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Posted: 12/11/2004 7:04 PM
Post subject: F-zero
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nesrocks
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Joined: 5/1/2004
Posts: 4096
Location: Rio, Brazil
I coulnd't find a thread about f-zero, so i started this one, even though i have no movie for snes9x, i played some f-zero on zsnesw 1.36. It's a good starting point for anyone trying to make a movie for this game, unless you are able to finish the king circuit on master difficulty already. http://www.angelfire.com/ex/uobt/F-Zero__U_-fodaplaying.zip King league, master, Fire Stingray Queen league, expert, Fire Stingray Knight league, expert, Fire Stingray Knight league, master, Blue Falcon (can't win death wind, i think it's impossible...) Queen league, master, Golden fox (can't win) King league, master, Wild Goose (can't win again) The way i see it, fire stingray is by far the best car. No need to even try the other ones. The game works differently on 478 kmph and above, and the firestingray's max speed is 478. trying to stay there is a must. The fire stingray doesnt slip on normal conditions. the curve radius is a constant, making a perfect arc if you have a constant speed. the curve radius is the same from speed 1 to 477. but on 478 and above the radius increases instantly (i'd say about 30%). so if you want to make a tight curve let go B so your speed drops to just below 478 and you can make a tighter curve. - Maintaining 478 kmph is the primary goal. - Pointing the vehicle to the next "waypoint" as soon as possible is another goal. the shortest distance between two points is a straight line, keep that in mind for accurate fastest laps. - Using the nitros when at lowest speeds is the way to go. Watch the video to know the best spots for each track to use the nitro. - The firestingray doesnt lose speed on the "dirt" areas of the track while using the nitro. - Using L & R buttons, you can slide to the sides. i dont think it affects the forward speed. i mean, walking straight or pressing L and R all the time should make no difference, but it's something worth a test using frame count. - Also about the L & R buttons, they just move you to the sides, they dont really help shorten the curve radius. The best spot on a curve to start using the R button would be by the moment you have turned 90 degrees and there's just other 90 degrees to go. i'll try to make myself clear by using this ugly diagram: i might be wrong about that though. it's all about vectors and straight lines connecting point a to b. i find it very complex to perfect this kind of game. i dont think i'm gonna try it, but i had to put what i know about the game here.
aka Nesrocks http://www.youtube.com/user/UoBtExFODA https://nesrocks.com https://twitter.com/bitinkstudios
Posted: 12/11/2004 7:34 PM
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VIPer7
Former player
Joined: 10/17/2004
Posts: 226
Location: Bonn, Germany
the movie desynchs in the 2nd corner... blue falcon pushes you into the wall, and there you eventually crash... why did you record it in znes and not in snes9x??
Posted: 12/11/2004 7:46 PM
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nesrocks
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Player (247)
Joined: 5/1/2004
Posts: 4096
Location: Rio, Brazil
hmm i never liked snes9x :P but it doesnt crash here, i wonder why is that. are you using f-zero (U).smc ? edit: about hitting the blue falcon on the second curve, that really happens but i tried to play the movie on a different zsnes i have, it's one with a patch to allow graphics patches for some games, and the game went desync. i dont remember where i got that zsnes from. but use the pure zsnesw 1.36 and it shouldnt desync
aka Nesrocks http://www.youtube.com/user/UoBtExFODA https://nesrocks.com https://twitter.com/bitinkstudios
Posted: 12/11/2004 8:07 PM
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Michael_Fried
Former player
Joined: 3/8/2004
Posts: 1107
Do you know about this site? http://www.mrfixitonline.com/fzerohome.asp I think they have WR charts there, so it might be useful for comparison if you plan on making a save state run.
Posted: 12/12/2004 4:00 AM
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nesrocks
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Player (247)
Joined: 5/1/2004
Posts: 4096
Location: Rio, Brazil
oh now i feel like turning on my snes and checking out the records on the cartridge. i'll do that later. wow, i'm glad to see that the tips page looks pretty much like everything i said or used on the video :) i never read anything about f-zero, i just play it :D his explanation about "boost cornering" is not accurate though, he said to keep tapping the accelerator, but he didnt mention that you only need to keep it below 478 kmph...
aka Nesrocks http://www.youtube.com/user/UoBtExFODA https://nesrocks.com https://twitter.com/bitinkstudios
Posted: 2/6/2005 12:23 AM
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Tuggummi
Joined: 2/2/2005
Posts: 29
Location: Finland
Last post is almost 2 months old, any news on timeattacking this game? :) I could also take a shot at this myself too once i get a pad that is (which i think is a must for this kind of game) Maybe if different people did the different leagues and it would be compiled into one big timeattack? Possible? Or just a bad idea?
