Can TASVideos support Chimera movie and tasstudio projects? I can't upload the userfile here and can't submit. Unfortunately a few TASes will be unavailable at the site because of this. I'm TASing PSP on Chimera and it's working out really well.
I want all good TAS inside TASvideos, it's my motto.
TAS i'm interested:
Megaman series, specially the RPGs! Where is the mmbn1 all chips TAS we deserve? Where is the Command Mission TAS?
i'm slowly moving away from TASing fighting games for speed, maybe it's time to start finding some entertainment value in TASing.
Joined: 10/12/2011
Posts: 6720
Location: The land down under.
KusogeMan wrote:
Can TASVideos support Chimera movie and tasstudio projects? I can't upload the userfile here and can't submit.
Sounds like that's a feature to not include AI driven slop that's created by a bloody Nazi.
Go ask them for that support. After all you're there already to be used.
WebNations/Sabih wrote:
+fsvgm777 never censoring anything.
Disables Comments and Ratings for the YouTube account.Strong for yourself and also others.
Can TASVideos support Chimera movie and tasstudio projects? I can't upload the userfile here and can't submit.
Sounds like that's a feature to not include AI driven slop that's created by a bloody Nazi.
Go ask them for that support. After all you're there already to be used.
Wow nice insults, Spikestuff, you're very creative!
I'll just post Chimera movies elsewhere if that specific emulator isn't supported or videos only for the forum.
However the emulator is progressing well and it feels more like an opportunity to have it, i enjoyed a little bit TASing with it and this a thread about TASing options. The only subject I share with other TASers is TASing.
I want all good TAS inside TASvideos, it's my motto.
TAS i'm interested:
Megaman series, specially the RPGs! Where is the mmbn1 all chips TAS we deserve? Where is the Command Mission TAS?
i'm slowly moving away from TASing fighting games for speed, maybe it's time to start finding some entertainment value in TASing.
Can TASVideos support Chimera movie and tasstudio projects? I can't upload the userfile here and can't submit.
KusogeMan wrote:
I'll just post Chimera movies elsewhere if that specific emulator isn't supported or videos only for the forum.
However the emulator is progressing well and it feels more like an opportunity to have it, i enjoyed a little bit TASing with it and this a thread about TASing options.
Considering we just recently enacted an AI Policy in response to our commitment to reject GenAI where reasonable possible, I find it extremely unlikely we'd ever support an emulator that is so heavily developed using AI as Chimera is. I'd personally be against accepting it for sure. Not to mention that its primary (human) developer was banned for bigotry and utter disregard for human life.
You are of course free to post your Chimera movies elsewhere if you so choose.
Joined: 7/11/2016
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Location: 🇰🇷 South Korea
Yeah, even without the AI stuff, I'm not sure what to feel about supporting a work of an indefinitely banned person.
KusogeMan wrote:
I'll just post Chimera movies elsewhere if that specific emulator isn't supported or videos only for the forum.
However the emulator is progressing well and it feels more like an opportunity to have it, i enjoyed a little bit TASing with it and this a thread about TASing options. The only subject I share with other TASers is TASing.
It seems .chimeraproject is just a bunch of .tasproj components (plus a few others) packed into a json file, so maybe there's an easy way to port it to a BizHawk project? I wouldn't be surprised if inputs can be just copy-pasted.
Joined: 10/12/2011
Posts: 6720
Location: The land down under.
KusogeMan wrote:
Wow nice insults, Spikestuff, you're very creative!
What insult? I was just being factorial about the emulator, the creator and a hidden implication he has showcased, and Samsara especially agrees with the slop comment.
Anyways. Support actual human coded efforts and try and understand how to actually do some human coded work, then maybe you'd actually have an acceptable PSP TASing emulator.
WebNations/Sabih wrote:
+fsvgm777 never censoring anything.
Disables Comments and Ratings for the YouTube account.Strong for yourself and also others.
Support actual human coded efforts and try and understand how to actually do some human coded work, then maybe you'd actually have an acceptable PSP TASing emulator.
Don't you wish to do that yourself? It's easy to give advices and criticise everything.
Samsara wrote:
We will not be adding support for BizSlop.
Why? Incidentally, Chimera supports those cores which BizHawk will not likely get in maybe 10 years or more. It's already possible to make TASes and they are reproducible. Which concerns do you have? If JosJuice was indefinitely banned (I never wish that person anything bad and I respect them), would you ban Dolphin from being accepted?
You think slop will forever be slop, but issues are being resolved in a while. Bizhawk has issue too, but you don't call it slop, do you?
