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Joined: 4/16/2006
Posts: 5
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Bag of Magic Food wrote:
But you didn't even jump down certain chutes...
Could you elaborate a bit more which chutes specifically that i didn't jump down? I could explain my answer better.
Why can't I myself improve on my skills just because of my silly name?
Post subject: Re: Mega Man 3 - Revised Proposal of new TAS Plan
Active player, Editor (296)
Joined: 3/8/2004
Posts: 7468
Location: Arzareth
Zerotech wrote:
utilize a NEW Jump Trick effectively that allows Mega Man to jump higher
As BagOfMagicFood already pointed out, this second-controller-assisted debug feature is not allowed on this site for this game. The first time it popped up on this site was March 2004 in this thread.
Active player (432)
Joined: 4/21/2004
Posts: 3516
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
Welcome to Nesvideos. I saw your WIP and unfortunately, I have to say that its very sloppy. For instance, your Magnet Man fight was a few seconds slow, you do some unnecessary jumping, you fire a few times too fast and this game is highly lag-sensitive so try not shooting fast as possible and there was too much lag in the beginning of Hard Man.
Nitrogenesis wrote:
Guys I come from the DidyKnogRacist communite, and you are all wrong, tihs is the run of the mileniun and everyone who says otherwise dosnt know any bater! I found this run vary ease to masturbate too!!!! Don't fuck with me, I know this game so that mean I'm always right!StupedfackincommunityTASVideoz!!!!!!
Arc wrote:
I enjoyed this movie in which hands firmly gripping a shaft lead to balls deep in multiple holes.
natt wrote:
I don't want to get involved in this discussion, but as a point of fact C# is literally the first goddamn thing on that fucking page you linked did you even fucking read it
Cooljay wrote:
Mayor Haggar and Cody are such nice people for the community. Metro City's hospitals reached an all time new record of incoming patients due to their great efforts :P
Player (20)
Joined: 10/14/2005
Posts: 317
Here are a few links to explain some of the things mentioned so far. why you should jump down the chute at frame 2140 & 12300 : falling faster why Rockman 3 (J) instead of Mega Man 3 (U): avoids ~100 frames copyright screen (I can't find the thread where this was explained) why your Magnet Man fight was suboptimal: know for how long the boss' invulnerability lasts All in all, you've shown a strong effort in this but probably missed some of the necessary techniques because you compared your frame counts only at the completion of each stage. It takes a lot of work, but you instead need to compare times for every piece of the run where you potentially could lose frames. If you hold yourself to that standard you'll gradually come to understand how to make all parts of your run as fast or faster than Vatchern's movie. As for the 2nd controller cheat, I doubt there is much demand for a run utilizing the high-jump, since it'd only be a couple minutes faster while less entertaining and less impressive. I'd recommend trying to improve the regular Rockman 3 movie, except I'm not sure how far along Vatchern and Angerfist are with the next version. Would you be interested in Mega Man 4 or 6? Those runs are also visibly improvable and I think nobody is working on them at the moment.
Active player, Editor (296)
Joined: 3/8/2004
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Location: Arzareth
I'm locking this thread. Follow-up to the existing Mega Man 3 thread. Duplicate threads for the same game are not encouraged. Ps: This image demonstrates well the advantages of the "falling faster" technique. As you see, the difference made by an individual jump is very small, but doing it consistently accumulates into clearly visible differences.