Posted: 2/6/2005 12:58 AM
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Truncated
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Joined: 4/17/2004
Posts: 3109
Location: Sweden
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Reading the first post again I get an idea... if R and L really make you slide to the side without affecting forward speed, you could straferun like in Doom for slighly higher velocity.
Posted: 2/6/2005 1:10 AM
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nesrocks
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Player (247)
Joined: 5/1/2004
Posts: 4096
Location: Rio, Brazil
i only gotta remind you to beat the world records which arent easy to break :S even tool assisted
aka Nesrocks http://www.youtube.com/user/UoBtExFODA https://nesrocks.com https://twitter.com/bitinkstudios
Posted: 2/6/2005 1:39 AM
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Zurreco
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Joined: 8/1/2004
Posts: 2687
Location: Seattle, WA
Truncated wrote:
Reading the first post again I get an idea... if R and L really make you slide to the side without affecting forward speed, you could straferun like in Doom for slighly higher velocity.
no. this only helps on turns.
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Posted: 2/6/2005 1:58 AM
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Truncated
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Which part is "no"? As in "No, sliding does affect the forward speed" or "No, that doesn't work because of reason"?
Posted: 2/6/2005 2:47 AM
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nesrocks
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Player (247)
Joined: 5/1/2004
Posts: 4096
Location: Rio, Brazil
actually i understand what truncated said, and i already tried to record f-zero like that, but i was still under the world record time, i guess it indeed changes the forward moving speed
aka Nesrocks http://www.youtube.com/user/UoBtExFODA https://nesrocks.com https://twitter.com/bitinkstudios
Posted: 2/6/2005 3:29 AM
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Tuggummi
Joined: 2/2/2005
Posts: 29
Location: Finland
If you have a good connection, it's a good idea to download the videos of some of the world records as they give out a pretty good idea how to achieve those times. Then you just perfect them with slow-down & savestates :) But some of the world records are made in practice mode, should this be taken into consideration when timeattacking? As in if you make a veryverynear or equal time in grand prix than the world record is in practice mode, can it be considered better?
Posted: 2/6/2005 3:26 PM
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bobucles
Joined: 7/27/2004
Posts: 48
If you're going to try to race faster than 478Kph, you'll need to master the turns. I made a little pic here to show the best way to handle the turns, IMO. You want to start on the outside of the turn, turn as early as possible to hug the inside of the turn, and exit on the other side of the road. It should give you the biggest turn possible. Careful use of the L and R keys will help even more, as I've outlined in the pic. With a little practice, you may be able to do some of those impossible turns yet! Edit: Ha! My diagram is even uglier than yours, FODA! How do you like that? :)
Posted: 2/6/2005 6:16 PM
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Tuggummi
Joined: 2/2/2005
Posts: 29
Location: Finland
Test Run, GP Mute City 1 Time Difference to world record: +2:82 So there's still plenty of work to do until it's faster than the world record... A couple of things though. 1) Should the 3 first corners after the first lap be cutted off sharp and tap the accelerate or with a longer curve without releaseing accl. button? Which is faster? 2) Is it a good idea to "hug" the rails after the jump once you have the boost? 3) Still don't know how to perfectly run the last corner...
Posted: 2/7/2005 4:53 AM
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OmnipotentEntity
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Don't take the jump, it slows you down.
Build a man a fire, warm him for a day, Set a man on fire, warm him for the rest of his life.
Posted: 2/9/2005 4:45 AM
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Tuggummi
Joined: 2/2/2005
Posts: 29
Location: Finland
Aaargh, this game is driving me nuts! >_< I have been playing Mute City 1 for 3 days and im begining to think, it might be damn right impossible to beat the World Record of it in Grand Prix mode, because the guy with world record gets a double bump out of "Golden Fox" in practice mode which is almost a second faster than getting a double bump out of "Blue Falcon". So the biggest problem is the opening lap, but not only that my times don't come even near the world record ones on other laps either. Well anyway, I made another test run which you can download from the same place. Time Difference: +1:53 I think i'll go to the corner and suck my thumb now... Good luck with anyone else trying to make a speedrun of this game.
Posted: 2/9/2005 4:04 PM
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OmnipotentEntity
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Joined: 9/11/2004
Posts: 2631
Have you tried getting a bump out of the Green car? You were really close. (I just tested it, it is possible. And it might be possible to clean up that first bump with the blue car, it pushes you to the left as it is.) (And I stand thoroughly corrected about the jump. How'd you do that?) Oh, and the differences in each lap time were small but still there. I didn't see too much interferance by the other cars
Build a man a fire, warm him for a day, Set a man on fire, warm him for the rest of his life.