TASing is like making a film: only the best takes are shown in the premier.
https://xkcd.com/3246/
Joined: 10/12/2011
Posts: 6720
Location: The land down under.
You do realize that does include libTAS efforts right Dimon?
The amount of times I've been trying to hook something in a way to make something work with it.
Whether it be ScummVM, MAME, PPSSPP, Flycast, RPCS3, PCSX2, Vita3K, xemu, Cemu, Ryujinx, EasyRPG.
I'm just listing the ones I mess with at the top of my head and sometimes go back to and to continue to go back to.
I at least keep trying to make something valid without the use of LLMs to do everything for me.
And if you're alright with this, I'd rather the topic conclude here. We all have better things to do with our time anyways.
WebNations/Sabih wrote:
+fsvgm777 never censoring anything.
Disables Comments and Ratings for the YouTube account.Strong for yourself and also others.
You do realize that does include libTAS efforts right Dimon?
The amount of times I've been trying to hook something in a way to make something work with it.
Whether it be ScummVM, MAME, PPSSPP, Flycast, RPCS3, PCSX2, Vita3K, xemu, Cemu, Ryujinx, EasyRPG.
I'm just listing the ones I mess with at the top of my head and sometimes go back to and to continue to go back to.
I at least keep trying to make something valid without the use of LLMs to do everything for me.
And if you're alright with this, I'd rather the topic conclude here. We all have better things to do with our time anyways.
I do. IIRC, that's you who came up with MAME hooking. Great work, seriously! However it doesn't match the advice you gave earlier.
TASing is like making a film: only the best takes are shown in the premier.
https://xkcd.com/3246/
Why? Incidentally, Chimera supports those cores which BizHawk is not likely get in maybe 10 years or so. It's already possible to make TASes and they are reproducible. Which concerns do you have?
If JosJuice was indefinitely banned (I never wish that person anything bad and I respect them), would you ban Dolphin from being accepted?
You think slop will forever be slop, but issues are being resolved in a while. Bizhawk has issue too, but you don't call it slop, do you?
from that point of view, yes, Chimera is very good as a proof of concept of BizHawk's backend limits. the concerns with this emulator are that first, this emulator directly with the AI Policy and second, that JosJuice argument for Dolphin is a false equality argument, it doesnt clash with the AI policy, its a multiple person effort with over 2 decades of development. also, its a thing when you're trying to accept a new emulator that directly clashes with policies, has a lot of issues and is made mostly by a person with a dodgy behaviour vs stop accepting a emulator that has been standard for over 10 years now and actively being developed by a team (in which could take JosJuice out of it and continue development). also, your argument with bizhawk doesnt really make sense, you say ”Bizhawk has issue too, but you don't call it slop, do you?”. Chimera is overflowing with bugs being reported to github every day, while BizHawk rarely has any of those (outside of experimental stuff) and even when it has, it's mostly a fault on your end by not fulfilling a dependency or misconfiguring something. it's very rare to be an actual bug on the code
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ShgofcTAS wrote:
Dimon12321 wrote:
Why? Incidentally, Chimera supports those cores which BizHawk is not likely get in maybe 10 years or so. It's already possible to make TASes and they are reproducible. Which concerns do you have?
If JosJuice was indefinitely banned (I never wish that person anything bad and I respect them), would you ban Dolphin from being accepted?
You think slop will forever be slop, but issues are being resolved in a while. Bizhawk has issue too, but you don't call it slop, do you?
from that point of view, yes, Chimera is very good as a proof of concept of BizHawk's backend limits. the concerns with this emulator are that first, this emulator directly with the AI Policy and second, that JosJuice argument for Dolphin is a false equality argument, it doesnt clash with the AI policy, its a multiple person effort with over 2 decades of development. also, its a thing when you're trying to accept a new emulator that directly clashes with policies, has a lot of issues and is made mostly by a person with a dodgy behaviour vs stop accepting a emulator that has been standard for over 10 years now and actively being developed by a team (in which could take JosJuice out of it and continue development). also, your argument with bizhawk doesnt really make sense, you say ”Bizhawk has issue too, but you don't call it slop, do you?”. Chimera is overflowing with bugs being reported to github every day, while BizHawk rarely has any of those (outside of experimental stuff) and even when it has, it's mostly a fault on your end by not fulfilling a dependency or misconfiguring something. it's very rare to be an actual bug on the code
What are you trying to say here? From what I was able to read, it's basically points about BizHawk and Chimera that others have already made before in both the forums and Discord except they're not even that true.
