And "takes no damage", assuming its slower than a regular run, is quite silly in a TAS, unless it differs significantly from the main run.
I wouldn't say that. Consider, say, a game where the enemies are laid out as an obstacle course, and the player is supposed to carefully weave between them (with only limited abilities to kill the enemies). Without tool assistance, you have to move slowly and carefully. With tool assistance, you can be much more "reckless", and that's entertaining. With tool assistance and taking damage, you can just run straight through them all - still entertaining, but potentially not as much as playing the game "the way it was meant to be played" but much more skillfully than ever expected.
Ultimately it's a judgement call.
Pyrel - an open-source rewrite of the Angband roguelike game in Python.
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Posts: 139
Location: Washington State
paskey13
From your description i'd say you only watched the first couple levels of the goldeneye run. yeah it has a couple levels like that but to call it the most boring run on the site. even if it's your opinion is completely flawed. Sure you're entitled to it. But you can look just as respectable with your head up your ass as well.
There's already two LttP runs though. Plus if you don't take damage, you can't use any bomb abuse. (Has anyone noticed that bombs are only in Zelda games to be abused in some way?)
But If I was bored enough, I might watch it. I think that there are much better games that no damage would be better for though. (can't think of any off the top of my head though) If you're willing to make one, go for it.
Incidentally, I thought the Golden eye run was one of the best runs I've seen lately. Lately.
If the run was made for fun (hint: Not abusing save states/re-records/any non-system function) I'd watch it.
Riiight.
Unassisted runs are more up SDA's alley, or our Speedrun Competitions board for that matter. Sure it'd be impressive to do unassisted (if it didn't have a ridiculous number of segments), but this isn't the place to discuss that.
Sorry for quintuple-posting. I don't care about "Error in updating sessions table." But pleeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeease put the post back!*sob*
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thechucknorrisofNSMB wrote:
Sorry for quintuple-posting. I don't care about "Error in updating sessions table." But pleeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeease put the post back!*sob*
Sorry, in the process of cleaning up a quintiple post, I deleted the original by accident. Sorry, it is gone forever.
Actually, I lied. It's all Kongregate's fault. ;)
Plus, I'm a newbie who happens to suck at frame-by-frame swordfighting. I should do LarryBoy first.
(Or maybe pull research into a glitched run(entering up door with up+down))
Hey, I just found a really wierd glitch...(U+D on a door that SCROLLS the the screen UP. Don't know if it can be done with a left-facing door(L+R))
I made a movie of it, if you want to see.
Note that there's TONS more experimenting to be done, so feel free to work on it.
Oh, and here's a picture:
And yes, I started in Hyrule Castle (before rescuing the princess)
Commencing to research...
Joined: 8/15/2005
Posts: 1941
Location: Mullsjö, Sweden
Very old glitch that was previously used in the glitched TAS of the SNES version. There are lot of different ways to get out of bounds to go between rooms in the same way.
Also, what vba version did you use?
Edit: Nm that... Was v21 apparently.
I recently made a TAS of the GBA version of LttP, and I was wondering if I should submit it. It beats the 4 Link clones and abuse glitches.
You can find it here.
As for the low rerecord count, most of the run consist of either cutscene or walking.
Edit: Youtube'd
Link to video
While it's interesting to a point, it would be nicer if there was a way to reset the room when you get to the 4 Links and give a real fight that is, well, enjoyable. Nice glitch abuse to get there though.
While it's interesting to a point, it would be nicer if there was a way to reset the room when you get to the 4 Links and give a real fight that is, well, enjoyable.
You mean showing the entire arena instead of just 1/2 like in the video? Ok, I'll try. Oh, and a real fight using a sword instead of a glitched up hookshot would be incredibly easy due to the fact that Link is invincible.
Edit: Well, I was unable to do much other than saving 28 frames (00:00.47 seconds). Here is the run.
Edit2: I suddenly thought of an idea that may or may not improve the run. I'll check it out before Youtubing again.
As for myself, I quite enjoyed the run, and would be happy to know a bit more about some glitches (like the glitched up hookshot).
Your movie may go through some contreversy if you submitted it, due to the long sequence of glitched screens with weird colors, which can become a bit tiring.
EDIT: Ok, I've just found this... I may find the explanations I needed there.
Ok, I managed to reduce my movie length to 24300 Frames (06:45.00). Possible improvements include better luck with the Guard and possibly kill of the last Link closer to the center.
Here's the run.
It features an invisible and invincible Link.
Due to a series of slight route changes and somewhat better luck, the run is now 24198 frames (06:43.30). I managed to mainipulate the electro-jellyfish? to move away so that I can hookshot past it.
Here's the run. If no extra frames could be saved, that would potentially be the run I'm going to submit.
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N. Harmonik wrote:
I think a more interesting idea would be to do the Four Swords part with four players.
Agree... But to make a 4 player run you need 4 GBAs linked to each other in a network. I am not sure if VBA supports that locally or in the movie files. I tried to use VBA to do a local linked game in Zelda - Oracle of Ages / Zelda - Oracle of Seasons and I remember failing horribly.
Definitely, but too bad that VBA-Link doesn't support rerecording.
Anyway, for most of the movie, I used the addresses:
*030038F0 - Vertical Position
*030038F4 - Horizontal Position
*030031EF - Guard's Direction
For the last one, these are the values:
0 - Right
1 - Left
2 - Down
3 - Up
If the guard can be mainipulated to have a value of 0 earlier, then the run could be improved.