Posted: 2/9/2005 4:30 PM
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Tuggummi
Joined: 2/2/2005
Posts: 29
Location: Finland
Well if you watched the first version (not available anymore), i did bump first from the blue car then from the green car, but this only boosted me up to 360kph~ while in bumping twice to the blue car will boost my speed up to 420kph~ (in a longer time lane though) I haven't measured precisely which is faster, but the double bump on blue did give me a better opening lap time (though i might've just played better) About jump plates, they are worth jumping on before you reach maximum speed, because they will give you a quick 40kph~ boost, you just have to press down to land smoothly. Otherwise they will slow you down and also if you're using turbo booster they will slow you back to 478kph. I have read the FAQ at the F-Zero site linked earlier and watched the videos to learn, but i still can't get even Mute City under the world record.
Posted: 4/18/2005 7:33 PM
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Saturn
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Joined: 2/18/2005
Posts: 1451
I readed the tread and I think it's a good idea to make an tool assisted attack on the world record of Mute City 1. I watched Tuggummi's improved version which is 1:59:94 but I have to say that you have no chance to break the record in the Grand Prix Mode because you can't start fast enough like get bumped from the Golden Fox in Practise instead and the additional cars (or whatever it is) which you have to pass could cause you deviate from the best line which already will cost you some milliseconds. I decided that I will give it a go if I get some time and try to make the best possible time and maybe even break the record of 1:58:41 if it is still the best. I guess you have to use the Practise mode and the Golden Fox opponent otherwise it will be impossible in any case. PS: I watched Foda's ZSNES 1.36 Movie and I must say for a non tool assisted skill movie it is very good. Respect!
See my perfect 100% movie-walkthroughs of the best RPG games on http://www.freewebs.com/saturnsmovies/index.htm Current TAS project (with new videos): Super Metroid Redesign, any% speedrun
Posted: 4/19/2005 12:31 AM
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Saturn
Player (206)
Joined: 2/18/2005
Posts: 1451
Just did the first lap in 25:41 and this is 1 millisecond faster than the world record! I will use a different driving line than the most do in this course because I think in the end it will be faster.
See my perfect 100% movie-walkthroughs of the best RPG games on http://www.freewebs.com/saturnsmovies/index.htm Current TAS project (with new videos): Super Metroid Redesign, any% speedrun
Posted: 4/19/2005 12:35 AM
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nesrocks
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Joined: 5/1/2004
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Location: Rio, Brazil
wow cool! good job
aka Nesrocks http://www.youtube.com/user/UoBtExFODA https://nesrocks.com https://twitter.com/bitinkstudios
Posted: 4/19/2005 3:04 AM
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xebra
Joined: 5/3/2004
Posts: 1203
Saturn wrote:
Just did the first lap in 25:41 and this is 1 millisecond faster than the world record! I will use a different driving line than the most do in this course because I think in the end it will be faster.
10 milliseconds. Also, don't make it your goal to just beat the human records. Make a perfect video.
Posted: 4/19/2005 10:30 AM
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Saturn
Player (206)
Joined: 2/18/2005
Posts: 1451
So far I know the world record for the first lap is 25.42 and this is exactly 1 frame slower than mine currently. Here are the current World records for each track: http://www.mrfixitonline.com/List.asp?ListId=492&Action=SHOWITEM&ListDataId=26457 Also I do it just for fun and I will only record a world record-attack of Mute City 1, not a Grand Prix because I don't have the time for it, but I will of course do my best to make this short movie interesting to watch.
See my perfect 100% movie-walkthroughs of the best RPG games on http://www.freewebs.com/saturnsmovies/index.htm Current TAS project (with new videos): Super Metroid Redesign, any% speedrun
Posted: 4/20/2005 2:35 PM
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Saturn
Player (206)
Joined: 2/18/2005
Posts: 1451
God, breaking the World record is soooo hard (even with tools). I have to rerecord every damn corner at least 30 times with different combinations of releasing gas using L + R and of course left + right to find the fastest combination. Also I have to find the best possible line. I didn't thought that this easy track will cost me so much time to record, but I started already and I will do it anyway. For thoose who don't know: Holding L or R while driving straight will affect on the speed even if it don't change the direction and don't looks like that, so I also have to use it as less as possible. PS: Improved the first lap by 2 Pixels :-) but still 25:41.
See my perfect 100% movie-walkthroughs of the best RPG games on http://www.freewebs.com/saturnsmovies/index.htm Current TAS project (with new videos): Super Metroid Redesign, any% speedrun
Posted: 4/20/2005 3:18 PM
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Highness
Player (71)
Joined: 8/24/2004
Posts: 2562
Location: Sweden
Anyone aiming to beat all the courses in one run with world record times? That would be kewl to see. :)
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