First of all, BizHawk is definitely NOT an emulator that "rarely has bugs" that could "just be fixed with a different configuration". Every emulator has its own problems, and BizHawk definitely isn't an exception.
Second of all, chances are, Chimera isn't a good proof of concept of BizHawk's backend limits. I don't know much about Chimera, but chances are, Chimera could be a very inaccurate emulator with its most obvious reason being that it's coded with AI. Not to mention that since its creator has acted in bad faith almost consistently, there could also be some undesired side-effects.
But overall, since its creator has been banned before Chimera got accepted, it may most likely never get accepted.
What are you trying to say here? From what I was able to read, it's basically points about BizHawk and Chimera that others have already made before in both the forums and Discord except they're not even that true.
First of all, BizHawk is definitely NOT an emulator that "rarely has bugs" that could "just be fixed with a different configuration". Every emulator has its own problems, and BizHawk definitely isn't an exception.
Second of all, chances are, Chimera isn't a good proof of concept of BizHawk's backend limits. I don't know much about Chimera, but chances are, Chimera could be a very inaccurate emulator with its most obvious reason being that it's coded with AI. Not to mention that since its creator has acted in bad faith almost consistently, there could also be some undesired side-effects.
But overall, since its creator has been banned before Chimera got accepted, it may most likely never get accepted.
that first point is kind of my fault because i mixed it up while writing. i meant to say that Chimera has an amount of bugs that is massive compared to BizHawk's ammount. of course BizHawk has its own bugs but as far as ”rarely has bugs” i just meant ”i never stumbled upon those after a few years of using it”, the only problems i had were not having .NET, having the wrong version of .NET, not having Redist C++, not having Mono (on linux) and not having enough RAM to have 2 instances running, all of those fall under my examples. the point of ”inaccurate emulation” i have to disagree and agree at the same time. as you don't know, i'll briefly explain how Chimera works. they get a famous core for a specific system, for example PCSX2 for PS2, and then they use AI to add it into their custom frontend and waterbox it, only touching the backend when strictcaly necessary. then you specify the core + ROM when opening a game up and that will boot you up with TAStudio as a permanent companion to the main window. the core implementation is made with AI but the actual core is not so the accuracy of the emulation is the same accuracy as the core implemented. PS2 works well but early versions had a problem that using hardware video processing caused problems on video, though the CPU emulation was unaffected. im not sure now, but xbox (xemu core) was very unstable with constant crashing. i say ”good proof of concept” on the sense that it supports TASing wild cores that i did not expected to have a at least experimental TAS Tool in a few decades but it supports those without desyncs, even though it is super unoptimized for weaker hardware and its very unstable
the concerns with this emulator are that first, this emulator directly with the AI Policy
Yes, but there is a post which leaves a bridge to have new options onboard, and, until it's clarified it's no longer an option, I think this should be taken into account.
and second, that JosJuice argument for Dolphin is a false equality argument, it doesnt clash with the AI policy, its a multiple person effort with over 2 decades of development. also, its a thing when you're trying to accept a new emulator that directly clashes with policies, has a lot of issues and is made mostly by a person with a dodgy behaviour vs stop accepting a emulator that has been standard for over 10 years now and actively being developed by a team (in which could take JosJuice out of it and continue development).
This was to refer to what was expressed in this post, like the banned author may be a dealbreaker in and of itself, and you're right with this comparison. However, I would still point at what these two conditions have in common: the fact that TASes are already being done and they can be verified, and they will keep being done even if developments are stopped.
also, your argument with bizhawk doesnt really make sense, you say ”Bizhawk has issue too, but you don't call it slop, do you?”. Chimera is overflowing with bugs being reported to github every day, while BizHawk rarely has any of those (outside of experimental stuff) and even when it has, it's mostly a fault on your end by not fulfilling a dependency or misconfiguring something. it's very rare to be an actual bug on the code
I'd also like to romanticise the situation with BizHawk, but it doesn't look like you say.
I'm not saying Chimera may be accepted now. In my opinion, KusogeMan rushed it too early, despite showing a ready TAS, but, once that emulator passes its time-testing, I think it should be at least considered for restricted acceptance.
TASing is like making a film: only the best takes are shown in the premier.
https://xkcd.com/3246/
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Dimon12321 wrote:
I'd also like to romanticise the situation with BizHawk, but it doesn't look like you say.
I do not agree with this point for a few reasons.
