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Posted: 9/17/2009 2:47 PM
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Raiscan
Joined: 11/11/2006
Posts: 1235
Location: United Kingdom
Okay. I only ask because I'm thinking of running it myself. :)
<adelikat> I am annoyed at my irc statements ending up in forums & sigs
Posted: 9/17/2009 3:28 PM
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Nicos
Joined: 6/4/2009
Posts: 893
Raiscan wrote:
Okay. I only ask because I'm thinking of running it myself. :)
also most of the peoples didn't even finished the game, (actualy it's not even out in europe >.>)
Posted: 9/17/2009 3:31 PM
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Comicalflop
Editor, Experienced player (734)
Joined: 6/13/2006
Posts: 3300
Location: Massachussetts, USA
Speedy TAS of 2009
1) I can't seem to get the game running in any Desmume build. 2) Are you going to try and go for fastest time or most entertaining solutions? I can imagine both being distressing with either "I don't know if any multitude of different combination of words will be faster" or "Could this be solved in a funnier fashion?" 3) No harm in making a test run.
☣ Homepage ☣ Retired
Posted: 9/17/2009 3:53 PM
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Raiscan
Joined: 11/11/2006
Posts: 1235
Location: United Kingdom
Comicalflop wrote:
1) I can't seem to get the game running in any Desmume build. 2) Are you going to try and go for fastest time or most entertaining solutions? I can imagine both being distressing with either "I don't know if any multitude of different combination of words will be faster" or "Could this be solved in a funnier fashion?" 3) No harm in making a test run.
1) http://tasvideos.org/forum/viewtopic.php?p=212682#212682 2) I think with the size/variety of the game, entertainment would be an important factor. As such I think speed should be a secondary goal - that is to say that the run should be fast, but not using the same items over and over if a more interesting solution can be used that is slightly slower. Of course, for "provide items these people might like" puzzles I think I'll go for 3-letter words only (if possible). 3) I'm going to test a few levels in the next couple of weeks and try and come up with something awesome.
<adelikat> I am annoyed at my irc statements ending up in forums & sigs
Posted: 9/17/2009 4:49 PM
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Nicos
Joined: 6/4/2009
Posts: 893
a "all new" medal in every stage would be awesome (never use the same item twice in the run) the game can become prety long, AFAIK there is 10 stages, with 22 courses ( 11 puzzle & 11 action) which mean 220 stages. even if every stages is around "1 Min long" , it would become a +2h run... it'll have to be HELLA entertaining...
Posted: 9/17/2009 4:52 PM
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errror1
Active player (293)
Joined: 12/16/2008
Posts: 458
Location: Houston
We should probably move this topic to the ds fourm As far as I know there is no ending so what should be the goal. All levels? Least amount of items drawn? Quickest time to the final levels? All levels done 4 times? I might be interested in doing a low par run, all levels done with the least amount of items and then speed as secondary.
Posted: 9/17/2009 7:46 PM
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Tub
Joined: 6/25/2005
Posts: 1377
Raiscan wrote:
2) I think with the size/variety of the game, entertainment would be an important factor. As such I think speed should be a secondary goal - that is to say that the run should be fast, but not using the same items over and over if a more interesting solution can be used that is slightly slower.
Would it be feasible to set the goal: "Does not use any item twice"?
m00
Posted: 9/17/2009 8:02 PM
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DrJones
Joined: 4/3/2005
Posts: 575
Location: Spain
Because the movie can get really long, maybe it would be good to have a puzzle run and an action run.
No.
Posted: 9/17/2009 8:12 PM
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Cheezwizz
Joined: 11/2/2007
Posts: 103
don't bother using each item once too strictly. If something funny comes up, like, say, using a nuke in the 4-4 puzzle, that would be nicer than if you used a nuke in another level and never used it again. I think exploiting the game's quirks for the lowest object par is a good idea, as well.
Posted: 9/17/2009 8:47 PM
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zefiris
Joined: 4/11/2006
Posts: 487
Location: North of Russia :[
Level 9-2 says hi to pacman. Sadly Pacman can't be summoned
Posted: 9/17/2009 9:01 PM
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Derakon
Joined: 7/2/2007
Posts: 3960
The potential problem I see with exploiting quirks to minimize items used is that it might turn into a fest of using similar objects to achieve the goal the same way over and over again (e.g. if there were a bug that allowed you to get pushed through terrain by a sufficiently large object, then you could get a parade of levels that use bulldozers, elephants, airliners, etc...but all in the same way). It's not clear if this would actually be an issue though.
Pyrel - an open-source rewrite of the Angband roguelike game in Python.
Posted: 9/17/2009 11:07 PM
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Nicos
Joined: 6/4/2009
Posts: 893
but the "rope glitch" shown by errror would be hard to reproduce in small places without repetition.
Posted: 9/17/2009 11:23 PM
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Cheezwizz
Joined: 11/2/2007
Posts: 103
a lot of puzzles can be simplified knowing that if you collect the starite soon enough, you can't lose by dying. if you die and the starite drops on your corpse soon after, you still win. if it's too late, you're interrupted by the retry/change buttons in the middle of the victory music.
Posted: 9/18/2009 3:32 AM
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errror1
Active player (293)
Joined: 12/16/2008
Posts: 458
Location: Houston
An "all new" run would be imposable to optimize. You only get 1 air vent, you're using it on one of the 220 levels. How can you tell the one without trying most of them, and keep in mind you'll probably need to do the same thing for the other 300+ items you use. @Nicos keep in mind that rope placement will likely only take a few frames in a TAS rather then the 10 seconds it takes me to do it manually. edit: another glitch http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H11d6gC8gs0 suite doesn't count as summoning. This could help quite a few be done in zero. Anything else that summons multiple that unattached objects? edit: another another glitch http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wO_88yqgw4E planes act weird upside down.
