Posted: 2/3/2018 6:39 PM
Post subject: Do you prefer watching speedruns with or without glitches?
Quote
EZGames69
He/They
Publisher, Reviewer, Expert player (4467)
Joined: 5/29/2017
Posts: 2765
DS TAS of 2023 SNES TASer of 2022 SNES TASer of 2021 SNES TAS of 2021 Exotic platforms TAS of 2021 TASer of 2020 SNES TASer of 2020 Sega TASer of 2020 TASer of 2019 Sega TASer of 2019 Exotic platforms TAS of 2018
Sometimes when I watch speedruns of my favorite game, speedruns of the game may be using glitches that are too complicated to really understand. Sometimes this ruins the experience in some cases for me personally. There's also times where I watch glitchless games where they play through the game as intended as possible. This run would be easier to understand if you've played the game before, and shows how fast you can get through the game as possible without using glitches the general public would never know. In general, do you enjoy watching speedruns with glitches or without glitches?
[14:15] <feos> WinDOES what DOSn't 12:33:44 PM <Mothrayas> "I got an oof with my game!" Mothrayas Today at 12:22: <Colin> thank you for supporting noble causes such as my feet MemoryTAS Today at 11:55 AM: you wouldn't know beauty if it slapped you in the face with a giant fish [Today at 4:51 PM] Mothrayas: although if you like your own tweets that's the online equivalent of sniffing your own farts and probably tells a lot about you as a person MemoryTAS Today at 7:01 PM: But I exert big staff energy honestly lol Samsara Today at 1:20 PM: wouldn't ACE in a real life TAS just stand for Actually Cease Existing
Posted: 2/3/2018 7:20 PM
Quote
Masterjun
He/Him
Site Developer, Skilled player (1988)
Joined: 10/12/2010
Posts: 1185
Location: Germany
Exotic platforms TAS of 2020 Speedy TAS of 2018 PC TAS of 2018 Glitchy TAS of 2015 TASer of 2014 SNES TASer of 2014 TAS of 2014 SNES TAS of 2014 Funny TAS of 2014 Glitchy TAS of 2014 TASer of 2013 SNES TASer of 2013 NES TAS of 2013 SNES TAS of 2012 Funny TAS of 2012
Yes I do!
Warning: Might glitch to credits I will finish this ACE soon as possible (or will I?)
Posted: 2/3/2018 7:28 PM
Quote
DrD2k9
He/Him
Editor, Judge, Expert player (2221)
Joined: 8/21/2016
Posts: 1091
Location: US
Arcade TAS of 2023 Exotic platforms TASer of 2020 First edition TAS of 2020 Gameboy TAS of 2020 Exotic platforms TASer of 2019 Computer TASer of 2017
Masterjun wrote:
Yes I do!
Posted: 2/3/2018 7:29 PM
Quote
DeHackEd
Emulator Coder, Site Developer, Former player
Joined: 11/6/2004
Posts: 833
Both have their merits, but I think the sweet spot is minor glitches like damage boosting somewhere the devs didn't expect rather than walking into the wall and then "Onwards to Victory". (I link an old video mainly because the screen shot sells it by itself).
Posted: 2/3/2018 7:38 PM
(Edited: 2/3/2018 9:53 PM)
Post subject: Re: Do you prefer watching speedruns with or without glitches?
Quote
ThunderAxe31
Any
Editor, Reviewer, Skilled player (1360)
Joined: 9/12/2016
Posts: 1646
Location: Italy
Arcade TAS of 2023 Homebrew TAS of 2023 PSX TASer of 2022 Gameboy TASer of 2017
EZGames69 wrote:
In general, do you enjoy watching speedruns with glitches or without glitches?
It depends on the game and on the goal. It's good to avoid glitches if the game allows for varied and complex tricks without breaking the game. It's also important to avoid glitches for special goals that allow to show more of the game compared to any% or 100%. Edit: here is a clear example: [3134] GB Pokémon: Blue and Red Version "Coop Diploma" by MrWint in 3:48:04.10
my personal page - my YouTube channel - my GitHub - my Discord: thunderaxe31 <Masterjun> if you look at the "NES" in a weird angle, it actually clearly says "GBA"
Posted: 2/3/2018 8:34 PM
Quote
Warp
Banned User
Joined: 3/10/2004
Posts: 7698
Location: Finland
This is actually a bit of a complex question for me. One of the reasons why I love the Quake speedruns in particular is precisely because the game doesn't have many exploitable glitches (I don't consider flaws in level design that allow for unintended shortcuts to be glitches, as glitches are generally considered errors in programming, not errors in level design.) The very nature of Quake as a game, and the fact that it's so glitch-free, makes the speedruns just awesome to watch. I'm not so sure I would like them so much if the runs were heavily glitched. (For example, I don't really like speedruns of the new Doom precisely because they are so glitched. I find them a bit boring. They just lack that awesomeness that Quake speedruns have.) That being said, I do appreciate some speedruns of some games that are heavily glitched. For example, I confess that I find glitched runs of Ocarina of Time more entertaining than the glitchless ones (although the latter are cool too). But then, it depends a bit on the kind of glitches and exploits being used, and how these glitches are triggered. For example in Ocarina of Time any% all glitches are triggered purely via skillful (often frame-perfect) gameplay. Completely within the gameplay proper, controlling the playable character with normal controls using the game controller. All out-of-bounds glitches, item glitches, superslides... all are triggered via regular gameplay. Things like corrupting the save data by resetting the console at the proper situation, or messing up game settings in the game's options menu, or things like that, are not part of OoT speedrunning. (Resetting is used in the longer categories, but only to get faster to dungeon entrances and things like that, and that's about it, not to glitch the game. I can live with that.) Things like going to the game's graphical settings and lowering the framerate in order to make a glitch work (The Talos Principle), or saving and loading like 50 times to make some glitch work (Half-Life 2) are techniques I really don't like that much. I would much prefer if actual gameplay was being used to complete the game, not these non-gameplay metafeatures.
Posted: 2/3/2018 9:09 PM
Quote
scrimpeh
Editor, Skilled player (1440)
Joined: 3/31/2010
Posts: 2113
TAS of 2017 First edition TAS of 2017 PSX TAS of 2017
It depends. On a general note, yes. Seeing glitches in games is a large part of what I'm here for. On the other hand, a lot of glitches significantly degrade the viewing experience to perform, and can really make a run hard to watch depending on how much they're used. In most cases however, I think you gotta take the good with the bad, so glitches it is.
Posted: 2/4/2018 7:14 AM
Quote
Tompa
Any
Editor, Expert player (2224)
Joined: 8/15/2005
Posts: 1943
Location: Mullsjö, Sweden
NES TAS of 2018 SNES TASer of 2017 SNES TAS of 2017 NES TAS of 2014 GBA TASer of 2011 GBA TAS of 2011 SNES TASer of 2010
Two good videos on this subject: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Yhi5x4DzkY And one that focuses on Ocarina of Time: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2ebZ94KGlVw
Posted: 2/4/2018 12:51 PM
Quote
andypanther
Any
Former player
Joined: 6/30/2010
Posts: 1107
Location: Zurich, Switzerland
I usually don't like glitchless categories too much, unless they are designed like Bug Limit in Ocarina of Time (a.k.a. the less restrictive definition). The idea of taking a game apart as much as possible while limiting yourself to "intended mechanics" is fascinating to me. So whenever I find a glitchless category for a game, I first read the rules. If they say completely arbitrary things like "no savewarping" , I know I won't be interested. The irony: When I speedrun myself, I mostly enjoy pure movement optimization instead of glitches, so it's not surprising why I specialize in racing games.
Current project: Gex 3 any% Paused: Gex 64 any% There are no N64 emulators. Just SM64 emulators with hacky support for all the other games.
Posted: 2/4/2018 5:01 PM
Quote
jlun2
Skilled player (1742)
Joined: 9/17/2009
Posts: 4986
Location: ̶C̶a̶n̶a̶d̶a̶ "Kanatah"
GBA TASer of 2010
Depends on both the game and the glitches. For instance, the vault tiered games on this site tend to be really slow paced, and if there were some glitch that speeds it up, it would be nice. However, sometimes, glitch preparation takes a large amount of time, so that can "ruin" the run's entertainment. Eg . These runs for instance.
LLCoolDave wrote:
This seems to be competing for the "Worst looking TAS of 2011" Award.