Former player
Joined: 8/1/2004
Posts: 2687
Location: Seattle, WA
Dailymotion link was totally smooth even without being fully loaded. However, I abhor dailymotion for a multitude of reasons and I hope that we don't use it.
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adelikat
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Emulator Coder, Site Developer, Site Owner, Expert player (3598)
Joined: 11/3/2004
Posts: 4738
Location: Tennessee
Zurreco wrote:
I abhor dailymotion for a multitude of reasons and I hope that we don't use it.
Such as? These might be nice things to know before I commit to anything. Do any of these sites not having something sucky? Looks like I am going to have to piss somebody off regardless.
It's hard to look this good. My TAS projects
Joined: 11/4/2007
Posts: 1772
Location: Australia, Victoria
Its a matter of finding what upsets people the least. So far, this site upsets me the least. Okay, I will be uploading more videos tomorrow, I would do it now but: 1. My Mothers internet speed is garbage. 2. My Mothers download/upload limit is too small to do this safely.
Former player
Joined: 8/1/2004
Posts: 2687
Location: Seattle, WA
adelikat wrote:
Such as?
The layout is terrible: giant related keywords, ugly header and footer, etc. It's much easier to get videos flagged and, as a result, blocked by the family filter. You can't leave comments in the video file itself, and the comments section requires you to log in. There is a 20 minute cap on videos. I much prefer Viddler. I know it is a bit of a CPU hog, but the videos seem to run smoother, the non-embedded videos are still the center of attention, and the ability to have the author and the community interact via the video is great. You also tend to have more control over your content at Viddler. That's just my side of it, though. However, the majority of my exposure comes through the LP group at SA, who usually use Viddler and/or Baldurk (get friendly with him and he will host for you, though I don't know if he would want to host something with as much traffic as we get) for hosting VLPs. Take their advice:
LP Forums wrote:
Syrg posted: Know Your Video Hosting -updated April 27, 2009 There are a hell of a lot of places to throw up videos for an LP! Here is a handy list, with links, that tells you all you need to know about each. Try and choose two or so in case one site shits out on us down the line so we don't have to scramble and save your shit for future generations, and if you have a suggestion, point it out. Youtube Pros: New high quality and resolution options mean that Youtube is actually a half-decent host now. Not likely to crash and burn anytime soon (RIP Stage6). Cons: 10 minute limit is killer for longer-form videos. Community is horrible. Google Video No longer accepting uploads. Dailymotion Pros: Like a slightly upgraded Youtube. Longer time limit (20 minutes), simple to use, so on. Make sure to use the high quality option; the regular quality is horrible and will mangle any subtitles you have. Cons: Can't download the original file. Viddler Pros: Has low-level player resizing to fit the dimensions of your video, you can download the original to watch later/in full quality, if you're clever you can use the comments/timing feature as impromptu subtitles (but this takes some effort). Cons: Tends to fuck up subtitles which are ON the video, is a little too small to use reliably for anything highly detailed/with a lot of text needing to be read. Lower-end CPUs will struggle if you go over the default resolution, as Viddler's player resizes it in real-time for some reason. Veoh Pros: Seems a little better about playing nice with subtitles than Viddler, otherwise similar as far as I can tell so far, save... Cons: Sometimes runs a brief ad before the video starts, video isn't downloadable (at least on any I tried: it wanted me to download a Veoh-centric player to watch it in a larger window!), any video over 30 minutes forces you to use said player to view it. Gamevee Cons: Dead. GotGame supposedly is reviving it, but that doesn't seem to have gone anywhere. Avoid. Bonus Russian Roulette Option: Vimeo Pros: I love this site. The player scales to the resolution needed, they do HD content, you can download the original if logged into an account there (which is like a ten second process)... Cons: ...and they claim to fucking hate game videos and said they would nuke any they spotted. This is a gamble to use and not recommended by 99% of people here because despite a lot of videos slipping through past the "everything will be deleted" deadline in September, nothing is to say they won't someday finish the job. Use at your own risk.
hi nitrodon streamline: cyn-chine
Active player (277)
Joined: 5/29/2004
Posts: 5712
So Viddler takes extra CPU, huh? I guess we'll be telling everyone with an old PC, "Too bad, enjoy your 4 FPS."
put yourself in my rocketpack if that poochie is one outrageous dude
Joined: 11/4/2007
Posts: 1772
Location: Australia, Victoria
Old PC? Mine is a 2008 grade laptop and it struggles with Viddler!
