I discovered a glitch that essentially locked the game in an infinite loop. For context on this glitch, when the game loads something (cutscenes, new area, etc), there is 1 non-lag frame within the score of lag frames, and pressing buttons on that frame can affect the player when the thing is loaded. For the glitch itself, on the commander cutscene, I pressed Start on that 1 non-lag frame. FOR WHATEVER REASON, THIS LOCKS THE GAME IN AN INFINITE LOOP! Maybe this could become some GEG, but I don't really understand whatever ASM the Genesis uses so I wouldn't know how to really do it.
Posted: 7/29/2020 11:57 AM
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ScHlAuChi
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CasualPokePlayer wrote:
So I did Level 1 of this game, and was able to improve it by 268 frames.
This is exactly what I was hoping for, a TAS pro doing it properly. This already looks way better than mine! Good job! At 2:50 you jump to the right, is that so you can avoid damage? You can just walk off that plattform and land on the lower one without taking damage, as can be seen here: https://youtu.be/GER6szPPp6A?t=655 Maybe thats faster?
I want to explore the Laser Rifle in the box and see if it warrants the time it takes to pick it up). Also, the menuing in this submission is sloppy as hell (menuing being the keypads and cutscenes mostly). Those parts at the very least should of really been done in TAStudio.
I am pretty sure the laser rifle will be worth it in the long run due to the higher damage output especially against bossts.
Also, somewhat unrelated, but in making this TAS, I discovered a glitch that essentially locked the game in an infinite loop.
Ah yes, I had that also during my run. If I remember correctly it was a very hard bug to fix, so it was left in due to the low chance of hitting it.
Posted: 7/29/2020 12:32 PM
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Samsara
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Psst... A thread for this game should be made to discuss further strategies/improvements.
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warmCabin wrote:
You shouldn't need a degree in computer science to get into this hobby.
Posted: 8/4/2020 4:43 PM
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TASVideosGrue
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om, nom, nom... sweet!