Posted: 9/18/2009 12:42 PM
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Captain_Forehead
Player (79)
Joined: 7/7/2008
Posts: 873
Location: Utah
I've been thinking, since we're talking about the game and runs and glitches and such, shouldn't we be talking about this in the DS forum?
Posted: 9/19/2009 12:13 AM
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Derakon
Joined: 7/2/2007
Posts: 3960
errror1 wrote:
edit: another another glitch http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wO_88yqgw4E planes act weird upside down.
So wait, I suggest a hypothetical glitch involving getting pushed through terrain by large objects...and you go and find a large object that can push you through terrain? Well played, sir. :)
Pyrel - an open-source rewrite of the Angband roguelike game in Python.
Posted: 9/19/2009 12:55 AM
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Nicos
Joined: 6/4/2009
Posts: 893
Captain Forehead wrote:
I've been thinking, since we're talking about the game and runs and glitches and such, shouldn't we be talking about this in the DS forum?
well, a mod could move this thread in the DS section. also if you didn't already knew, the whole dictionary has been dumped on gamefaqs : http://www.gamefaqs.com/portable/ds/file/955689/57757 it could help a lot in a "all new run"
Posted: 9/19/2009 8:00 AM
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errror1
Active player (293)
Joined: 12/16/2008
Posts: 458
Location: Houston
Ok so garage summons a mop, lawn mower, and tire for no cost. Yah that word list was hacked from the rom pretty much as soon as it came out. http://rush68.net/u/files/scribfull.txt Some of the words are missing letters tho so GAS CA is really GAS CAN and that may be hard to guess @Derakon just a coincidence, the physics are that glitchy. pretty sure you can get in a wall by summoning a vehicle in the wall moving it slightly and then getting in it but it seems to be hard to reproduce and may not work in all situations.
Posted: 9/19/2009 11:20 AM
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Raiscan
Joined: 11/11/2006
Posts: 1235
Location: United Kingdom
errror1 wrote:
Yah that word list was hacked from the rom pretty much as soon as it came out. http://rush68.net/u/files/scribfull.txt
I've split the full list into seperate files, of varying word lengths. This might be useful for people trying to do things with the shortest words possible. Neighbouring duplicates have been removed, but any from the original list missing letters have not been corrected.. 3 Or Less Letters 4 Letters 5 Letters 6 Letters 7 Letters 8 Or More Letters
<adelikat> I am annoyed at my irc statements ending up in forums & sigs
Posted: 9/19/2009 1:16 PM
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Nicos
Joined: 6/4/2009
Posts: 893
long words give bonus if i remembers but the guy who tought of using NITROSOMETHYLVINYLAMINE must be a genius... also over nine thousand = summon a scooter.
Posted: 9/19/2009 1:30 PM
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andymac
Experienced player (623)
Joined: 11/30/2008
Posts: 650
Location: a little city in the middle of nowhere
There's some really hacky collision code right there. I fell through the ground on my digger, got out, and then fell onto my starite. which was underground.
Measure once. Cut twice.
Posted: 9/20/2009 2:10 AM
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Patashu
He/Him
Joined: 10/2/2005
Posts: 4042
Wow, you can even summon a zweihander? They really went all-out on this game.
My Chiptune music, made in Famitracker: http://soundcloud.com/patashu My twitch. I stream mostly shmups & rhythm games http://twitch.tv/patashu My youtube, again shmups and rhythm games and misc stuff: http://youtube.com/user/patashu
Posted: 9/20/2009 4:53 AM
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errror1
Active player (293)
Joined: 12/16/2008
Posts: 458
Location: Houston
seeing that the free triples seem to be named after rooms These are what I found and none of them count twords par office(study) summons a clock computer and filing cabinet kitchen summons an oven refrigerator and a fork den(foyer) summons a tv, console, and a sofa guest bedroom same as suite ladie's room (same as bathroom) summons a shower, toilet, sink back room(furnace room) summons workbench, stairs, pushbroom break room (dining room) summons china closet, table, chair classroom summons apple ( useful as lure etc.), chalkboard, desk play room (toy room) summons bunkbed, teddy bear, and a chest(with a teddy bear inside) hallway (lobby) summons door, art, nightstand that's all I can come up with edit: here an example of some of there uses. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=euklMUAKN4U
Posted: 9/20/2009 6:33 AM
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gyorokpeter
Joined: 9/17/2009
Posts: 18
Location: Hungary
Raiscan wrote:
errror1 wrote:
Yah that word list was hacked from the rom pretty much as soon as it came out. http://rush68.net/u/files/scribfull.txt
I've split the full list into seperate files, of varying word lengths. This might be useful for people trying to do things with the shortest words possible. Neighbouring duplicates have been removed, but any from the original list missing letters have not been corrected.. 3 Or Less Letters 4 Letters 5 Letters 6 Letters 7 Letters 8 Or More Letters
What encoding are those files in? The "full" list is certainly not UTF-8, but it isn't ISO-8859-1 or 2 either. There's a word that shows up as "WH¶KA " in 1 and "WHśKA" in 2, neither makes sense. This word doesn't appear on your 5-letter list, but it does on the 7-letter list as "WH�KA" (UTF-8) but it contains the actual "�" character rather than an invalid character.
Posted: 9/20/2009 8:16 AM
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errror1
Active player (293)
Joined: 12/16/2008
Posts: 458
Location: Houston
it's Whēkau turns out zipping is easy, just a matter of getting the right vehicle in the right place http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V30ekHpQxI4 edit nm there is an ending, but you don't have to beat the levels in order, so what ever level has the longest time from final input to completion should be last.
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