The coordinates:
63816,878 - The stairs in Ganon's Castle
1072,6912 - The "cursed" room
5669,7071 - Where I used the Hookshot
4479,5489 - Credit Activation
I got an idea that might be interesting. I noticed the current run completely skips the sword, and performs ACE. I'm curious if it would be possible to make a run that skips the sword, and beats as much as possible (including Palace of 4 Swords).
The problem is you basically need OoB glitches to even skip the sword (and enter the optional Palace), so I have no idea how would one make a coherent category that won't just skip almost everything (ie. get boss key in 1 dungeon, then OoB to other dungeon boss rooms and unlock the boss door + OoB skip Ganon like in past runs).
Any thoughts on this?
(Note I didn't optimize movement and pixelporting once I go indoors for the last time as I need to fix RNG before worrying about anything inside)
Link to video
I'm exhausted. Spent about 9 hours so far redoing it completely and polishing it as a fresh TAS as VBA is so inaccurate by today's standards that it's like apples and oranges.
So there was a major desync from that, nothing even worth even toying with because it's so far off I couldn't even add some frames here and there to make it work without making a huge jumbled mess. So I started over and did it by hand, largely referencing Tompa's VBM file in plaintext (with plans to credit unless he seriously objects).
Also tried copying and pasting section by section but even that was too far off. So frame by frame it was... some sections it ends up near exact, some I had to come up with new solutions without losing frames.
I do also think I got a faster pixelport in 2 spots, but I haven't timed it yet. I also made it out of the "sword room" a few frames faster, even with the timing at my disadvantage, due to a movement optimization. I'm glad I'm not just relying on the language change to make a new submission.
You can see how fast VBA is running just in the first 2 seconds of the video, and obviously it just gets worse with time. However despite that still coming out way ahead.
Anyways, I gave up for now at the "hard part" as that's going to take some planning, and for some reason at this point it's getting hard to even reference what's going on because the timing seems to be even worse and obviously it's easy to lose your bearings in such a intense area.
Also curious what's going on with the items and if any different steps will be taken because it's the Japanese version and depending if they moved addresses or not.
Lastly, I need to get some RNG manipulation going as I'm pretty sure I lost a few frames not having a guard bump me in the one outdoor area, and also avoiding guards in the indoor area is obviously a timesuck.
All in due time... anybody want to help out I can co-auth. If not, I'll figure it out eventually...
Lastly, added BIOS.
Published TASes: #1, #2, #3, #4, #5, #6, #7, #8, #9, #10, #11, #12Please consider voting for me as Rookie TASer Of 2023 - Voting is in December 2023My rule is quality TASes over quantity TASes... unless I'm bored.
Hi, I read this post and it's cool you're making an updated TAS with the GBA version of ALTTP.
There was just one thing I wanted to note. You might already be aware, but from the rules for submission standards (Wiki: MovieRules#WhenTasing):
Regional differences such as text and cutscene length are not counted as improvements or time losses. Only directly comparable gameplay is counted.
So any text-speed related differences from using the Japanese version would not be taken into account for judgement. Sounds like you're already ahead in other aspects though (it's a bit difficult to tell from the comparison video alone, since it doesn't compare screen-by-screen on the actual gameplay).
Regional differences such as text and cutscene length are not counted as improvements or time losses.
That's my goal. Either way, it'll be nice to have a clean version of this without the giant text loss and the emulation issues. Hopefully with a co-author credit going to these guys, any judge would see it that way too - this one isn't a competition. But yes, I intend to save a few frames anyways! Even if it's just a token of doing so, so there's no worry about the rule.
However, it'll definitely need a special case of judgement due to the timing differences as in any other game I'd be behind even if I was ahead. (There's been several publications like that, I'm not concerned)
This game just has the luck of saving so much with the timesaves so far that it overrules the blatant emulation differences and then some, otherwise the publication would come out like any other GBA game then and now, falsely behind due to emulation issues both in terms of FPS as well as load times.
Noticing not only the lag differences in loading areas and whatnot, but the generally FPS drop is really taking its toll. I'm just glad it'll all be resolved in the judging process (hopefully).
Even from the first transistion exiting the house, where input is disabled and irrelevant and there is no potential for extra speed, measured exactly at the same starting frame AFTER movement is disabled, I'm losing 6-7 frames from between the last frame in and the first frame out, it all just being black loading screen. As for movement, I start out ahead (obviously when comparing individual levels not the massive +30 second time save) in some improvement areas, and slowly fall behind due to the FPS differences despite the input being identical at certain points. It'll be nice to have an accurate run going.
Here's what the house is doing:
Last frame inside:
First frame outside where both screens have something (7 frame difference despite starting on same exact frame):
And just for anybody reading not familiar with the GBA FPS debacle:
Published TASes: #1, #2, #3, #4, #5, #6, #7, #8, #9, #10, #11, #12Please consider voting for me as Rookie TASer Of 2023 - Voting is in December 2023My rule is quality TASes over quantity TASes... unless I'm bored.
And yes, I started in Hyrule Castle (before rescuing the princess)
Commencing to research...
First frame outside where both screens have something (7 frame difference despite starting on same exact frame):
And just for anybody reading not familiar with the GBA FPS debacle:
