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Posted: 12/8/2006 12:29 AM
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Comicalflop
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Location: Massachussetts, USA
Speedy TAS of 2009
I just redid Kirby Stage, making sure every Cutter was aerial, and ended up with 2 seconds slower and no hawk bonus, so no Hawk is available in this stage by using the projectile part of cutter which is what I did. Using the sword part of Cutter will not work, because hitting them up does not cause them to die forcing me to do it many many times, the only way is if I can spike them into the bottom of the screen which would waste time because they do not float beyond the boundaries of the bottom platform unless hit there. So the first .m64 I posted is the highest score in the lowest time. Anyone have suggestions for Samus stage? antd, any ideas? I'm thinking of getting Hawk, Star Finish, and Acid clear, but using down air drill and stone to rack up damage, then at the optimal moment use a cutter spike to send Samus straight down into the Lava, and then have her have enough damage% to fall into the background, as opposed to psychoticworm's first vid where Samus was beaten using smash a as afst as possible.
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Posted: 12/8/2006 12:47 AM
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laughing_gas
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Is it possible to keep Samus pinned down if you do the jump+Down A attack a bunch of times in succession?
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Posted: 12/8/2006 1:00 AM
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thegreginator
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Yes, for optimal damage you would probably do the aerial down a several times followed by some juggling with up tilt a. Stone would be a bad idea because that sends him flying so you have to go chase him to do more damage to him. I would guess you could beat him by: down drill, down drill (maybe third down drill), up tilt juggling, then hit or spike him inot the lava, star finish.
Posted: 12/8/2006 1:16 AM
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Comicalflop
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Speedy TAS of 2009
up tilt juggling nullifies hawk since it's on the ground, that's the thing, other wise that'd be best. I found that with Z-cancelling you can actually prevent opponents from being knocked away by down+a aerial, especialy if it's an optimal drill that starts near the ground and barely finishes before touching the ground. What I'm most concerned about is, what % damage does Samus need to be to fall into the background after hitting the plasma?
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Posted: 12/8/2006 2:10 AM
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laughing_gas
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I think she has to have at least 90% damage. EDIT: Actually it depends on how high the lava is. If it is all the way at the bottom then she needs over 110% damage, and if it is at the very top then she only needs around 80%. It also depends on whether she dies off the side or the top of the screen.
Borg Collective wrote:
Negotiation is irrelevant. Self-determination is irrelevant. You will be assimilated.
Posted: 12/8/2006 2:40 AM
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Comicalflop
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Speedy TAS of 2009
I just made a test run of Samus, 16 seconds, getting star finish, no item, hawk, speedster, no miss x8, no damage, full power, smashless, fighter stance, acid clear, with a final score of 1201151. I tested how many air drills it took to clear Samus, I did 3 down drill and did a back kick then cutter, and she came back down, so I tried 4 down drill, then back kick then cutter, and she died. So 4 is optimal. I must admit, I was suprised at the power of a tool assisted drill attack. I think the final cutter can be improved to save one second, as it took a few tries and Samus was either dodging or using her VERY annoying up+b, so I just noodled around until I could kill her to see the score, so I can probably shave off one second with an optimal cutter. This was SO much easier to do than Kirby/Yoshi Team, I did in in probably less than 10 minutes. and thegreginator, I'm sure it'll satisfy your action needs. vs. Samus .m64
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Posted: 12/8/2006 3:22 AM
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Comicalflop
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Did a bunch of testing and Samus is not going down any faster, so she's done. got 4:58 Metal Mario. Score: 1352051 vs. Metal Mario 4:58
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Posted: 12/8/2006 3:36 AM
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laughing_gas
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Very nice. BTW, what is the non-TAS world record for Kirby? I remember it was somewhere in this thread but I couldn't find it.
Borg Collective wrote:
Negotiation is irrelevant. Self-determination is irrelevant. You will be assimilated.
Posted: 12/8/2006 3:42 AM
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Comicalflop
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non-TAS record for what? be a little specific. psychoticworm's best vid IS tool assisted, but his non assisted is 1.8 mil. His highest tool asisted is 2.4 mil, I'm hoping to get at least 2.5 or higher. I hope that was what you were looking for. Thanks for your Metal Mario AVI by the way, I'm sure I beat it by many frames because it seems like the in-game counter just barely hit 4:58, I unfortunately couldn't squeeze any more time out of it. Since I'm getting pretty close to the end, I'd like to open the discussion for fighting Ness or not. Pros: More action, the credits get to be passed very fast which is entertaining, gives Kirby/Fox the chance for one last fight, plus a great chance to do some awesome comboing/showing off. Not that there isn't plenty in the stages :P Cons: Greatly descreases from a solid ending, since technically, beating the Master Hand IS the end, and Ness is a bonus. The credits will roll and it goes to "INCREDIBLE!!" and will actually stay that way unless a button is pressed, thus for encoders prevents from accidentily going to the Ness fight.
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Posted: 12/8/2006 3:46 AM
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laughing_gas
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the non-TAS world record for high score. I thought I saw 2.3 mil on some website, but that seems excessive.
Borg Collective wrote:
Negotiation is irrelevant. Self-determination is irrelevant. You will be assimilated.
Posted: 12/8/2006 3:52 AM
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Comicalflop
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2.3 is what psychoticworm got on his first tool asisted vid, before he beat it again. TwinGalaxies has psychoticworm's 1.8 mil on the site. Any thoughts on Ness fight? yes or no, and reasons?
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Posted: 12/8/2006 3:56 AM
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laughing_gas
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I would like to see it, but this time make it pure speed since you don't get any points from it. It would be sort of like an encore.
Borg Collective wrote:
Negotiation is irrelevant. Self-determination is irrelevant. You will be assimilated.
Posted: 12/8/2006 4:20 AM
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Comicalflop
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To me, an encore would be not fastest way to beat Ness, because like the Fox vs. Ness fight it'd be boring, but rather to rack up as much %damage as possible, while keeping Ness alive for some killer combo. I'm still against including it however. I just did some rough calculations, at the rate I'm going I am going to easily reach 2.5 million, assuming score wise I don't improve on the next 3 stages, although I most definetly will. 2.6 mil I'm not sure, but it'd be cool if it was possible.
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Posted: 12/8/2006 4:38 AM
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thegreginator
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At first I kind of wanted to see the Ness fight, but now that you mention it, the fight would take a way from a nice solid ending. So count me down for no on the Ness fight. Also, any chance of an AVI/YouTube for Samus and Metal Mario?
Posted: 12/8/2006 5:06 AM
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Comicalflop
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I've kinda fallen behind on the WMV/youtubes of the everything from the latest BtP stage and after. I have some homework that needs doing, so not tonight, but tomorrow I'll see if I can get those 4 stages some WMV's and get them uploaded to youtube. And speaking of which, the weekend is coming up = the run should be finished by then. Hopefully antd will get back to his fastest completion soon so that we can submit together. That will of course give me lots of time to perfect my Master Hand Fight.
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Posted: 12/8/2006 5:46 AM
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Comicalflop
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Race to the Finish done, saving 2 seconds compared to psychoticworm's. Race to the Finish 0:37 Score: 138551
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Posted: 12/8/2006 12:14 PM
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Macman
Joined: 11/16/2006
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Don't do the Ness fight, but do blaze by the credits and target as many of them as you can while going through them that fast.
Signature under contruction, still.
Posted: 12/8/2006 3:31 PM
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Comicalflop
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No, I can't do both of those. It's either fast credits + Ness fight or normal credits + No Ness fight. Not from a technical standpoint, in that it's not possible, but it A) increases the frame length of the movie, you're supposed to end on the first possible frame and B) makes the ending WAY short, the credits should roll in full.
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Posted: 12/8/2006 3:56 PM
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psychoticworm
Joined: 11/30/2006
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Awesome run so far, I like the way you handled Samus. Good luck on Polygon Team! Can't wait to see the final score of your run, looks great!
Posted: 12/8/2006 4:28 PM
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Comicalflop
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Thanks. Kirby's down drill was difficult to control, but once I got the hang of it it turned out great. My only complaint is that once samus is that high damage there is no way to send her to the left of the screen in less distance while keeping hawk- even a normal a tap sent her flying off the screen. I also wish I could spike her faster, but it didn't work. as I mentioned earlier, projected final score is 2.5+ million. Should be done by this weekend if all goes well. Edit: I just tested something- the mistake I mentioned in the intro screen for Mario Bros. is not a mistake. Any intro screen with allies naturally takes a little bit longer, as is evident by the DK intro screen, with allies. I turboed A and Start optimally, and it took the same amount of time, so no mistake there. I'm starting to make AVI's of the 4 latest stages, so I'll get those up today.
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Posted: 12/8/2006 8:02 PM
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Comicalflop
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BtP v2 WMV vs. Kirby stage WMV vs. Samus WMV vs. Metal Mario Race to the Finish I'll get some youtube links up later, it takes a while for those to upload.
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Posted: 12/8/2006 8:17 PM
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antd
Joined: 3/18/2006
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I'm going to do a little work on my run today. Gives me a reason to use my new computer.
Posted: 12/8/2006 9:16 PM
(Edited: 12/8/2006 10:45 PM)
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Comicalflop
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Speedy TAS of 2009
Excellent. You're at Board the Platform correct? any chance for a .m64 or a WMV of your DK fight? Do you think similarly you'll be done by this weekend? What do you think of the levels I've got so far up to Fighting Polygon Team? they look good? youtube links currently processing... 3 out of 5 are done
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Posted: 12/8/2006 10:34 PM
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thegreginator
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For race to the finish you should be able to gain a little time if you do Kirby's dash A at the very end. Also, are you sure you got the the ground as soon as possible, like in 50 seconds on the timer? Maybe you could manipulate the Pikachu to do something else so you can get to the ground faster.
Posted: 12/8/2006 10:48 PM
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Comicalflop
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Speedy TAS of 2009
Kirby's dash at the end loses frames, I tested. For Pikachu, manipulating him was not possible. If I had tried something different in any other way, he would've attacked me; Pikachu is very good at attacking in the air. doing a jump/forward drill over him is the best, just like for the rolling bomb section.
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