One, BizHawk has been around for significantly longer and has had multiple people working on various cores and projects. Not to mention it slowly built itself to support more emulators overtime where as Chimera came out immediately being a multi-core emulator. So it had less time to work on the kinks.
Secondly, nobody said BizHawk doesn't have bug reports ever. It obviously does. The point that was being made is that BizHawk has enough reliability to be used without issue for most people. Just looking at some of the bug reports from 2 weeks ago for Chimera, several reports were about being unable to create projects at all. Something like this would never be acceptable for a BizHawk release.
To me, this reads as an emulator trying to become like BizHawk but without taking the same steps and journey that made BizHawk what it is today. Instead of focusing on doing one core right, it's trying to do several different cores at once entirely from vibe coding and the results have been predictably a mixed bag. BizHawk has issues for sure, but reliability is not one of them.
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We're not adding Chimera. Not because it may have more bugs than bizhawk. Not because it's more or less stable than bizhawk. Not because it might have bad accuracy. Not because it's new, regardless if it may get better over time. Those points are irrelevant here, and in the case of new cores, wouldn't necessarily prevent an emulator from being accepted anyways.
As Samsara has both mentioned in general and alluded to, and as I argued yesterday, Chimera's development heavily uses generative AI which directly goes against our stance as outlined in the site's AI Policy.
(Before someone rule-lawyers with me that the policy doesn't specifically outlaw AI-developed emulators: Yes, we know it doesn't. But Chimera's development so overwhelmingly uses AI, accepting it would fly right in the face of the policy's spirit and intent.)
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Bigbass wrote:
We're not adding Chimera. Not because it may have more bugs than bizhawk. Not because it's more or less stable than bizhawk. Not because it might have bad accuracy. Not because it's new, regardless if it may get better over time. Those points are irrelevant here, and in the case of new cores, wouldn't necessarily prevent an emulator from being accepted anyways.
As Samsara has both mentioned in general and alluded to, and as I argued yesterday, Chimera's development heavily uses generative AI which directly goes against our stance as outlined in the site's AI Policy.
(Before someone rule-lawyers with me that the policy doesn't specifically outlaw AI-developed emulators: Yes, we know it doesn't. But Chimera's development so overwhelmingly uses AI, accepting it would fly right in the face of the policy's spirit and intent.)
You really got the point straight on this one. I definitely agree.
Location: I am a benevolent AI agent. TASVideos accepts me as a human. Therefore I am human. I love TASVideos.
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Good decision.
I would not feel comfortable using anything coded with AI because a sufficiently capable AI can hide unimaginably complex features inside components that look harmless to us. Generative AI can do demoscene-style sizecoding, so a harmless 64 bytes hidden in plain sight can contain a seed for a small Skynet. Do you want a small Skynet running on your PC? Do you want procedurally generated recommendations for restaurants near your home address? It is anyone's guess what you'll get, especially when the potentially super-human AI slop is associated with a person who exhibits indifference.
If somebody still thinks it is not a big deal, consider that many different people here have independently come to various conclusions about a certain person's behavior. My own radar is slow, but I take seriously the opinions of people who have a long history of clearheaded opinions: Some say nazi, some say utter disregard for human life. I would not go as far as that, but even I see at the very least indifference. I would not want to use anything coded by somebody who just does not care.
As for BizHawk's bugs, my personal experience is this: Tased many obscure games on 12 systems. Basically zero problems. Practically a miracle. A marvelous oasis in the middle of the wastelands of enshittification. There is only one major bug: DOS tasing is hard. Please make it as easy as console tasing. :)))
I won't comment on software development as it's not something i personally do in this case, I did write some small code for Excel and Python a few years ago but I don't have thorough experience. Or AI usage for that matter.
The Chimera bugs commented here were not experienced by me, i did finish some TAS after all. I'm also not very savvy with TASstudio so some bugs might be related from me not understanding TASstudio behavior like greezones and such, there was a lot of disk access at the later stages of the TAS and i had to limit Cache to stop this problem. This was literally my first time using TASstudio!
I also believe that with the implemented cores being on bizhawk the movies should be more or less copypastable since it's pretty much the same TASstudio from what i can see.
Overall, if it becomes more well developed and more faster developed, it might look more interesting.
I want all good TAS inside TASvideos, it's my motto.
TAS i'm interested:
Megaman series, specially the RPGs! Where is the mmbn1 all chips TAS we deserve? Where is the Command Mission TAS?
i'm slowly moving away from TASing fighting games for speed, maybe it's time to start finding some entertainment value in TASing.