Experienced player (617)
Joined: 11/30/2008
Posts: 650
Location: a little city in the middle of nowhere
this seemed to work for me, I get much better framerates, this may work for others as well. The <p> tags somehow made the video run smoother. also for the record my PC is a 2008 quad core desktop with 4GB ram and 1024MB graphics card, and it struggles with viddler.
<html>
</body>

<p>

<object classid='clsid:D27CDB6E-AE6D-11cf-96B8-444553540000' width='437' height='333' id='viddler'>
<param name='movie' value='http://www.viddler.com/player/99d5f743/' />
<param name='allowScriptAccess' value='always' />
<embed src='http://www.viddler.com/player/99d5f743' width='437' height='333' type='application/x-shockwave-flash' allowScriptAccess='always' name='viddler' allowFullScreen='true'>
</embed>
</object>

</p>

</body>
</html>
Daily motion seems fine with me. For videos under 20 minutes, An admin can easily submit anyone's work. If the video is over 20 minutes, then the creator of the movie can register themselves as a motion maker and upload their own videos to a TASVideos group with no time restriction. The only problem here is that it must be the creator of the movie that uploads the file. As for the comment above, well, yes it's a CPU hog, and half the people here would agree that the videos there are unwatchable because of that. 5fps is not the kind of framerates you want to watch a fast movie on. so no, the videos do not run "smoother" for half of the people here. Maybe not you, but quite a few people. Also wouldn't it be fairly easy, if you hate the layout of the dailymotion website (to ignore it?) to embed it on the TASVideos website somewhere? sounds reasonable to me.
Measure once. Cut twice.
Former player
Joined: 8/1/2004
Posts: 2687
Location: Seattle, WA
andymac wrote:
Also wouldn't it be fairly easy, if you hate the layout of the dailymotion website (to ignore it?) to embed it on the TASVideos website somewhere? sounds reasonable to me.
Where would you embed them? Regardless of who we end up using for a host, won't embedding on game pages increase page load times? Or would we be creating fresh pages for each embedded video? It's a small obstacle, but it's worth noting. I think Vimeo would be the best option for a purely embedding option. e: Scratch that. Didn't know Vimeo was anti-gameplay as of late. Also, ignoring DM's poor layout doesn't solve the issue; it merely avoids it. That qualm is my own, though, so it shouldn't really matter in this discussion. I only brought it up because adelikat wanted to hear my reasoning.
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Joined: 6/27/2007
Posts: 137
Location: Germany
upthorn
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Emulator Coder, Active player (388)
Joined: 3/24/2006
Posts: 1802
What would be nice is if we could somehow negotiate with youtube to get an official tasvideos account without the 11 minute limit. I know commercial entities have done this successfully, but I have no idea how one would go about it, especially a broke noncommercial site like ourselves.
How fleeting are all human passions compared with the massive continuity of ducks.
Joined: 11/4/2007
Posts: 1772
Location: Australia, Victoria
You mean partner status? Knowing how much of a niche market we fulfill, we have no chance.
adelikat
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Joined: 11/3/2004
Posts: 4738
Location: Tennessee
andymac wrote:
For videos under 20 minutes, An admin can easily submit anyone's work. If the video is over 20 minutes, then the creator of the movie can register themselves as a motion maker and upload their own videos to a TASVideos group with no time restriction. The only problem here is that it must be the creator of the movie that uploads the file.
If the video is over 20 minutes, we could just split it in 2 no? 2 or even 3 part videos aren't cumbersome to do. And that would cover about 90% of the videos on this site. I still prefer viddler. I wish it wasn't a hog for everyone :( Also, viddler has been giving me and flygon problems with uploading. That is a bit of a con as well.
It's hard to look this good. My TAS projects
Experienced player (617)
Joined: 11/30/2008
Posts: 650
Location: a little city in the middle of nowhere
Dailymotion has an option where you can link to a second video from the first when the video ends, this could probably assist with the whole 20 minute limit.
Measure once. Cut twice.
adelikat
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Emulator Coder, Site Developer, Site Owner, Expert player (3598)
Joined: 11/3/2004
Posts: 4738
Location: Tennessee
andymac wrote:
Also wouldn't it be fairly easy, if you hate the layout of the dailymotion website (to ignore it?) to embed it on the TASVideos website somewhere? sounds reasonable to me.
Let's stop this debate right now. Imbedding all our publications on to pages on this site isn't going to happen. Don't know if you have noticed but our server can't handle the load we currently have. We need ways to shift the load elsewhere, not increase it here.
It's hard to look this good. My TAS projects
Banned User, Former player
Joined: 3/10/2004
Posts: 7698
Location: Finland
adelikat wrote:
Don't know if you have noticed but our server can't handle the load we currently have. We need ways to shift the load elsewhere, not increase it here.