Joined: 4/16/2006
Posts: 5
Location: Melbourne, Australia
I apologize for reviving this thread, I wanted to follow up something about a thread that I've posted http://tasvideos.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=3663 As hanzou has pointed out to me in his statement Here are a few links to explain some of the things mentioned so far. why you should jump down the chute at frame 2140 & 12300 : falling faster why Rockman 3 (J) instead of Mega Man 3 (U): avoids ~100 frames copyright screen (I can't find the thread where this was explained) why your Magnet Man fight was suboptimal: know for how long the boss' invulnerability lasts All in all, you've shown a strong effort in this but probably missed some of the necessary techniques because you compared your frame counts only at the completion of each stage. It takes a lot of work, but you instead need to compare times for every piece of the run where you potentially could lose frames. If you hold yourself to that standard you'll gradually come to understand how to make all parts of your run as fast or faster than Vatchern's movie. As for the 2nd controller cheat, I doubt there is much demand for a run utilizing the high-jump, since it'd only be a couple minutes faster while less entertaining and less impressive. I'd recommend trying to improve the regular Rockman 3 movie, except I'm not sure how far along Vatchern and Angerfist are with the next version. Would you be interested in Mega Man 4 or 6? Those runs are also visibly improvable and I think nobody is working on them at the moment. Explanation of hanzou's statement (but probably missed some of the necessary techniques) I can see why now that the people don't want to use the Jump trick as people have mentioned it can devalue the game. As for the some of the techniques used in the game, The only thing I could say that is wrong is not that I can't perform the slide it's more like where I position myself to conduct a proper transition from slide to jump, It is noticiable on the 1st stage of Magnetman where that magnet pulled me back when I should have slid a bit further but I would'nt have jumped to a proper 45 Degree Angle which most of my small jumps I try to position myself to jump at a 45 Degree angle as much as possible than jumping a bit vertical and hugging the wall to complete the jump. If you do happen to look at my WIP Carefully I make sure when Megaman Jumps he lands on the edge of the Terrain thus creating a shorter jump that allows me to slide a lot sooner but instances where this maybe beneficial it can also cause some hiccups, especially if there is a ladder nearby and just happens that megaman stops his slide on one block (8 Pixels if i can calculate it correctly) before approaching the ladder. Others have pointed out that some parts of Magnetman had a static-lag and it is noticeable when I fired the 3 shots at my left when going down the ladder the 2nd time and the 3rd. I don't understand why it lagged when there isn't much objects that were visible at that time. The only thing I got fustrated is the Magnetman fight, at best it looked suboptimal as I could'nt figure out the right pattern how to make him use his Magnet Shield side by side instead he shoots a set of 3 missiles twice which prolonged the fight sequence and added about 3 seconds of the recommended fight time. I'm not 100% sure if the Rush Jet is needed or certain bosses had to be executed in order to manipulate the proper fight sequence as I could not find a clear answer as to how I can beat him effectively. The argument I like to make about the Hard Man stage was the 1st Part of the stage before going up. That I took a Clear Gamble whether I take a risk passing up the swarm of bees or take them out using the Magnet Missile. I know for certain that It will lag when I decided to pass, but how many frames to be exact that I lost I had to calculate carefully that the slide took more than 20 frames to complete it due to de-sync and how how long the lag lasts had to be justifed with the penalty bonus for de-sync would justify having to switch weapons (would take appox. 40 Frames) and getting the Weapon Refill (Min. 25 Frames). By the time I completed the 1st part of the stage It would be like something like My Frame count + Penalty Bonus comparing to the more recent Method of killing the bees and completing it and had to determine carefully if killing the bees was worth it. IMO I didn't think killing the bees was worth it at this stage. People can of course argue it but I wanted to see if the choices I've made so far were the right choice so far I kind of having mixed feelings about it.
Why can't I myself improve on my skills just because of my silly name?
Joined: 4/13/2005
Posts: 20
Location: Sweden
I watched a TAS for this game some month ago but Í can´t download it now. Last time I saw some techniques that would be fater I guess. Here and there :P. But I think Theres a new version this time. Somehow I can´t get The Mega man 3 attack to work. Some codec missed. Somehow I can watch all other TASs I have :P.. Don´t know what to do. I did new speedrun on the PAL version some weeks ago. I timed The gemini route and the magnet man route. Some one who know how much time you save on the gemini route? becuse I don´t think it is much at all.. You TASers can pull out a very fast Gemini fight though.
YEAH...
Player (84)
Joined: 3/8/2005
Posts: 973
Location: Newfoundland, Canada
ZeroTech. Me and Angerfist are already started improving my old run. Though your movie is further than us. Good luck with your run! Oh and, welcome to the TAS community.
Active player (432)
Joined: 4/21/2004
Posts: 3516
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
Zerotech, here is our wip: http://bisqwit.iki.fi/~mog/rm3ang.fcm. Feel free to compare and give us your thoughts. This WIP took us about 2 weeks to complete because I was constantly improving Vatcherns progress and he did the same and discovered a nice new zipping technique.
Nitrogenesis wrote:
Guys I come from the DidyKnogRacist communite, and you are all wrong, tihs is the run of the mileniun and everyone who says otherwise dosnt know any bater! I found this run vary ease to masturbate too!!!! Don't fuck with me, I know this game so that mean I'm always right!StupedfackincommunityTASVideoz!!!!!!
Arc wrote:
I enjoyed this movie in which hands firmly gripping a shaft lead to balls deep in multiple holes.
natt wrote:
I don't want to get involved in this discussion, but as a point of fact C# is literally the first goddamn thing on that fucking page you linked did you even fucking read it
Cooljay wrote:
Mayor Haggar and Cody are such nice people for the community. Metro City's hospitals reached an all time new record of incoming patients due to their great efforts :P
adelikat
He/Him
Emulator Coder, Expert player, Site Developer, Site Owner (3581)
Joined: 11/3/2004
Posts: 4736
Location: Tennessee
AngerFist wrote:
Zerotech, here is our wip: http://bisqwit.iki.fi/~mog/rm3ang.fcm. Feel free to compare and give us your thoughts. This WIP took us about 2 weeks to complete because I was constantly improving Vatcherns progress and he did the same and discovered a nice new zipping technique.
that link gives me the infamous 404
It's hard to look this good. My TAS projects
Joined: 3/31/2005
Posts: 148
Location: Colorado
ditch the period at the end. . .
Do not try to bend the spoon, that's impossible. Instead only try to realize the truth. What Truth? There is nospoon. Then you will see it is not the spoon that changes, it is only yourself
Active player (277)
Joined: 5/29/2004
Posts: 5712
Hey, you should have shot while you were falling into MagnetMan's room! Find that window of opportunity! And did you check to see if the game waits for the explosion balls to fly off the screen before letting RockMan jump? Maybe you need to center the bosses more!
put yourself in my rocketpack if that poochie is one outrageous dude
adelikat
He/Him
Emulator Coder, Expert player, Site Developer, Site Owner (3581)
Joined: 11/3/2004
Posts: 4736
Location: Tennessee
Bag of Magic Food wrote:
And did you check to see if the game waits for the explosion balls to fly off the screen before letting RockMan jump? Maybe you need to center the bosses more!
no, the boss position doesn't matter in this game, but megaman's does since you can't move once the boss is destroyed.
It's hard to look this good. My TAS projects
Player (84)
Joined: 3/8/2005
Posts: 973
Location: Newfoundland, Canada
I checked many different frames to destroy magnetman, and this came up the best so....
Joined: 8/1/2004
Posts: 178
AngerFist wrote:
Zerotech, here is our wip: http://bisqwit.iki.fi/~mog/rm3ang.fcm
Would it be faster to shoot your gun once or twice, or however many times, while falling down from the latter in the room with the two eyeball enemies to your right (a few rooms after protoman)? There's some lag, so shooting them as soon as possible might reduce that.
<^>v AB X LR s
Active player (432)
Joined: 4/21/2004
Posts: 3516
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
Oddity wrote:
AngerFist wrote:
Zerotech, here is our wip: http://bisqwit.iki.fi/~mog/rm3ang.fcm
Would it be faster to shoot your gun once or twice, or however many times, while falling down from the latter in the room with the two eyeball enemies to your right (a few rooms after protoman)?
No my dear sir. Unfortunately, your projectiles would cause even more lag shooting at them while you are falling down.
Nitrogenesis wrote:
Guys I come from the DidyKnogRacist communite, and you are all wrong, tihs is the run of the mileniun and everyone who says otherwise dosnt know any bater! I found this run vary ease to masturbate too!!!! Don't fuck with me, I know this game so that mean I'm always right!StupedfackincommunityTASVideoz!!!!!!
Arc wrote:
I enjoyed this movie in which hands firmly gripping a shaft lead to balls deep in multiple holes.
natt wrote:
I don't want to get involved in this discussion, but as a point of fact C# is literally the first goddamn thing on that fucking page you linked did you even fucking read it
Cooljay wrote:
Mayor Haggar and Cody are such nice people for the community. Metro City's hospitals reached an all time new record of incoming patients due to their great efforts :P
Skilled player (1399)
Joined: 5/31/2004
Posts: 1821
I think I found a better way to start the Protoman battle at the Hardman stage: movie If you hold on to the ladder the last frame before the screen scrolls, you are able to perform a jump when entering the protoman room. This enables you to get at the top platform. Being at the top platform at the start will enable megaman to slide underneath the first jump of protoman, so I think this will save some frames (maybe even up to half a second). Note that protoman still spawns at the same frame.