I didn't know embedding videos increases the bandwidth of the server (which contains the page which is embedding the video). I thought it's just like linking to an image in another server: Your server just gives the html, the browser goes to the other server where the actual image is, and wastes that other server's bandwidth to load it. Isn't it the same with embedded videos?
Former player
Joined: 12/5/2007
Posts: 716
Warp: It is.
adelikat
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Emulator Coder, Site Developer, Site Owner, Expert player (3598)
Joined: 11/3/2004
Posts: 4738
Location: Tennessee
I watched the viddler movies again today. Much better fps for me (was like 20, now 30 I think). Everyone complaining that they are unbearable. Please watch again and tell me the results.
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upthorn
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Emulator Coder, Active player (388)
Joined: 3/24/2006
Posts: 1802
Yeah, embedding videos from youtube/dailymotion/wherever doesn't really add to the bandwidth cost, because the video and even the flash player are still being served from the external site, so the only bandwidth increase is the size of the actual html code. Granted, 425 bytes (for youtube) is larger than most standard html tags, but it's also smaller than the size of a torrent file, or an average forum post. For instance, it's less than 1/3rd the size of the html for forum post.
How fleeting are all human passions compared with the massive continuity of ducks.
adelikat
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Joined: 11/3/2004
Posts: 4738
Location: Tennessee
I'm thinking of the fact that it would need to be on a page. What page? Creating 600 new wiki's is more load. Marginal in the grand scheme of things, but it is non-zero.
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arflech
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Joined: 5/3/2008
Posts: 1120
andymac forgot about Nico Nico Douga, although the account signup is only navigable if you know Spanish, German, Chinese, or Japanese...
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Joined: 11/30/2008
Posts: 650
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Here's an interesting page... Adelikat, if the website is struggling, have you tried hosting images externally?
Measure once. Cut twice.
Joined: 11/4/2007
Posts: 1772
Location: Australia, Victoria
I've used that page plenty of times, its how I came to my conclusion of DailyMotion among other things. Nothing beats practical experience, Viddler proves that.
Post subject: Dailymotion account - official
adelikat
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Emulator Coder, Site Developer, Site Owner, Expert player (3598)
Joined: 11/3/2004
Posts: 4738
Location: Tennessee
Since too many of our viewers are unable to watch viddler videos we created a Dailymotion account. This will be an official TASVideos.org account and we have been working to upload our movies there. We aren't going to close the viddler account. For one thing, we still don't know if we will qualifiy for a daily motion "Motion maker" account (which allows us to go over the 20 minute limit). If that fails, we will use viddler for longer movies. Once we have all our movies uploaded to dailymotion, we may upload them to Viddler too. There is no reason not to have them in multiple places and create more exposure for the site!
It's hard to look this good. My TAS projects
Skilled player (1307)
Joined: 9/7/2007
Posts: 1354
Location: U.S.
Uh oh looks like movie #532 has suffered! Other than that, your doing great. Hope to see more on that new account.
Post subject: progress report and help request
adelikat
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Emulator Coder, Site Developer, Site Owner, Expert player (3598)
Joined: 11/3/2004
Posts: 4738
Location: Tennessee
Update on the streaming meida project. 1) Viddler - I have uploaded 500+ movies at this point and linked them all on the publication pages. In addition I have created a TASVideos-obsoletions group to move movies too if/when they are obsoleted (rather than deleting them). People are free to upload published videos of obsoleted movies to this category if they feel like it. 2) Dailymotion - I have prioritized viddler first due to its batch upload capabilities. However, I and flygon have been putting videos on dailymotion too. We have 76 currently. 3) I have created a TASVideos-submissions group on daily motion. This is for quick encodes of submitted movies. Get a copy in my or flygon's hands if you want a submission encode uploaded here. What's next on the agenda: 1) Finish getting ALL publications uploaded to both viddler & dailymotion 2) Get a motion maker account on daily motion (allowing to break the 20 minute limit 3) Write up pages on How to upload movies to Viddler & Dailymotion, including formatting details. 4) Require publishers upload their encodes to both of these places following these rules as part of the publication process. 5) Create an account on viddler and/or dailymotion TASVideos-playground, where people can upload their wips, un-submitted, playaround, whatever type tool assisted videos. In the very near future I am going to ask for assistance in getting movies uploaded to dailymotion. I'm hoping to have some volunteers. Requirements: decent upload speed, willingness to put in a lot of hours uploading and properly labeling/linking the videos, trustworthy with a) the login info for TASVideos, or b) to create their own account on dailymotion and follow the proper rules for uploading the movies.
It's hard to look this good. My TAS projects