Active player (432)
Joined: 4/21/2004
Posts: 3516
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
Baxter wrote:
I think I found a better way to start the Protoman battle at the Hardman stage: movie
*Bows To Almighty One Baxter .aka my superior partner* ;) EDIT: Thank God you discovered this now and not when we are like hundred stages ahead :) Finalfighter tends to do that!
Nitrogenesis wrote:
Guys I come from the DidyKnogRacist communite, and you are all wrong, tihs is the run of the mileniun and everyone who says otherwise dosnt know any bater! I found this run vary ease to masturbate too!!!! Don't fuck with me, I know this game so that mean I'm always right!StupedfackincommunityTASVideoz!!!!!!
Arc wrote:
I enjoyed this movie in which hands firmly gripping a shaft lead to balls deep in multiple holes.
natt wrote:
I don't want to get involved in this discussion, but as a point of fact C# is literally the first goddamn thing on that fucking page you linked did you even fucking read it
Cooljay wrote:
Mayor Haggar and Cody are such nice people for the community. Metro City's hospitals reached an all time new record of incoming patients due to their great efforts :P
Skilled player (1399)
Joined: 5/31/2004
Posts: 1821
I just did a test, on how much faster killing protoman with this is... it turned out to be 40 frames faster :D
Joined: 7/4/2005
Posts: 714
Location: Albuqueruqe, New Mexico
ha, i didnt know about the 2nd controller thing. Its funny how things turn out so bad in such a situation. http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/1260/Rockman%203%20-%20Dr.%20Wily%20no%20Saigo%21%20%28J%29.fcm
Change my sig. again, and I will murder your pet fish.
Joined: 5/27/2005
Posts: 465
Location: Turku, Finland
GuanoBowl, that's quite funny :D ...but I still don't aprove using the 2nd controller trick (unless you are making pure entertainment like the one you showd)
Which run should I encode next? :)
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Joined: 3/8/2004
Posts: 7468
Location: Arzareth
Baxter wrote:
I just did a test, on how much faster killing protoman with this is... it turned out to be 40 frames faster :D
Very nice finding :)
Active player (432)
Joined: 4/21/2004
Posts: 3516
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
Hello everybody. My name is Mr. Nasirian and I've teamed up with Mr. Vatcher to try improving the current published run. Here is: Our WIP. Ok bye bye now! Edit: We both did Magnet Man and Hard Man while I completed Top Man and Shadow Man. My partner just finished Sparky Man.
Nitrogenesis wrote:
Guys I come from the DidyKnogRacist communite, and you are all wrong, tihs is the run of the mileniun and everyone who says otherwise dosnt know any bater! I found this run vary ease to masturbate too!!!! Don't fuck with me, I know this game so that mean I'm always right!StupedfackincommunityTASVideoz!!!!!!
Arc wrote:
I enjoyed this movie in which hands firmly gripping a shaft lead to balls deep in multiple holes.
natt wrote:
I don't want to get involved in this discussion, but as a point of fact C# is literally the first goddamn thing on that fucking page you linked did you even fucking read it
Cooljay wrote:
Mayor Haggar and Cody are such nice people for the community. Metro City's hospitals reached an all time new record of incoming patients due to their great efforts :P
Joined: 11/13/2005
Posts: 1587
Hello. My name is Mr. Reichardt (nobody can pronounce or spell that right) and I'm very pleased that you uploaded your WIP :) Thank you.
Player (84)
Joined: 3/8/2005
Posts: 973
Location: Newfoundland, Canada
For anyone wondering about the final 3, since we have no actual "weakness" for either one of them, the best way is to fight Needleman first. And here is our explanation. We kind of need Rush Jet and Needle for the snakeman level. Rush jet for that last room. without it we would have to wait a while for those hovering platforms. And if we started Gemini first, we would gain nothing from the route change in the first place. Yet, if we beat Needle first, we can use Shadow against needleman, use rushjet in snake, use needle against snake, and have snake for the Geminiman fight(gaining alot of frames since it takes 4 hits) and have rushjet to zip in gemini level.
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